Pam W Posted October 25, 2017 Share Posted October 25, 2017 I have no idea what's going on but I have to say that Peaks (aka Alan) were there for me when I first started making candles; this website dating back to 2005 gave me much needed info on where to start and how to go about it. Whatever the issues are between Alan, Keystone and any replacement oils, Alan will always have my deepest thanks for any and all help provided throughout the years. There are some oils that I'm afraid I won't be able to get but that is a small price to pay for the info and guidance that I've received from Peaks over the years. I will go with the flow but will always be thankful for this website provided by Alan and his staff. If Alan is in business going forward, he will always get my business basically because of the many years of quality products and guidance provided by him and the Craftserver website. I will not enter into any speculation as to what's going on behind the scenes............ 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moonshine Posted October 25, 2017 Share Posted October 25, 2017 41 minutes ago, Pam W said: I have no idea what's going on but I have to say that Peaks (aka Alan) were there for me when I first started making candles; this website dating back to 2005 gave me much needed info on where to start and how to go about it. Whatever the issues are between Alan, Keystone and any replacement oils, Alan will always have my deepest thanks for any and all help provided throughout the years. There are some oils that I'm afraid I won't be able to get but that is a small price to pay for the info and guidance that I've received from Peaks over the years. I will go with the flow but will always be thankful for this website provided by Alan and his staff. If Alan is in business going forward, he will always get my business basically because of the many years of quality products and guidance provided by him and the Craftserver website. I will not enter into any speculation as to what's going on behind the scenes............ Peak - Alan has nothing to do with this forum anymore - if he had it would of went bye bye when he closed his doors I guarantee it This has been under new ownership for some time now by TallTayl 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jcandleattic Posted October 25, 2017 Share Posted October 25, 2017 8 hours ago, moonshine said: Peak - Alan has nothing to do with this forum anymore - if he had it would of went bye bye when he closed his doors I guarantee it This has been under new ownership for some time now by TallTayl And before that, it was Vicki. She had it on her own for at least a year or 2 before TT took over also. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bfroberts Posted October 25, 2017 Share Posted October 25, 2017 All I really want is some Tuscan Nights.......without all the drama. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TallTayl Posted October 25, 2017 Share Posted October 25, 2017 15 minutes ago, Jcandleattic said: And before that, it was Vicki. She had it on her own for at least a year or 2 before TT took over also. Yes, Vicky owned it for about a year. We have been a separate entity from peak for quite a long time. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TallTayl Posted October 25, 2017 Share Posted October 25, 2017 Just now, bfroberts said: All I really want is some Tuscan Nights.......without all the drama. I know right? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lumoscandles Posted October 25, 2017 Share Posted October 25, 2017 18 hours ago, TallTayl said: Remembering back through the sordid Facebook argument, Nachelle works for the fragrance house that supplied peak. Talk about a conflict of interest! sure they sold the "codes" to keystone, but that means nothing when you are the one who creates the codes in the first place. Dis.gust.ing. I don't know what is going on with Peak and Keystone, but I do want to clarify that Nachelle did not and does not work for a fragrance supplier of Peak. The bit in the Facebook argument was that she was trying to open her own fragrance company while she worked at Peak, but it never got off the ground from what I understand. Just wanted to point that out since I know for a fact that the companies that supplied Peak's fragrances before are completely separate entities and what they choose to do with those fragrance formulas is up to those companies I would suppose. So if Keystone does have the codes, I believe it would be up to the manufacturers whether to continue selling them or not. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TallTayl Posted October 26, 2017 Share Posted October 26, 2017 9 hours ago, lumoscandles said: I don't know what is going on with Peak and Keystone, but I do want to clarify that Nachelle did not and does not work for a fragrance supplier of Peak. The bit in the Facebook argument was that she was trying to open her own fragrance company while she worked at Peak, but it never got off the ground from what I understand. Just wanted to point that out since I know for a fact that the companies that supplied Peak's fragrances before are completely separate entities and what they choose to do with those fragrance formulas is up to those companies I would suppose. So if Keystone does have the codes, I believe it would be up to the manufacturers whether to continue selling them or not. Connecting the publicly available dots, back in December of 2016 she incorporated National Fragrance Corporation. Then that was followed up by forming Peak Fragrance Company, an entity within National Fragrance Corporation. So it is is easy to see that the plan to form a new fragrance company was in motion for a long while before the sudden closure of Peak Candle Supply. It is also very possible that "National Fragrance Company" holds all of the fragrance codes, licensing them for whatever period of time to Keystone or anyone else they please. It is possible keystone purchases the fragrances directly through the new National Fragrance Company or Peak. Who knows how their business model is set up. I don't particularly care. As someone who worked a couple of decades in a former life through many mergers, acquisitions, liquidations, etc. the dots are simple to connect. The original brand entity, Peak Candle Supply, liquidated its inventory assets through Keystone Candle Supply. A new venture called Peak Fragrance Company was formed, and is using its own original codes now held by the new mother brand. All of this drama could have been prevented had it not been for the public outbursts on social media. All brands associated with this are now stained, including the vulture fragranciers who looked to cash in on the closing. All Peak had to do was announce that their Candle Supply line of business was closing. Anyone who shopped there knew for over a year THAT was coming. Geez, those continuous, long and catalog-wide stock outs were a dead giveaway. They could have prevented the panic by ensuring the plan to keep supplying their unique fragrances would continue and provide a pathway for their customers to continue. instead, we all know what happened. And it caused a service disruption within their customer base. For some it was as devistating as when EcoSoya suddenly without sufficient warning stopped supplying their wax, then missing promised deadlines only to show up to market with a sub par product. Everyone learned a valuable Economics 101 lesson: Availability of substitutes. There are other waxes. There are other fragrance providers. We will survive, it is just uncomfortable for a time as we test and adapt. The memory of the discomfort stays pretty fresh in our minds forever though. Once brand trust is gone, it is expensive to restore, if it even can be restored at all. 10 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lumoscandles Posted October 26, 2017 Share Posted October 26, 2017 I wasn't trying to start an argument, I was just trying to clarify some of the speculation based on my personal experience working for Peak for 8 years... I know what fragrance companies supplied Peak's fragrances, and I know that none of them were affiliated with Peak or its owners. None of the fragrances sold by Peak were created or manufactured by Peak, except perhaps any new ones that potentially came out between December 2016 when National Fragrance was formulated by Nachelle and July 2017 when Peak closed. I'm just trying to say that the fragrances that we all know and love were formulated, manufactured, and sold by independent companies, so as far as Keystone being able to continue carrying them will depend on whether or not Peak had any agreement with those companies as to their proprietorship of those fragrances or not. If not, then I believe it will be up to those companies to decide whether they want to sell them to Keystone. That's all. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TallTayl Posted October 26, 2017 Share Posted October 26, 2017 Understood. I'm not trying to argue either. what is all so weird is the he said/she said and contradictions right from the owners. Transparency is a good thing, especially when it impacts livelihoods. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Candybee Posted October 26, 2017 Share Posted October 26, 2017 Well said! Seems this all could have been handled better with some reassurances to the public. I am keeping my fingers crossed that Keystone will be able to handle Peaks supplies and keep them. I would hate to see them start dropping FOs like some companies have done in the past after they promised to sell said oils. I think all of us have been burned one time or another and are wary at first when FOs change hands. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coffeebean Posted October 26, 2017 Share Posted October 26, 2017 Either way I'm still buying my so called "Peaks" oils from Keystone. 4 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marleigha Posted October 27, 2017 Share Posted October 27, 2017 On 10/25/2017 at 10:07 AM, bfroberts said: All I really want is some Tuscan Nights.......without all the drama. @bfroberts I'm with you. Its so unfortunate that this has happened. I personally just don't like he way it was handled professionally or morally for that matter. In any event, https://keystonecandlesupplies.com/products/copy-of-harvest-moon-peak?variant=1534522097691. The good news... It can only improve from here. 😇 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lorelei Posted October 29, 2017 Share Posted October 29, 2017 I really want Winter Wonderland. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bfroberts Posted October 29, 2017 Share Posted October 29, 2017 35 minutes ago, Lorelei said: I really want Winter Wonderland. You and me both. I NEED Tuscan Nights, like yesterday, but I won't order until I can get Winter Wonderland too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pam W Posted October 29, 2017 Share Posted October 29, 2017 I am addicted to Peak's Black Canyon and will buy it where ever it is available. That's one oil that I have never been able to duplicate or find at another supplier. And I am extremely grateful that the Craftserver forum is still active. The long-time members of this forum have contributed so much to newcomers, never hesitating to give valuable info along the way without flipping the finger at a newcomer while claiming proprietary issues like some other forums. I want to give thanks to various members that have helped me throughout the years but there's just to many of them to list without missing someone so I will move forward and focus on the crafts that I love..........candles, B&b, etc. Whatever the issues are/were with Peaks, I have to express my heartfelt thanks to Alan, Nachelle and their staff for the many years of service and guidance. Where ever their lives take them, I wish them well. 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cindym Posted October 29, 2017 Share Posted October 29, 2017 I'm with you Pam, Candle Tech and Peaks, specifically both Alan and Nachelle were so good to many of us and encouraged and helped us in so many ways in the early days. I probably would not have been in business without them. And their fragrances were and will be awesome always, I mean if you look at facebook, everybody who dupes fo's is trying to dupe Peak's, there is a reason for that, because everyone wants s piece of that pie. I did not read anywhere that Keystone bought the rights to Peak's formulas, what I read was that they bought a warehouse full of stock from Peak's. I don't recall them ever saying that they had any exclusive at all. I think that was a misunderstanding. They knew exactly what they were doing when they bought that warehouse full of inventory, they were buying quality product because they knew they could profit from it. Nothing wrong with that, it's business. I closed my business about 8 years ago in the middle of a divorce, it is not an easy thing to do, everyone in that situation makes mistakes, some of my customers were disappointed , some orders I was unable to fufill, it happens, no one ever means for it to happen, but sometimes things have to erupt for the needed change to happen. Everyone survives. There is no morality at issue, being human can be hard . Divorce is a hard thing to get through. It is very hard to separate things , business and personal, when both of those things are so tied up in each other. The world is not perfect. I have a lot of compassion for all involved in this situation. For me, the old board will always be here in this board, losing Vicky was a huge blow, the history here for many of us is very near and dear. I hope that Alan can make a go of things, Peak's was and awesome business, hopefully , in it's new form it will be again, I wish all of them the best. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trappeur Posted October 30, 2017 Share Posted October 30, 2017 Not to drag on this thread, the only thing I can say is I personally spoke to the owner of Keystone and she told me that she DID buy the codes for Peaks oils and the oils they are carrying and will carry are NOT dupes but will be made from the codes. Trappeur 6 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
candlebug Posted October 30, 2017 Share Posted October 30, 2017 That is good to know Trappeur! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coffeebean Posted November 1, 2017 Share Posted November 1, 2017 I too was over and bought some Peak oils and spoke with Pam. She reassured me that she did buy the codes and will be carrying their oils. 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Faerywren Posted November 1, 2017 Share Posted November 1, 2017 On 10/24/2017 at 3:55 PM, Moonstar said: I never purchased anything from Moonworks. So they went through something similar ? Who bought their FO's ? Moonworks owner, Rhonda, was just notorious for up and closing her business. Then re-opening. Then re-closing. FragranceBuddy has most of her fragrances and I know Pure Fragrance was carrying some. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mulberrysoap Posted November 2, 2017 Share Posted November 2, 2017 I really loved Moonworks Scarlet Moon and would love to be able to buy it again even direct from the fragrance house!!! As much as I understand the love for Alan etc, why did he say that Keystone practically capitalised on them closing by buying the stock? If Keystone had bought the codes ( Keystone need to say that in public). It is just so messy when it really didn't have to be. 1 thing I would also say is that it is good people can still find a way to buy the fragrances, unlike the dastardly Scent Works, that sucked up to all the members of the Dish and other places and then just disappeared giving everyone the big FU#k You. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moonstar Posted November 2, 2017 Share Posted November 2, 2017 (edited) 20 hours ago, coffeebean said: I too was over and bought some Peak oils and spoke with Pam. She reassured me that she did buy the codes and will be carrying their oils. Im glad to hear between you + @Trappeur calling to speak to Pam at Keystone What I still can't understand is why on earth would Alan go on record to say he still owns the codes + Keystone just bought his old stock. I just don't get it.Can someone truly be that deceitful & cunning ? Maybe Im just naive and think because I would never do something like that others wouldn't either IDK ??? Sorry to bring this up again. It really is dumb + childish on Peaks part. Edited November 2, 2017 by Moonstar 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TallTayl Posted November 2, 2017 Share Posted November 2, 2017 6 hours ago, mulberrysoap said: I really loved Moonworks Scarlet Moon and would love to be able to buy it again even direct from the fragrance house!!! When she closed up for the last time she shared what each scent was and where she got it. I don't remember seeing that one, but it could be listed somewhere... this is the page from the wayback machine: https://web.archive.org/web/20130214060453/http://moonworkscollection.com:80/item_38/Scarlet-Moon--FP200.php it sounds right up my alley. you can also call PFO, and ask if they will do a special buy. If enough people want it they will have it made and bring it in. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paperbackstash Posted November 3, 2017 Share Posted November 3, 2017 I could be wrong but it sounds to me more like Keystone is being the more honest company/victim in this situation. I doubt that they would have publically advertised buying the stock and formulas before stocking their site with them (one, it opens up to too much legal issues if they were outright lying) - to me they seemed to be a less popular supplier who saw a chance to get a good jump in their business when they bid and won from popular Peaks, who was "closing." They put the work into hurrying to get the oils up, advertised it, and recreated their entire site to accommodate and start fresh with enthusiasm. I also notice that Alan is now saying they have free shipping for the "new" Peaks Quote And now, here's something we hope you'll really like (rocky/bullwinkle). FREE shipping for orders over $30. Otherwise, a flat-rate of $4.99 for USPS Priority. , making it ten dollars lower than the free shipping Keystone has always offered on their site, probably as an incentive for people to use the new Peaks oils instead of Keystone if they are on the fence right now. A shame and sad situation. I won't be buying from the new Peaks because there are too many red flags and if they really dig this, a shame. I will try out Keystone and support them however unless I learn something different. To claim all the claims they did and do such a large inventory and site overhaul is not realistic unless they were telling the truth. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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