CBeardly Posted March 16, 2017 Share Posted March 16, 2017 I was doing a search about wax stuff & this nonsense came up. I don't like fear mongering. I don't like it one bit. https://wellnessmama.com/22656/dont-use-scented-candles/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Incendia Posted March 16, 2017 Share Posted March 16, 2017 She might be on the extreme end, but she is also partially correct. There is much we simply do not know. A very recent thread here: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Candybee Posted March 16, 2017 Share Posted March 16, 2017 Most candles are paraffin? have lead core wicks? Give off more toxins than second hand smoke? Really? You bellieve any of this? It's tripe like this that gets spread around and gives candles a bad reputation. If you are going to be a chandler and a good one you should know more about how waxes are made, what they are made from, the manufacturing process, and the difference between the hype/trash talk and the facts about candles. Even if you don't know everything you should have a good working knowledge enough to be able to spot the garbage being toted as truth. 6 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CBeardly Posted March 16, 2017 Author Share Posted March 16, 2017 There's a huge difference between making wax products with the concentrated FOs & burning a candle. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
birdcharm Posted March 16, 2017 Share Posted March 16, 2017 I thought the "lead" wick thing was pretty much a dead issue in the U.S. by now -- how many years ago were they banned here? They may exist in some candles in other countries, but not in the U.S. Regarding fragrance oils, imo, when burned in a candle, I really don't think they're so bad. When making candles, we need to be careful. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Incendia Posted March 16, 2017 Share Posted March 16, 2017 2 hours ago, CBeardly said: There's a huge difference between making wax products with the concentrated FOs & burning a candle. Of course there is a difference between burning and making candles. And a difference in the affects of concentrations between straight FOs and the lesser amounts in candles.. But do we really know how "huge" that difference is? I don't think so (unless someone can share a link to some legit research). There are many variables. Not only concentrations of these chemicals, but personal candle burning practices might be considerations. How many candles does one burn at a time. In how many rooms. All day or just part of the day. In closed rooms with little/no air circulation, or on the patio. Highly scented and dyed candles, vs tighty-whities. And does one have asthma or allergies or other respiratory considerations. I choose to burn candles, as well as make them because I like them. Mine are mostly paraffin, but with some soy blended, and with dyes and scents. Most commonly I burn 3 at a time. But I am aware of keeping fresh air in the house because I know I can have a reaction. Call me a 'crunchy' (I also used to eat granola and still hug trees), but I think there are some health-related things to consider when burning candles. The woman's article was obviously over the top.. but that does not mean burning complex compounds (either soy or petroleum based) in a house poses zero risk. Man has burned candles over time. But the very nature of candles has evolved. Not only waxes and additives used, but also more recently the highly scented wax products. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TallTayl Posted March 17, 2017 Share Posted March 17, 2017 Those types of articles are often supported by people who use essential oils excessively. The multiple candle simultaneously argument is identical to the beauty bill circling the house for the last few years. The contention is women use multiple beauty products each day. How can we be sure the total amount used does not exceed safety guidelines? People who read those articles are not our customers. Focus on those who are. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
birdcharm Posted March 17, 2017 Share Posted March 17, 2017 On 3/16/2017 at 3:42 PM, Incendia said: Of course there is a difference between burning and making candles. And a difference in the affects of concentrations between straight FOs and the lesser amounts in candles.. But do we really know how "huge" that difference is? I don't think so (unless someone can share a link to some legit research). ... I don't agree that we need "legit research" to get a sense of the difference of effects from pouring, let's say, an ounce of scent into a hot pot of wax verses the distributed scent that burns off in a candle. This is like saying we can't tell the difference between drinking a shot of liquor or a few sips -- of course we know it's not the same. If someone burns several scented candles at once without any air circulation, they probably are filling a room with vapors that are not good to breathe all of the time; such as incense, a fireplace, etc. -- in moderation, it's probably not as bad as breathing smog. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TallTayl Posted March 17, 2017 Share Posted March 17, 2017 @birdcharm not to mention the offgassing of cleaning products, carpets, furniture, window treatments, clothing, etc in an average home. Even without candles the air in typical homes is less than perfect. i keep birds. Birds are notorious for ill health around candles. My boys are happy and healthy as can be. No canary in the cave problems with normal candles. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Incendia Posted March 17, 2017 Share Posted March 17, 2017 (edited) 2 hours ago, birdcharm said: I don't agree that we need "legit research"... That's not quite what I meant. And I know I'm clipping your comment out of context, so forgive me. But after reading more 'out there' on the possible dangers of burning candles, I'm of the opinion that unbiased, competent research is exactly what is needed to put the question to bed. Not the click-bait opinion piece initially linked, nor the candle associations 'vested interests' reassurances. Unfortunately there is likely to be very little interest in funding a study like this. These days there are many dangers surrounding us as others have mentioned. Many we cant escape like air pollution or exhaust fumes, others we can, like more carefully choosing our foods. When possible, it's up to us to pick and choose which things we are willing to have in our lives, with the corresponding risks that come with some of them. To do this most effectively, accurate information is important to help us make better choices. It's just not always easy to find. I'd rather err on the side of 'more' information, than 'less' and then make up my own mind. We all make many such decisions daily. I have two cats. In spite of their reputation for cleanliness, they are not, lol. I choose to keep them however because they bring me joy. But I choose not to smoke, or drive too fast. It's a matter of finding a comfortable balance in life between the two extremes of absolute perfection in health considerations, vs total obliviousness. Edited March 17, 2017 by Incendia Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scented Posted March 18, 2017 Share Posted March 18, 2017 (edited) On 3/16/2017 at 2:31 PM, birdcharm said: I thought the "lead" wick thing was pretty much a dead issue in the U.S. by now -- how many years ago were they banned here? They may exist in some candles in other countries, but not in the U.S. The lead wicks were banned for all foreign and domestic candles in 2003. The problem is that people still think the zinc wicks are lead and it's possible there are still lead ones in the states if we export from China. Remember the lead scandal with toothpaste from China? China loves lead in everything. Edited March 18, 2017 by Scented 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moonstar Posted March 18, 2017 Share Posted March 18, 2017 6 minutes ago, Scented said: The lead wicks were banned for all foreign and domestic candles in 2003. The problem is that people still think the zinc wicks are lead and it's possible there are still lead ones in the states if we export from China. Remember the lead scandal with toothpaste from China? China loves lead in everything. I wonder why they love lead .... thats a serious question by the way. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Candybee Posted March 18, 2017 Share Posted March 18, 2017 Probably because its a cheap ingredient with a lot of versatility of uses. Wonder if they still have lead based paints? 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Incendia Posted March 18, 2017 Share Posted March 18, 2017 (edited) From an article a few years old. In China, it's worse than I thought. (Bold text mine) Candybee nailed it - it's cheap and versatile. And not recognized as a threat. http://www.purelivingchina.com/residential/learning-center/lead-exposure/ Quote ... In China, lead is still prized in manufacturing because it is plentiful, cheap, malleable, and resistant to corrosion. Lead compounds are regularly added to plastics and vinyl to make them more resistant to high temperatures. Because lead is heavy, it is often added to cheap metal products to make them seem more substantial. Lead dust is sometimes added to herbal products that are sold by weight to make them heavier and increase their value. Lead may also be found in the solder connecting pipes for your home plumbing. Lead is still used in jet and low-grade fuels and can last for decades in soil. Years of unchecked industrial pollution combined with loose enforcement of environmental regulations have left China with lead-contaminated air, soil, and water. A compilation of 32 blood level studies over the past decade found that even among screened subjects who lived in areas with no lead pollution sources, over one-third of the children had lead poisoning (>100ug/dl).[4] ◾General low level of awareness about dangers of lead Despite growing awareness of air and water pollution, most Chinese (including doctors) do not recognize lead as a significant hazard. As a result, few regulations have been enacted to control for lead (outside of export controls) and no campaign exists to educate the public on the dangers. Of specific concern to foreigners is the fact that there is no consumer product safety commission and no laws mandating lead-free buildings. Do not count on the government or your landlord to protect you. Edited March 18, 2017 by Incendia 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scented Posted March 19, 2017 Share Posted March 19, 2017 10 hours ago, Moonstar said: I wonder why they love lead .... thats a serious question by the way. I was going to say ask a Chinaman, but truthfully, it is plentiful and cheap ... like sugar and food in the US ... even if it doesn't need more sugar, add it. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
glasllyn Posted March 22, 2017 Share Posted March 22, 2017 (edited) Here's what I know: Shortly after working with FOs, I began to have sore throats, a runny nose, and gastrointestinal problems. These all abate when I'm away from the chemicals for awhile. It is not a coincidence. They're irritating my body. I now wear gloves and a respirator specifically for filtering out organic chemicals, and bought a hardcore air purifier (thanks to pros in this forum). I also started working with powerful isolated aroma chemicals, and I'm a huge fan of these delightful scents, but the thing is, these chemicals are not a joke and, as others had said, no one really knows what amounts are safe to breathing in all the time. We have ZERO idea what's in the FOs we buy; they may contain any number of individual chemicals- could be ten, maybe 15. Some of them may be harmless, but some might be big-time irritants and possibly toxins. For example, one may contain a delightful scent called Timbersilk. Perfumers love it. It smells fantastic. But it's also a problem: not only is it a huge irritant to humans, but it's extremely problematic for aquatic animals. (Check the chemical info here. This site is a great reference: http://www.thegoodscentscompany.com/data/rw1020611.html). There is a whole family of musks that simply do not go away, as in never ever, and yet we may unknowingly throw their packaging in the trash or pour them down the sink and we all know where it travels then. That study Incendia referred to? There are others like that one that examined synthetic musks and the shockingly high amounts found in everyday dust in Chinese households. (Here's just one: https://www.researchgate.net/profile/Xiangying_Zeng/publication/5335783_Synthetic_musks_in_the_aquatic_environment_and_personal_care_products_in_Shanghai_China/links/00463517f1d829f0f5000000.pdf). I'm not what anyone would consider "crunchy," but I also don't want to pretend that everything is okey dokey. Ignorance is not bliss if you become sick and can't fix it. I think some people are completely misinformed and overzealous, simply picking and choosing their personal truths to suit their beliefs. Vegans will tell you it's the only way to eat, while others will tell you it's totally unnatural, and both will find data somewhere to support their claims. However, not all studies are good studies, and I wish everyone could tell the difference. Edited March 22, 2017 by glasllyn Typo Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CBeardly Posted March 22, 2017 Author Share Posted March 22, 2017 @glasllyn Do you get that ill when burning scented candles, esp. ones that you did not make? Perhaps if you do or even if you don't maybe you shouldn't be working with FOs at all since they make you so sick. I'm not saying that to be snarky. I don't think anyone should unnecessarily risk his or her health. I love the environment as much as anyone but I also understand that nothing is chemical free. That being said, maybe we should stop using vanillin too. Most people aren't chemists & would still have no idea what was in their FOs if it was written on the bottle. It would scare them even more. Dihydrogen monoxide sounds terrifying to some people. Also, it is proprietary information that companies don't want to share. I don't want to hurt aquatic animals or any animals. (I'm a vegetarian for Pete's sake. My meat & potatoes husband & I get along fine, thanks.) 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sponiebr Posted March 22, 2017 Share Posted March 22, 2017 OMG!!!!! This *really freaks me out* (lookitme! I'm freaked out!) I really can say that I've never even HEARD of this!!! This is a RARE occurrence when ANYONE can catch me off guard like that. Well... What good am I if I can't take a sucker punch once in a while? So... I'll just bear the shame and ask... What IS a "crunchy" person? (I AM assuming that "crunchy people" is plural and the singular form would be "crunchy person", but as I have NO farking idea as to what this is I very well may be wrong...) Sponiebr: take'n one for the team cuz I'm tough like that... PS: Do they come in original and extra crispy? Y'know what... SKIP IT... I want Popeye's... .<< 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Incendia Posted March 22, 2017 Share Posted March 22, 2017 (edited) Quote Aperson who is disagreeably intent on environmental matters, personal bodily simplicity, walking in the forest, etc •The term altered to pejorative as the student ethos altered and ''political correctness'' became repellent: crunchy granola: a person who is emotionally or temperamentally still living in the 1960s/ ... Crunchy | Define Crunchy at Dictionary.com As I said in a post above: "Call me a 'crunchy' (I also used to eat granola and still hug trees), but I think there are some health-related things to consider when burning candles." I would probably be better labeled 'crunchy light'. . Edited March 22, 2017 by Incendia Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
glasllyn Posted March 22, 2017 Share Posted March 22, 2017 5 hours ago, CBeardly said: @glasllyn Do you get that ill when burning scented candles, esp. ones that you did not make? Perhaps if you do or even if you don't maybe you shouldn't be working with FOs at all since they make you so sick. No, I haven't gotten sick from candles or any other scented products. I have had times when I felt like, holy crap, I need to snuff this out and open a window, but I've never felt asthmatic, nauseous or stuffy. My point is simply that we may be a bit laissez faire about the chemicals we're using, and maybe not giving them as much thought as we should. Honestly, it wouldn't have occurred to me had I not felt so sick and I have have been dismissive had I not looked at the data on individual chemicals. The Wellnessmama person: is she over-the-top, exaggerating, inaccurate or misinformed? Maybe. I personally don't share her assertions and think there is a lack of scientific data to back up her claims. I think it's irresponsible to present opinions as facts. (Does beeswax really "clean" the air?) It's especially alarming to me that people completely accept what she wrote as fact, as though she were a scientist presenting the results of a peer-reviewed study 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sponiebr Posted March 22, 2017 Share Posted March 22, 2017 Oh! All y'all is talk'n 'bout TREEHUGGERS... (Whale hail! Y'didncha jist SAY SO!) Damned treehuggers... And then there's them turtle copulaters... (That's not what we REALLY call'm but I'm being nice...) Anyways these nuts go running up and down the beach all night long, and all year long putting up little "sanctuary" "ZONES" with all kinds of death threats posted on them. Then during the day they guard them. Don't get me wrong, I like the sea turtles and all... I even don't have too much of a problem with asking folks that actually line ON the beach to turn off their porch lights during nesting season... I don't even mind the little stake beds with the police line crime scene tape blowing off into the ocean, (not real thrilled 'bout that last part, but whatever if the turtles like the pretty ribbon that's all that matters...) No... No problems with that, cause I really DO like them little goofy flippy floppy windup car looking baby sea turtles. They're cute. Naw my problem is that those nut jobs do this year long, and specifically target peak traffic events claiming nests... Brazenly going up to houses and DEMANDING that ALL OF THE LIGHTS INSIDE THE HOUSE BE COMPLETELY OFF year round or else the ENTIRE house sealed up in such a manner as to block ALL light from emanating from the house. Yeah, houses that have been there for 50-60 years... Have to "comply" with the local asstrap chapter of face being accused of felonious acts against endangered animals... Shooting out peoples windows and lights... THAT PISSES ME OFF. But now they're after chandlers too? BLOODY'ELL!!!!! Well! I'll not 'ave tha!!!! On 3/17/2017 at 5:36 PM, birdcharm said: I don't agree that we need "legit research" to get a sense of the difference of effects from pouring, let's say, an ounce of scent into a hot pot of wax verses the distributed scent that burns off in a candle. This is like saying we can't tell the difference between drinking a shot of liquor or a few sips -- of course we know it's not the same. If someone burns several scented candles at once without any air circulation, they probably are filling a room with vapors that are not good to breathe all of the time; such as incense, a fireplace, etc. -- in moderation, it's probably not as bad as breathing smog. So... Bird... Yer say'n that you CAN have TOO many candles burning at one time? (I'm just trying to make sure I actually understand what yer say'n here...) Too many "might" not be good for your health? Well, DAMN! This just ruins EVERYTHING!!! I mean, I always just disregarded the complaints "uh... I don't think I feel so good..." as just, y'know nervous excitement... But now I read this! So It looks like I'll have to re-tool (re-illuminate?) my erm....den? with those stupid LED battery operated candles... THAT'S gonna be EXPENSIVE! We're also not going to have the benefit of the the heat from the candles anymore... Well this just SUX!!!! Date night ambiance is definitely gonna suffer... Sponiebr: The Executor of Bad Ideas and Sundry Services. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Incendia Posted March 22, 2017 Share Posted March 22, 2017 (edited) 13 minutes ago, Sponiebr said: Well this just SUX!!!! Date night ambiance is definitely gonna suffer... Uh... Date night ambiance? Are you into necrophilia? That's not a come-hither setting, it's a wake. That big lump on the bed is not pillows, that's a body lying in repose after a life-time of burning all those candles. . Edited March 22, 2017 by Incendia 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CBeardly Posted March 22, 2017 Author Share Posted March 22, 2017 @Sponiebr Have you considered cutting back on the caffeine/sugar/meth? Just a thought. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moonstar Posted March 22, 2017 Share Posted March 22, 2017 Sponie Don't listen to that .... Ive come to rely on your witty charm + complete and utter nonsense Lol ! Out of curiosity, how much coffee do you drink exactly lol ! 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moonshine Posted March 22, 2017 Share Posted March 22, 2017 7 hours ago, glasllyn said: No, I haven't gotten sick from candles or any other scented products. I have had times when I felt like, holy crap, I need to snuff this out and open a window, but I've never felt asthmatic, nauseous or stuffy. My point is simply that we may be a bit laissez faire about the chemicals we're using, and maybe not giving them as much thought as we should. Honestly, it wouldn't have occurred to me had I not felt so sick and I have have been dismissive had I not looked at the data on individual chemicals. The Wellnessmama person: is she over-the-top, exaggerating, inaccurate or misinformed? Maybe. I personally don't share her assertions and think there is a lack of scientific data to back up her claims. I think it's irresponsible to present opinions as facts. (Does beeswax really "clean" the air?) It's especially alarming to me that people completely accept what she wrote as fact, as though she were a scientist presenting the results of a peer-reviewed study Perfectly said....I could not agree more Her blog or whatever that was was strictly all her opinion - she did not have any scientific backing to prove anything and then the comments some others were making about beeswax being extremely poisonous to burn, people jumped on that bandwagon as well.....and I don't think many of us do think as much as we should about the use of fragrance oils and EO's- we don't know what it is doing to us and some people are more sensitive than others and we have zero reason to believe that fragrance oils could be extremely toxic because none of the packaging they come in states so....the MSDS sheets say no respirator needed....you can easily access oils from hundreds of places ...why would we even consider they could harm us if they are that easily accessible unless we start to develop symptoms that we recognize as being directly related to the use of them I have figured out in making parasoy off and on for a couple years that I have a sensitivity to the paraffin- I cannot burn them anymore or make them, others are the same with soy....certain fragrances make my eyes itch and face burn but I never thought anything of it in the years before because again- why would they allow the sale of such products without explicit warnings - paint and stain cans and even bleach bottles have more warnings and cautions on them than a bottle of fragrance oil there are millions of products out there with fragrance- everything has fragrance, our flipping detergent to wash our clothes has fragrance, so does our dish soap and toothpaste and even "natural" cleaning supplies - so does this lady use nothing but vinegar and fresh squeezed lemons for everything from toilet cleaning right down to washing her own body??? It was easy to get sucked into her way of thinking, I will give her that but to completely mislead people on a subject based on her own opinion and personal preference is just wrong unless she can prove without a doubt the national candle association has done studies at candles.org disproving most of her claims And even though she diffuses EO's now for Scent And air pollution I sure hope she did her research on those because she could be harming small children and pets more so than a single scented candle! 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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