glasllyn Posted March 22, 2017 Share Posted March 22, 2017 Forgive me if that is considered a dumb question, but I'd like to hear from you. I haven't made CP simply because I make so many other things that I like the ease and time-savings of making M&P. I want to easily match my soaps with other scented products I make. It just seems easier, overall. But I see that most soapers are CP soapers and I'd like to understand why it's such a lovable art-form, because it clearly is. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jcandleattic Posted March 22, 2017 Share Posted March 22, 2017 Each process has it's pros and cons like everything else. I started with CP, and fell in love with it. Not sure how it's such a lovable process, other than to say, you would just have to try it first, then you might understand. I still use M&P to an extent, and use it as toppers on several of my CP batches. The reason I didn't go all out with M&P is because for me it wasn't easy. I could never get the beautiful designs that the talented M&P'rs have been able to achieve. Also, it's taken years of usage of M&P bars for my skin to get acclimated to it. Mostly it was very cleansing and drying to my skin, but not as bad as commercial soaps. It's gotten better over the years, either I'm buying superior bases, or the bases themselves have gotten better. Probably a bit of both, but my skin can more easily tolerate it now. No question is ever a dumb question, btw. Always ask, it's how we all learn. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
glasllyn Posted March 22, 2017 Author Share Posted March 22, 2017 Thanks so much! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moonstar Posted March 23, 2017 Share Posted March 23, 2017 (edited) 20 minutes ago, Jcandleattic said: Each process has it's pros and cons like everything else. I started with CP, and fell in love with it. Not sure how it's such a lovable process, other than to say, you would just have to try it first, then you might understand. I still use M&P to an extent, and use it as toppers on several of my CP batches. The reason I didn't go all out with M&P is because for me it wasn't easy. I could never get the beautiful designs that the talented M&P'rs have been able to achieve. Also, it's taken years of usage of M&P bars for my skin to get acclimated to it. Mostly it was very cleansing and drying to my skin, but not as bad as commercial soaps. It's gotten better over the years, either I'm buying superior bases, or the bases themselves have gotten better. Probably a bit of both, but my skin can more easily tolerate it now. No question is ever a dumb question, btw. Always ask, it's how we all learn. In your opinion whats a good M+P soap brand. Ive bought Peaks I believe they carry SFIC ? and CS started carrying Stephenson . I did like Peaks , especially the clear one . 20 minutes ago, Jcandleattic said: Each process has it's pros and cons like everything else. I started with CP, and fell in love with it. Not sure how it's such a lovable process, other than to say, you would just have to try it first, then you might understand. I still use M&P to an extent, and use it as toppers on several of my CP batches. The reason I didn't go all out with M&P is because for me it wasn't easy. I could never get the beautiful designs that the talented M&P'rs have been able to achieve. Also, it's taken years of usage of M&P bars for my skin to get acclimated to it. Mostly it was very cleansing and drying to my skin, but not as bad as commercial soaps. It's gotten better over the years, either I'm buying superior bases, or the bases themselves have gotten better. Probably a bit of both, but my skin can more easily tolerate it now. No question is ever a dumb question, btw. Always ask, it's how we all learn. Edited March 23, 2017 by Moonstar 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jcandleattic Posted March 23, 2017 Share Posted March 23, 2017 I like both brands you mentioned, but I like the Stephenson brands better. I still have a 25lb block of the extra clear I got from WSP many years ago. It's still good for toppers, and because it's older, it doesn't sweat near as much which is perfect for the toppers since I can't wrap them right away. But when i use the newer better stuff, I have to wrap immediately because even here in low humidity, it sweats a bit. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jcandleattic Posted March 23, 2017 Share Posted March 23, 2017 Should have given the disclaimer I don't work with M&P very often at all though... 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moonstar Posted March 23, 2017 Share Posted March 23, 2017 The Goats milk and the honey one is pretty good from WSP. I also like the coconut one - the clear -and oatmeal . Glasllyn I always choose the detergent free from WSP. I don't know why but Im so nervous to try CP . I find that Im my own worst enemy at times. Maybe I'm afraid of failing IDK ??? I really want to try Candybees recipe - it sounds awesome ( Goat milk oats + honey soap ) I should just go for it ! lol ! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
debratant Posted March 23, 2017 Share Posted March 23, 2017 I started with MP, then quickly moved on to CP after seeing all the cool techniques. You can do a lot with MP, but you can do more with CP. The process itself is just fascinating....mixing oil, water/lye to get soap? It really never occurred to me that lye mixed with oils makes soap. Seriously. I never thought about it, I just bought soap from the store, never realized it, never cared! I just love it...it's just fun! 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TallTayl Posted March 23, 2017 Share Posted March 23, 2017 Tried various m&p over the years and did not like any of them. Between my skin becoming irritated by the ingredients that make it possible to melt and pour, to the changing formulas, to the sweating/shrinking/color morphing, etc. I knew it was not for me. with cp you have total control of the formula and are not victim to reformulation by manufacturers. Plus, it is much less spendy for me (translate to more profitable) to make it from scratch. 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iansmommaya Posted March 23, 2017 Share Posted March 23, 2017 Tons of reasons, I've only tried M and P once, from Micheals or someplace and that's not very good stuff. I'm into more of the organic health stuff so it just never resonated with me ya know? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sponiebr Posted March 23, 2017 Share Posted March 23, 2017 What TT said. Verbatim. Also for me, CP gives me the time to do artistic swirls, but also like Jcandleattic said both have their pros and cons... I don't use M&P for anything, though I might consider it for some sort of soap glue hot glue... I'm *personally* starting to like HP even better than CP because I'm getting almost the same results in less time and with less of a cleanup hassle... HP also uses MUCH less FO as well, which is good for me because I'm a cheap bastard. YMWV, Sponiebr 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Candybee Posted March 23, 2017 Share Posted March 23, 2017 (edited) I started out working with M&P because I wanted to add soap to my product line and also because it was easy to make. I had my candle biz back then so soap was another offering while my candles were my bread and butter. After a while I took a class in CP from a friend of mine that did CP. She made it look fun and easy and took away most of the fear of working with lye. Eventually I fell in love with soap making and closed my candle company and reinvented my business as a soap company. The truth is the reasons I switched from M&P to CP are: 1. I have complete control over my ingredients and what goes into my soap. You don't have that with M&P. 2. If your supplier is out of stock of the M&P you prefer to use you will have to get it from another supplier and the other supplier will probably not have your brand. 3. Suppliers can and are often out of stock of your brand. 4. Prices of M&P can have a wide range so that if your supplier is out, your back up supplier may charge $10, $20 or even much more for the same brand and don't get me started on the shipping. 5. When a supplier is out of stock of my M&P that can play havoc on my business when I can't make my product 6. I always wanted to make CP soap because I wanted to be in control of the ingredients, 7. Making CP meant I was not at the mercy of M&P suppliers being out of stock or raising their prices for bases or for shipping 8. Making CP soap to me is being a true soaper because I am making it from scratch. 9. The FDA recognizes CP soap as true soap. The FDA catagorizes M&P soap as a cosmetic rather than true soap. 10. Best of all I love how CP feels on my skin and knowing what is in the soap also makes me feel good. 11. I love the fact that I am one of many artisans keeping the art of soapmaking alive and passing that love to others 12. I love making CP soap and consequently I do annual workshops teaching others the basics of making CP soap. Edited March 23, 2017 by Candybee 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CBeardly Posted March 23, 2017 Share Posted March 23, 2017 I started with CP. I make MP on occasion if I think I need some extra product for a show. I enjoy making CP much more & I like the feel of CP much more. I find making intricate MP soaps far too tedious & my hands/fingers can't take it. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
glasllyn Posted March 23, 2017 Author Share Posted March 23, 2017 I love all this input! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
glasllyn Posted March 23, 2017 Author Share Posted March 23, 2017 16 hours ago, Moonstar said: The Goats milk and the honey one is pretty good from WSP. I also like the coconut one - the clear -and oatmeal . Glasllyn I always choose the detergent free from WSP. I don't know why but Im so nervous to try CP . I find that Im my own worst enemy at times. Maybe I'm afraid of failing IDK ??? I really want to try Candybees recipe - it sounds awesome ( Goat milk oats + honey soap ) I should just go for it ! lol ! Detergent-free. I like that. Fear of failure? If my life had a soundtrack, that would be the title. Except insert "perfectionist" in there somewhere. And "champagne." 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Candybee Posted March 23, 2017 Share Posted March 23, 2017 You just reminded me of another reason I prefer CP over M&P. The M&P bases that contain sulfates are the ones that have the very best lather. The so called 'detergent' free don't compare lather wise or in their ability to hold additives. Lastly, bases vary so much from one to another, what you can do with one base you can't do with another. So if you like using additives finding the right base means you have to test a lot of bases and if you require a sulfate free base or 'natural' base you are even further limited. Making CP means I always have the full bubbly and creamy lather I want plus I can put in the additives I want. Not so with M&P. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
glasllyn Posted March 23, 2017 Author Share Posted March 23, 2017 I'm very attracted to a few things about CP: primarily the cost and nourishment/ hydration options. I have really dry skin, so oils are my BFFs. I'd be beef jerky without them. Sooooooooo...if one were to try a very simple test project without buying 345834730496 pounds of stuff, what would you recommend? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Candybee Posted March 23, 2017 Share Posted March 23, 2017 CP is easy to make. There are some good basic recipes and instructions on this forum. You can make an outstanding soap using just olive oil. Or my favorite olive oil with castor oil. Or use the basic trinity of soaping oils; olive oil, palm oil, and coconut oil. All of these ingredients you can find at Walmart. Lye can be found at your local hardware store, Lowes, or Home Depot. My first soap I used AJ's basic recipe from the B&B recipe forum with olive oil, coconut oil, lard, and castor oil. I still use that recipe today to teach basic soapmaking at my CP workshops. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moonstar Posted March 23, 2017 Share Posted March 23, 2017 37 minutes ago, glasllyn said: Detergent-free. I like that. Fear of failure? If my life had a soundtrack, that would be the title. Except insert "perfectionist" in there somewhere. And "champagne." Kindered souls - I too am a perfectionist, but its a double edged sword for me. Champagne - why, yes please 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CBeardly Posted March 23, 2017 Share Posted March 23, 2017 (edited) The easiest CP recipe you can make is 100% Coconut Oil. You only need to use a high Super Fat. Most people go with 20%, I do 25% because 20 is still too drying for my sensitive skin. A 100% CO soap breaks a soaping rule of some sort, but it really does make a nice soap Edited March 23, 2017 by Jcandleattic 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moonstar Posted March 23, 2017 Share Posted March 23, 2017 (edited) 2 hours ago, CBeardly said: The easiest CP recipe you can make is 100% Coconut Oil. You only need to use a high Super Fat. Most people go with 20%, I do 25% because 20 is still too drying for my sensitive skin. A 100% CO soap breaks a soaping rule of some sort, but it really does make a nice soap So when you use one oil such as CO, do you have to soap at a higher temp , if so what temp do you shoot for so that you don't reach a false trace ? Also, have you ever had issues with DOS going with 25 % super fat and lastly do you always use purified water or have you ever used coconut milk ? ok thats all the questions I have lol ! Edited March 23, 2017 by Jcandleattic Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CBeardly Posted March 23, 2017 Share Posted March 23, 2017 @Moonstar I use 92* CO & as long as it's above that then it's always good for me. My lye solution is usually pretty cool as well. I haven't had DOS with CO. When using water I will use distilled, but sometimes I'll use coconut milk. I think I used some yesterday. If I use powdered I will add it to the warm oil & blend it in before adding the lye solution. I don't freeze milks/liquids because it gives me more trouble than it's worth. It takes sooo long to melt (IME). I forgot & I used some prepared frozen coffee this week. It took all day to melt (after the lye was added). Milks will still stink for a little while even if you freeze them (again, IME). 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Candybee Posted March 23, 2017 Share Posted March 23, 2017 100% coconut oil can make a very good soap but it is not considered a beginners soap. Coconut oil can be very harsh on your skin so to make a 100% coconut oil soap that works for your skin you should have some experience making CP. Enough experience so you have an understanding about how superfatting and lye to liquid percentages work and how they effect the overall finished soap. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jcandleattic Posted March 23, 2017 Share Posted March 23, 2017 3 minutes ago, Candybee said: 100% coconut oil can make a very good soap but it is not considered a beginners soap. Coconut oil can be very harsh on your skin so to make a 100% coconut oil soap that works for your skin you should have some experience making CP. Enough experience so you have an understanding about how superfatting and lye to liquid percentages work and how they effect the overall finished soap As well as all this, 100% CO soap can get very warm very fast, and if you let it sit too long in the mold (usually longer than 6-12 hours) then it can be very difficult to cut. Also, it may be prone to overheating. Not really a beginner recipe even though it does seem very simple. I would suggest a 100% Olive Oil soap as more of a beginner type recipe, with a typical 5-8% superat. However then you have the long cure time. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Candybee Posted March 23, 2017 Share Posted March 23, 2017 1 minute ago, Jcandleattic said: As well as all this, 100% CO soap can get very warm very fast, and if you let it sit too long in the mold (usually longer than 6-12 hours) then it can be very difficult to cut. Also, it may be prone to overheating. Not really a beginner recipe even though it does seem very simple. I would suggest a 100% Olive Oil soap as more of a beginner type recipe, with a typical 5-8% superat. However then you have the long cure time. This too. Big time! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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