Candles do not smell at all?

[JohnW.]

My brother and I have started making candles for our family store. We are using 464 soy wax. We have tried several scents (Butterscotch bourbon, apple cinnamon, lavender vanilla, lemon sugar cookie, and cashmere cedar). Of all the scents we have tried, Butterscotch bourbon is the only one we can smell when lit. We have followed directions on making them, so we are lost. We have added all scents at 185 degrees, and poured at 140 degrees. We are using 8 ounce jelly jars for them. Any idea what the issue might be? We are letting them cure now, but we would have thought we could smell them when lit at least some prior to curing.

[NightLight]

What per cent of fragrance oil are you using?  6-8 per cent should be more than ample. Also what company are you buying from. Not all fragrance oils are created equal. There are strong oils in wax and weak ones. Make sure the oils are well stirred into the wax. Curing does help. Soy will never duplicate a paraffin or parasoy candle. They will be weaker.

If you don't think 464 cutting it, try C3 it has a learning curve but I think it throw better then 464. 464 is pretty easy to use.

[JohnW.]

We used 1.6 ounce/pound of wax, so 10% fragrance. We purchased all oils from The Flaming Candle and all were rated as being good for soy and paraffin waxes.

[TallTayl]

Sounds like a wick issue.

[BusyBee]

Yes.  It should be a wick issue.

 

I make 464 candles.  I heat it up to 180F, add 12% FO at 175F, & pour at 135F.  It's almost impossible to find a wick for this wax.  The best you can do is bring out 65%(This number could go down to 50% if someone is aiming for hit in your face strong HT.) of its HT capacity.  This is possible if you are using wicks from well known wick manufacturers.  I was able to achieve 75% by making my own wicks, and I consider both of them as sellable candles.  But it still is far below what other easier waxes can bring it to the table with using only 6% FOs.  However, I learned a lot from this wax that I am capable of wick all other waxes with ease now.  I can tell you that it is ECO wick that will work to 65% of its capacity, but my suggestion is to avoid soy or any soy blends(These are worse than 100% soy.) for your first candle development project.  Because it is going to take a lot more time to make these work compare to others.  You also need to deal with impossible to get rid of horrible frosting & wet spots with soy wax.

 

My daughter picked soy wax for our candle venture, and we stuck with it without knowing anything about waxes.  464 looked best among all available waxes.  Is there any reason why you have picked 464?  If you want to go with vegetable waxes, then coconut or palm would be much easier to make excellent candles.  

[ErronB]

1 hour ago, BusyBee said:

Yes.  It should be a wick issue.

 

I make 464 candles.  I heat it up to 180F, add 12% FO at 175F, & pour at 135F.  It's almost impossible to find a wick for this wax.  The best you can do is bring out 65%(This number could go down to 50% if someone is aiming for hit in your face strong HT.) of its HT capacity.  This is possible if you are using wicks from well known wick manufacturers.  I was able to achieve 75% by making my own wicks, and I consider both of them as sellable candles.  But it still is far below what other easier waxes can bring it to the table with using only 6% FOs.  However, I learned a lot from this wax that I am capable of wick all other waxes with ease now.  I can tell you that it is ECO wick that will work to 65% of its capacity, but my suggestion is to avoid soy or any soy blends(These are worse than 100% soy.) for your first candle development project.  Because it is going to take a lot more time to make these work compare to others.  You also need to deal with impossible to get rid of horrible frosting & wet spots with soy wax.

 

My daughter picked soy wax for our candle venture, and we stuck with it without knowing anything about waxes.  464 looked best among all available waxes.  Is there any reason why you have picked 464?  If you want to go with vegetable waxes, then coconut or palm would be much easier to make excellent candles.  

 

The reason you're finding it almost impossible to find a wick for 464 is because you're using 12% FO, you don't need more than 8% (or maybe 10 for really light fragrances) to get a big hot throw. Personally I used CD wicks because they self-trimmed well when you don't use a ton of FO.

 

The problem with 464 is that the batches are so inconsistent finding that 'sweet spot' for the killer throw. It can be all over the place and requires making several testers from each lot, that's why I won't use it anymore. It's not hard to get an average throw after a good cure, but it's capable of a lot more if you know exactly what you're doing.

[BusyBee]

1 hour ago, ErronB said:

 

The reason you're finding it almost impossible to find a wick for 464 is because you're using 12% FO, you don't need more than 8% (or maybe 10 for really light fragrances) to get a big hot throw. Personally I used CD wicks because they self-trimmed well when you don't use a ton of FO.

 

The problem with 464 is that the batches are so inconsistent finding that 'sweet spot' for the killer throw. It can be all over the place and requires making several testers from each lot, that's why I won't use it anymore. It's not hard to get an average throw after a good cure, but it's capable of a lot more if you know exactly what you're doing.

Best part is that my customers don't know that I don't know what the hell I am doing.

[NightLight]

Not all of Flaming Candles fragrance oils are good in candles. Some are quite weak. You have to test various fragrances. I have found that if you up the percentage to 10 in 464 in warmer months the fragrance oil will ooze up to top of candle. You should be able to get a good candle 6 - 8 per cent and then it will also be easier to wick.

You should get some different wicks and test with the wax.  There are many types. CD, HTP, ECO...

I would try a sample of a parasol 6006 you will need to go down about two sizes in wicks or less when wicking this type of wax.

You should do test burn of three hours and deep into the container before deciding what wick works.

[bfroberts]

What wick are you using?

 

[JohnW.]

Thanks everyone. We are using Premier WI-765 wicks from the Flaming Candle. Is this the wrong wick to use?

[JohnW.]

What wick do you all think is best for 464 soy wax? Like I said, our candles are in 8 ounce jelly jars.

[Karen Ov]

7 minutes ago, JohnW. said:

What wick do you all think is best for 464 soy wax? Like I said, our candles are in 8 ounce jelly jars.

I used the cd wicks, I liked the way they burned, but I dont use 464 anymore, over a year worth of candle making with 464 and came to the conclusion that 464 is disappointing.  I conquered the wet spots, and even the the bumpy tops and frosting, but then there is the lack of  hot throw on over 50 different fo's. Plus the candles that did come out really nice, after 3 months there all frosted up, dry looking. I wouldnt buy it. So now concentrating on wax melts for the time..and will try some different waxes down the road   

[prs7979]

4 hours ago, JohnW. said:

What wick do you all think is best for 464 soy wax? Like I said, our candles are in 8 ounce jelly jars.

It depends on the fragrance and the specific jar but basically every scent that throws well for me in these jars

 

https://www.communitycandlesupply.com/proddetail.php?prod=JJS8-NOLID

 

In 464 works with a CD-6 or a CD-4.   I've never personally had much luck with any of the Premier wicks.

 

I will also say I use both the butterscotch bourbon and cashmere cedar---I could never get the butterscotch bourbon to work in soy and I believe I use a CD-6 with the Cashmere Cedar.

[JohnW.]

14 minutes ago, prs7979 said:

It depends on the fragrance and the specific jar but basically every scent that throws well for me in these jars

 

https://www.communitycandlesupply.com/proddetail.php?prod=JJS8-NOLID

 

In 464 works with a CD-6 or a CD-4.   I've never personally had much luck with any of the Premier wicks.

 

I will also say I use both the butterscotch bourbon and cashmere cedar---I could never get the butterscotch bourbon to work in soy and I believe I use a CD-6 with the Cashmere Cedar.

I actually had better luck with butter scotch bourbon than any of the others. I am going to try either a CD or Eco wick. I think the wick is the issue from all my research.