When to add VYBAR to my wax

[TallPineCandles]

OK everyone....Newbie question for you all. I am adding VYBAR to IGI 6006 for a better hot throw (so they tell me). I have searched high and low but can not find anything related as to WHEN to add the VYBAR. Do I add while melting? At a lower temp before adding F/O? HELP!!!

[TallPineCandles]

Also, could one of you let me know the TRUE amount of VYBAR to add per pound of IGI 6006??

[bfroberts]

23 minutes ago, TallPineCandles said:

Also, could one of you let me know the TRUE amount of VYBAR to add per pound of IGI 6006??

IMO, none.  6006 already contains additives. I don’t think there’s anything to be gained by adding more.  
 

The addition of vybar may (strong emphasis on “may”) allow the wax to hold more FO, but 6006 will already hold 10%.  If you aren’t getting a good throw with 6% or more, I’d look elsewhere for the problem....the FO itself, the wick, your process, etc.  If you could provide details about your process, I’m sure we can help troubleshoot.

[TallPineCandles]

I do 1-lb test batches. I use 16 oz of IGI 6006 melted to 185. Then i transfer to a pouring pot to fill the candles. I am using a straight side 3 inch jar. I am wicking it with a CD-14 (these burn beautifly). I get a full melt pool. I add F/O at 175. Using 10% F/O. I then let the wax cool until it starts to get a milky look then I pour.

 

Now, in this last batch, the only thing different was adding VYBAR as the wax was melting. Figured that was the best time to add.

 

I have not had a good HT in candles in ever. I sell tons of melts and they have great C/H throw, but my candles...nothing.

Edited January 25, 2020 by TallPineCandles

[TallPineCandles]

Does ANYONE know ANYTHING about VYBAR???? I am at a loss here and really am looking for some help!!!

[CaptnKush]

Ya, don't add any to your 6006 because it already has additives. Here is some info for you.

 

Candle Additives are additional ingredients that you can add to candle wax to improve the quality of the finished product.  Candle wax can vary from batch to batch, so knowing how to adjust to these situations is key.  There are a variety of candle additives at your disposal, spanning an array of possibilities for your candles.  Some additives improve scent throw, some help with discoloration, there are even additives to help extend burn time.  The key to providing the best candle you can to the market is knowing what candle additives are available and what they can do for your products.

Stearic Acid

What is Stearic Acid:  The candle additive stearic acid helps the wax shrink as it cools.  This is key to remember especially if you are making candles in molds.  The addition of stearic acid will help release your candle smoothly.   Stearic Acid also boosts the opacity of candle wax.  If you are making candles and coloring them with powdered dye, the powdered dye can be melted in stearic acid before adding it to the melted wax to ensure an even dispersal of color throughout the candle.  Stearic Acid can also be used to make gel wax embeds by adding it to pillar or votive wax.

How Much To Use:  Stearic Acid is added to paraffin wax.  The correct percentage use for this additive is 10% of the total wax amount.  Therefore, for every pound (16oz) of paraffin wax you use, you will add 1.5 oz of stearic acid.  Stearic Acid can also be used at an additional 2% in your paraffin wax if you have selected to scent your candle with heavier fragrance oils like vanilla scents.  The extra added stearic acid in this case will help the candle wax with fragrance seepage.  A break down example for this is 2 tsp. for every 16oz of wax.

Vybar

What is Vybar:  The candle additive vybar is a substitute for stearic acid.  Vybar is also used to help extend the scent throw in your candles.   The addition of vybar to your candle wax will make the wax more opaque.  You will also notice a marbleized look to the top open portion in container candles.  Vybar will also increase your candles melt point and also slightly harden your wax consistency.  There are two different types of vybar depending of which type of candle you are making.  Vybar 103 is used in votive or pillar candles.  Vybar 260 is used in container candles.

How Much To Use:  If you are looking to get the best scent throw possible out of your candles, vybar can be added to your candle wax at ¼ to ½ tsp. for every 16oz. of wax.  This proportion provides the very best results.  There is a precaution when it comes to adding vybar to your wax.  Adding to much of this additive will result in trapped fragrance oil, directly meaning decreased scent throw.  If fragrance oil is trapped in wax, the scent will not evaporate correctly when the candle is lit.  Therefore, it is best to stick with the recommended use mentioned above.

Petrolatum

What is Petrolatum:  The candle additive Petrolatum is also known as petroleum jelly.  This additive is used in container wax only and works by increasing the number of pores in your wax.  Petrolatum will also increase the oil content in a wax therefore making it creamier and softer.  The addition of Petrolatum to your wax will also help the wax to adhere to the sides of its container as well as help to reduce shrinkage of the wax.  This candle additive will also aid in the reduction of the melting point resulting in an end product with a longer burn time.

How Much To Use:  With this candle additive, testing is key.  A good starting point is up to 5% of your total wax amount.  This percentage can range all the way up to 30%.  Please Note:  Using this candle additive may affect your clean burn resulting in some smoking from your candle.

Crisco Shortening

What is Crisco Shortening:  Crisco Shortening is commonly used in food recipes, but can also be used as a candle additive.  The addition of Crisco Shortening to a candle wax will help to extend the candles scent throw and decrease the chance of having wet spots.  A good alternative to Petrolatum, this additive even works better with certain container candle waxes then Petrolatum does.

How Much To Use:  Through our testing, we have found that the addition of Crisco Shortening at 1-2 oz. per pound of container wax provides your finished candle with a better scent throw.

Mineral Oil

What is Mineral Oil– Mineral oil is also known as paraffin oil.  Commonly used as an emollient agent for cosmetics, mineral oil can also be used as a candle additive.  The addition of mineral oil to your candle wax will provide for a mottled look in your end product.

How Much To Use:  To achieve a mottled look in candles, add 3 Tbs. of mineral oil per every pound of wax you are melting.   You will want to pour the candles at 160 degrees Fahrenheit.  When using this candle additive in your wax, you do not want to rush the cooling process of the candles with a water bath.

Beeswax

What is Beeswax:  The candle additive beeswax will improve a candles burn time and also provide your end product with a beautiful rich color if you choose to color the candles.  Now, the addition of beeswax to your candle recipes can be expensive, but well worth it if you choose to go that route.

How Much To Use:  Beeswax can be used as the only wax in a candle, or it can also be added at 5-10% of the total amount of paraffin wax.

Microcrystalline Wax

What is Microcrystalline Wax:  There are 2 different forms of Microcrystalline wax; hard and soft.  The candle additive hard Microcrystalline wax is added to paraffin wax to harden wax therefore providing the candle with an extended burn time.  The melt point for hard microcrystalline wax is over 200 degrees Fahrenheit.  This candle additive can also be used as a dip wax to make mottled candles.  The other type, Soft Microcrystalline wax has a lower melting wax point.  This wax is used with paraffin wax to make modeled wax.  The addition of this candle additive will also help the wax adhere to the containers as well.

How Much To Use:  For the Hard Microcrystalline wax, the usage suggestion is 1% of the total wax amount.  For the Soft Microcrystalline wax, the usage suggestion is about 10% of the total wax amount, or about 1.5 oz. per pound of wax.

UV Light Inhibitor

What is UV Light Inhibitor:  When coloring your candles, there are certain hues that have a tendency to discolor.  These colors are Blue, Burgundy, and Violet.  The same can be said about any variations of these colors as well.  UV Light Inhibitor is a candle additive that helps to prevent the sun’s affect of fading or discoloration in your candles.  However, it must be noted that if finished candles are set in direct sunlight, even with the addition of UV Light Inhibitor, fading will still occur.

How Much To Use:  The addition of this candle additive is added at a rate of 1/8 tsp per 16oz. of wax used.

 

 

[bfroberts]

5 hours ago, TallPineCandles said:

I do 1-lb test batches. I use 16 oz of IGI 6006 melted to 185. Then i transfer to a pouring pot to fill the candles. I am using a straight side 3 inch jar. I am wicking it with a CD-14 (these burn beautifly). I get a full melt pool. I add F/O at 175. Using 10% F/O. I then let the wax cool until it starts to get a milky look then I pour.

 

Now, in this last batch, the only thing different was adding VYBAR as the wax was melting. Figured that was the best time to add.

 

I have not had a good HT in candles in ever. I sell tons of melts and they have great C/H throw, but my candles...nothing.

Ditch the vybar.  Seriously.  I’ve used a lot of 6006.  I would suggest:  heat to 185-190, add FO (6% is enough), stir a couple minutes, pour, cure ten days or so and test.  I don’t use CD wicks often, but a 14 seems like it may be too big, especially if you are getting a full melt pool on the initial burn.  

Otherwise, your FO may be the culprit.  What scents are you using? What supplier?

 

Unfortunately, a lot of the info out there is less than reliable.  This forum is absolutely the very best place to learn.  There are lots of posts re: 6006 if you do a search.

[TallPineCandles]

95% of my F/O come from CandleScience. The other 5% from various other suppliers. Do you pour at what, 175-180 then? So, am I adding to much F/O? Is that the main problem? I want people to notice the fragrance when they walk into the room. I figured adding the max (10%) would get this affect. Apparently not. Do you happen to have a suggestion to lead me in the right direction on the wicking? What wick do you use generally? Any and all help and suggestions are gratefully appreciated.

[BusyBee]

Here is Vybar information from Baker Hughes, the maker of Vybar.

https://www.bhge.com/industrial/specialty-chemicals/specialty-polymers/candles

*Vybar can be used to hold more FO in basic paraffin wax, but it might cause negative effect on other pre-blended waxes.

 

You had the right idea to add Vybar to enhance HT.  I did have the same idea as beginner of candle making to add max Vybar to able to maximize HT, which turned out to be bad idea.  All of pre-blended wax already has some type of Vybar like agents added in the wax.  If you add too much Vybar, then it will actually lock the scents instead of releasing them.  So, other people are right about suggesting not to add Vybar to 6006.  There is one question.  Did you add Vybar to wax melts also?

 

There are many people in this Forum that has good candle using only 6% FO, but I am one of those who likes to go for the max capacity which in my case I go with 12% FO.  I guess either way will work, but 6% FO can save a lot production cost.

 

The wick is most important part of having great HT.  Type of wax & FOs are important also.  But if you don't wick it right, then there is going to be no HT.  I am one of those who likes to go with 100% soy or 100% paraffin.  So, I don't know anything about your 6006, but I am pretty sure others will help you on 6006.

 

Edited January 26, 2020 by BusyBee

[BusyBee]

✌️  Good luck to you!

Edited January 26, 2020 by BusyBee
double entry

[bfroberts]

28 minutes ago, TallPineCandles said:

95% of my F/O come from CandleScience. The other 5% from various other suppliers. Do you pour at what, 175-180 then? So, am I adding to much F/O? Is that the main problem? I want people to notice the fragrance when they walk into the room. I figured adding the max (10%) would get this affect. Apparently not. Do you happen to have a suggestion to lead me in the right direction on the wicking? What wick do you use generally? Any and all help and suggestions are gratefully appreciated.

Add your FO at 185-190.  Stir a minute or two and pour.  You should be able to coax a throw from 6006 with most CS scents at 6%, especially the 3 leaf rated scents, with proper wicking.  More isn’t necessarily stronger.

It is important to cure for an appropriate length of time, despite what you may hear otherwise.  Also, where you burn your candle can affect what you smell depending on your particular space, air flow, a/c return, etc.  If you can smell it standing over it but it isn’t traveling thru your space, try moving the candle to another location.

I use a different wick type with 6006, but lots of people have success with CD wicks.  I’m hoping someone will chime in with a recommendation.  If you are reaching a full melt pool on your first burn, wick down a size or two.

[TallPineCandles]

12 minutes ago, bfroberts said:

Add your FO at 185-190.  Stir a minute or two and pour.  You should be able to coax a throw from 6006 with most CS scents at 6%, especially the 3 leaf rated scents, with proper wicking.  More isn’t necessarily stronger.

It is important to cure for an appropriate length of time, despite what you may hear otherwise.  Also, where you burn your candle can affect what you smell depending on your particular space, air flow, a/c return, etc.  If you can smell it standing over it but it isn’t traveling thru your space, try moving the candle to another location.

I use a different wick type with 6006, but lots of people have success with CD wicks.  I’m hoping someone will chime in with a recommendation.  If you are reaching a full melt pool on your first burn, wick down a size or two.

Here is some testing I am doing on tins. I am testing the CD 16, 18 & 20. The 20 is on the left, 18 center and 16 on the right. This is after a 3 hour burn. They have now cooled for about 2 hours. You can see the pool rings somewhat. It seems the 16 is winning this battle....LOL

[BusyBee]

12 minutes ago, TallPineCandles said:

Here is some testing I am doing on tins. I am testing the CD 16, 18 & 20. The 20 is on the left, 18 center and 16 on the right. This is after a 3 hour burn. They have now cooled for about 2 hours. You can see the pool rings somewhat. It seems the 16 is winning this battle....LOL

 

Are you using GB464 instead of 6006?

[ErronB]

That looks like you're using soy, because of the texture of the tops after burning. Parasoys like 6006 don't do that.

 

If you're using 464 then that's a lot of experimenting to get a good hot throw, most people ditch it and move onto something that has paraffin.

 

 

[TallPineCandles]

7 hours ago, BusyBee said:

 

Are you using GB464 instead of 6006?

On this test, yes.

[TallPineCandles]

9 hours ago, bfroberts said:

Add your FO at 185-190.  Stir a minute or two and pour.  You should be able to coax a throw from 6006 with most CS scents at 6%, especially the 3 leaf rated scents, with proper wicking.  More isn’t necessarily stronger.

It is important to cure for an appropriate length of time, despite what you may hear otherwise.  Also, where you burn your candle can affect what you smell depending on your particular space, air flow, a/c return, etc.  If you can smell it standing over it but it isn’t traveling thru your space, try moving the candle to another location.

I use a different wick type with 6006, but lots of people have success with CD wicks.  I’m hoping someone will chime in with a recommendation.  If you are reaching a full melt pool on your first burn, wick down a size or two.

Ok, I have read and each reply. I am dumping the VYBAR in my 6006. I took each recommendation and came up with what is below. Any suggestions?

• ·         OK, 16 oz IGI 6006 melted to 190.
• ·         Straight Sided Tumbler (Libbey; Height: 3.44 inches, Diameter: 3.06 inches) Wax Weight (to fill line) - 8.5 oz.
• ·         Wicked with a ECO 6 6" Pretabbed Wick (CS Recommended an ECO 8 6"”)
• ·         6% F/O added (CandleMakers Tobacco Vanilla)
• ·         Stirred F/O into wax for approximately 3-4 minutes.
• ·         Poured candles at approximately 170 (+/-)

Now I wait for 7-10 days to see if I can get a damn H/T…

 

 

Edited January 26, 2020 by TallPineCandles

[TallPineCandles]

Sorry, listed the wrong wick size for C/S recommendation 

[bfroberts]

1 hour ago, TallPineCandles said:

Ok, I have read and each reply. I am dumping the VYBAR in my 6006. I took each recommendation and came up with what is below. Any suggestions?

• ·         OK, 16 oz IGI 6006 melted to 190.
• ·         Straight Sided Tumbler (Libbey; Height: 3.44 inches, Diameter: 3.06 inches) Wax Weight (to fill line) - 8.5 oz.
• ·         Wicked with a ECO 6 6" Pretabbed Wick (CS Recommended an ECO 8 6"”)
• ·         6% F/O added (CandleMakers Tobacco Vanilla)
• ·         Stirred F/O into wax for approximately 3-4 minutes.
• ·         Poured candles at approximately 170 (+/-)

Now I wait for 7-10 days to see if I can get a damn H/T…

 

 

I’m not sure what kind of throw to expect from that FO.  Never used it.  If you want to try pouring some Candle Science scents, I’d be happy to recommend some that I know for a fact throw well in 6006.
 

The Eco 6 might be a little small, but there isn’t a huge difference in 6 & 8, so who knows.  You can always yank it and insert a bigger size if need be.  I’m still hoping someone will chime in with a recommendation for CD wicks since you also have those. It’s worth evaluating more than one wick type.  LX also work well in 6006, among others.  Good luck!  You’ll get there.

[TallPineCandles]

49 minutes ago, bfroberts said:

You can always yank it and insert a bigger size if need be.

 

Now I am REALLY confused...😂. What do you mean by "yanking it out"? The wick is attached to the jar with a wick sticker. Is there a way to do this? And please, recommend away on fragrances. I may already have them since I have spent a bajillion dollars on fragrances and wicks...LOL

[bfroberts]

48 minutes ago, TallPineCandles said:

 

Now I am REALLY confused...😂. What do you mean by "yanking it out"? The wick is attached to the jar with a wick sticker. Is there a way to do this? And please, recommend away on fragrances. I may already have them since I have spent a bajillion dollars on fragrances and wicks...LOL

 

If you have an apple corer, search the forum for “wickectomy”.  If not, grab some pliers, get a really good grip on the wick and you can pull it out of the tab.  Then insert another wick in the hole.  
 

There are a ton of scents from CS that throw well in 6006.  Off the top of my head:  MacApple, Oakmoss & Amber, Pineapple Sage, Orange & Chili Pepper, Rain Water, Sea Salt & Orchid, Christmas Hearth, Fresh Coffee, Fallen Leaves, all the pumpkins, Banana Nut Bread, Blueberry Cobbler, Snickerdoodle, Chardonnay, Lemon Pound Cake, Jamaica Me Crazy, Coriander & Tonka, Blue Spruce, Cinnamon Bun, Raspberry Sangria, Strawberry Guava, Mistletoe, Med. Fig, Black Sea, etc.  Most of them really.

Edited January 26, 2020 by bfroberts
Mass typos

[TallPineCandles]

LOL....as I said, I have most of those on your list. Been using them in 464 up until this point. I will need to dive into "wickectomy" and become a wickemoligst...LOL. Thank you for all your help. I am very grateful for you putting up with me newness on here.

22 minutes ago, bfroberts said:

If you have an apple corer, search the forum for “wickectomy”.  If not, grab some pliers, get a really good grip on the wick and you can pull it out of the tab.  Then insert another wick in the hole.

 

[TallTayl]

vybar is not the magic bullet a lot of groups claim it to be. It is a polymer that “glues” fragrance to the wax base to allow the base to hold more FO.  Too little may have no effect.  Too much and it will lock that fragrance in to the wax never to appear in the air. imagine vybar as craft glue, wax as paper and glitter as your Fo. If you want to “glitter bomb” someone, would you use a lot of gorilla glue to tack down the glitter? Sure, you can hold a LOT of glitter with gorilla glue, but it I’ll be locked into place until the end of time no matter how much energy you put into shaking it loose. On the other hand, use a slightly tacky temporary glue stick and that glitter will hold for a little while and free itself with a little energetic “throw” from your hand. 
 

The recommended amount of vybar is fractions of a teaspoon per pound of wax added while melting the wax, blending extremely well. your commercially prepared wax blend has all it needs to create a successful candle. The rest is up to your choices of vessel, fragrance and wick.

 

you have been given excellent advice up thread by people who have mastered the wax. 6006 Can be a great wax all by itself out of the box. 6% is plenty of most FO’s if wicked well and in the type of container that works with the wax and wick. 
 

if you get throw in the melt pot, an not in the burning candle, your wick is the most likely culprit. If you scoop some wax out of the candle and put in a wax melter (treat it like a melt) and can smell it, then your wick is definitely the culprit.   It could be too hot for the fo, believe it or not. Recently I dropped down to a paper core 44-24-18 wick in a 3” wide jar as a Hail Mary pass in an otherwise failing candle and man that thing fills an entire house and wafts outside at just 5%.
 

Bigger melt pools are NOT automatically better. 
 

here’s a reason why the smaller wick “might” be the answer. The wax melts at a particular rate.  The flame is able to consume at a given rate and burns at a given temperature range.  If the melt pool grows too big for the wick to consume in a balanced manner, the temperature of the wax at the point of combustion (near the wick) may drop to a temp too low to throw it into the air. THAT point, at the wicks edge is where the throw usually is designed to happen. You may need to experiment with different wick series to achieve the perfect final candle.  Invest in a sample pack of as many different wicks as you can. Test them all until you find the magic combo. 
 

The base of the flame of the wick draws up fuel and burns it. The wax and FO vaporize at that point creating the throw, Not the melt pool itself. if the temperature at that point is too low you won’t get the throw you want. The air might not become heated enough at that point to Create a strong current to circulate up and out of the vessel. The flame might look pretty with the under combusted fuel, but the smell will stay at the surface of the candle, or it might create carbon. 
 

Your choice of vessel and wax (and of course FO) each plays a big role In the success of your candle. Play to the strengths of your wax and most of the problem solves itself.
 

to complete the explanation, the Opposite problem I see more than anything: if the wick is too “hot” and uses a melt pool to create convection then you tend to get a burning wax smell over the fragrance.  The more volatile compounds in fragrance will get into the air and burn out, making the second and later burns smell less like the expensive fragrance, and more like just a wax candle burning. 

[TallTayl]

Here’s a link to my YouTube for a quick wickectomy.

 

[TallTayl]

And one where the tab was affixed with a wick sticker.

 

[Candybee]

TT's advice is spot on. I had been making the same candle for years then recently went a wick size down and lowered my FO load from 6% down to 5%. It made a huge difference. I got a much better, stronger scent throw than I had already been getting. I always thought it was a good candle and stopped testing. Besides, my customers were always telling me how much they loved my candles. So I could have gone on without making any changes. But using TT's suggestion I switched to less FO and the next size smaller wick. Those two small changes made a huge difference and turned a good candle into the perfect candle!

 

A nice side effect is that I use less FO and save money. Part of running a candle biz is to control your costs where you can if you want to stay in business. I never understood how some folks put a 10% FO load in their candles and stay in business. My guess is they don't. This is a very high turnover industry and I see lots of candle makers fail on the business end. Many brag about their high FO loads, then next year you never hear from them again.