Kerven

Even after it cooled, it was noticably softer than Candlewic's coconut/apricot. Looks like I'll need to test the coconut83 to see if it works at the same ratios I've been using. Might need to add a blend of stearic and beeswax. It's also noticably darker than Candlewic's, which is pure white like shortening. Is it me or does coconut83 have an odd odor? It almost smells rancid or similar to old fryer oil... maybe even fried takeout eggrolls. I'm a little concerned that the scent may carry over to the finished candle. If I have the time, I'll whip up a few testers tomorrow. 50/50 (coconut, soy) and maybe a blend including stearic and beeswax. I'm thinking the beeswax will do better in a high coconut blend but I'm curious to see how a higher percentage (~10-15%) of stearic will do in the soy to offset the soy issues. Wicks will be ECO 4 and ECO 6. Maybe ECO 8, depending on how much beeswax and/or stearic are in the second blend. Not sure about FO's.

@ShineOn I aim to pour around 185F, but I lose too much heat while dying and scenting and end up pouring closer to 175F. I haven't tried Cal's wax yet. It arrived today. For shipping from California to Virginia, it was surprisingly fast and not as pricey as I thought it would be. Although, while unpackaging, I had one of those moments where I realized I messed up. Took the beeswax out of the box and it was a little soft and sticky... that's ok, maybe it's just the wax. Took the stearic acid out... not soft, not melted, as good as new - great! Started to take the coconut wax out only to realize that it was a little... misshapen. Pulled it out... yep, squishy. Needless to say, it melted a bit during shipping. Good thing I didn't order that in July or August. That's what I get for ordering a soft wax from the west coast. I want to say that the coconut83 from Cal has the same texture and hardness as Candlewic's coconut/apricot blend, but since it's still warm and squishy, I can't say for sure. The firmer spots are very close. It does appear to be a bit more off-white in color than Candlewic's blend. I'm hoping it hardens up, because if I have to slice this giant slab, which has the consistency of undercooked fudge... I'm not going to be thrilled. Maybe if I melted it and poured it into soap molds for easy measuring?

Some of those do sound very nice. Pumpkin Seeds & Oud's description sounds like my type of scent. How are Lonestar's FO's in general? I'm trying to convince myself that I don't need to try the new sampler.

@ShineOn Preheating is too much of a hassle for me. I'd have to either heat jars one-by-one with a heat gun while my wax cools too much or try carrying a hot tray of jars from the kitchen to my work area... without shattering anything. Come to think of it, I'm not certain my oven goes below 170F. I guess I could cut it off and then put the glass in but that would slow my process down quite a bit. Could it be possible that pouring at a lower temperature may have caused the coconut and stearic to cool too fast around the wick and crack internally? Anyone else notice that Candlewic's coconut/apricot blend is sold out? I had to order coconut83 from California Candle Supply.

I'm curious to see whether or not surfactants, defoamer/antifoaming agents, and viscosity adjusters can alter the surface tension of the melt pool in heavy waxes enough for better throw. It wouldn't fix wax and wick incompatibilities, I imagine, but might boost throw in viscous waxes. I think one of the reasons people like the coconut waxes so much is that they are much lighter and less viscous than the soy waxes and have supposedly better throw. Just theorycrafting. I read not long ago that C3's performance could be improved with the addition of fatty alcohols.

Awfully similar to the issues I had with the coconut/apricot blend. The only solution I could find for that was increasing viscosity through blending. Any thoughts on the use of calcium stearate in soy? My notes on additives say that it's used to increase melt pool size temperature by allowing the wax to transfer and absorb more heat. I'm wondering if it would aid convection.

@TallTaylAm I understanding correctly that it's the temperature of the melt pool that's throwing things off? The new soys are melting too easily, requiring wicking down from the usual, and due to the smaller wicks the melt pools are too cool for a proper hot throw? I have noticed in the past that scents which performed poorly in candles did very well in melts (CS Beach Linen). Huh... now I know why. That's an interesting thought, that MP temps have a large impact on throw. Something I hadn't considered before. Now, I wonder whether it's the FO or the wax that determines the optimal MP temperature. The thought of having to test not only wick performance but MP temperature as well is... daunting. Would an infrared thermometer reliably measure the temperature of an MP? I used mine on a candle that had been burning 3hr and a melter that had been on for 2hr. Candle MP: ~120F. Melter: ~170F. Same FO blend, which has been getting good reviews on throw, same wax. Melter was much more fragrant and scented a room five (at least) times faster. I'm not certain how much of that has to do with MP surface area being larger with the melter than with the candle.

@ShineOnI'm having issues with wet spots as well. The coconut wax may be more suited to hot pouring around 180F. Commercial production often uses a hot pour with fans from the bottom and sides for a quick cool down. That might be worth trying - a quick cool down. I've been using felt sleeves I made for insulating soy candles as they cool, so that may be why I'm seeing a few little spots the day after - slower cooling. Well, that, and I'm using thick jars that aren't preheated, which causes the wax to instantly solidify on contact. Although, my testers, which have been sitting in a room that can frequently change five degrees in either direction, now have massive wet spots. They seem to be sensitive to changes in room temperatures, moreso than pure soy candles. For a more predictable wax that doesn't frost, isn't paraffin, has a good hot throw, doesn't wash out colors, and is easier to wick... I think I can overlook the wet spots. Now, to find a reasonably affordable supplier of frosted or darkly colored jars. @ComfortandJoyI wish I could remember where but I did read something a while back (a year or two) about the GB soys not blending well with beeswax. A coconut/beeswax blend sounds tempting... the cost of a coconut/beeswax candle doesn't. Stearyl alcohol and coconut wax might work, but I imagine that's going to be more costly than a stearic acid blend. If you do try a coconut and stearic blend, please post about it! I'm very curious to read how that turns out.

Apple Harvest - #1 go-to for fall apple scent that can carry over to Christmas Wassail White Birch - fantastic on its own, good for blending Toasted Pumpkin Spice - nice on its own but not as strong and spicy as I'd have liked, potential for blending Cinnamon Chai - this was iffy for me, requiring several weeks cure, but the scent was great Cinnamon and Vanilla - I left a single unwrapped tart of this in my supply cabinet and when I opened it a week later... woah. Very strong and heavy on the cinnamon without being overwhelming, just how I like it. Fraser Fir

For me, scents such as CS White Birch blend well with cranberry, clove, and citrus scents. I did a test blend of CS White Birch and CS Cranberry Woods - it was good! Maybe CS White Birch with a grapefruit FO and something spicy... anise, clove, or nutmeg? Or warm vanilla and juniper berry? White Birch, cedar, cinnamon, and citrus...

Is the white beeswax synthetic? I've been thinking about ordering from CS, but the reviews claiming it has a manufactured scent make me wonder if it's faux beeswax. I was under the impression that the white wax is processed to have the color and natural scent removed. The other day I discovered synthetic beeswax (in both yellow and white forms) while searching for an apricot wax manufacturer. Now, I'm a bit cautious about beeswax in general. Any particular suppliers known to sell actual beeswax?

Good work! That blend, assuming the hot throw wasn't impacted too much, should be a decent substitution until finding a non-soy blend. That is, if you're aiming to eventually go soy-free. Are you hot pouring? Are there wet spots? The 50/50 blend is giving me slight hang up and a lot of shrinkage after burning.

Mostly the wicks. Throw doesn't seem too off. A few fragrances, that were fine before, are giving me minor problems (lemon, cinnamon, and chocolate scents so far) but its manageable. On the other hand, some of the fragrances I've had trouble with before are performing better (heavier florals and vanillas). I wouldn't say it's a terribly large difference but it is there.

@GailCI like mango as fruit, but the mango FO's that I've tried (and some I've smelled in stores)... are just foul. A bright, cloying sweetness covering up a rancidity which lurks in the background. That's the best description I can come up with. Some say one bad apple doesn't necessarily ruin the bunch, but after trying Peak's Sweet Mango Delight I have to disagree. If I'm out smelling candles somewhere and see one that's mango scented, I have to skip it. I will admit that I once caught a whiff of a mango scent that was fairly nice. I didn't get the scent name but it smelled like... mango, apples, maybe pineapple, something creamy in the base, and a hint of something "green" and herbal. It didn't have that unpleasant rancid note but did have that bright sweetness. I looked at the description for Coco Mango. It sounds tempting, but... the mango. I just can't get over it. I too have someone who loves Peak's Gardenia. It has a very strong cold and hot throw. However, it smells too much like lilies to me and I'm not a fan of lilies' fragrance. My gardenia bushes have a rich, buttery, floral sweetness with a slight hint of musk that almost borders on cloying. Not a piercing floral that smells as though it could strip paint OOB or be used as a sanitizer. I like turnips! I loathe radishes, except prepared horseradish. Cilantro is another one of those things that people either like or dislike with a passion.

EBB Exotic Amazon Teakwood EBB Hollyberry CS Whiskey - I'm not a fan of whiskey and I'm definitely not a fan of this FO. Gag-worthy. CS Montego Bay - Cringe. That's all I can do when I smell this. No wonder they don't carry it now. CS Mango and Tangerine Peak Gardenia - My gardenia bushes do -not- smell like this. It's so strong, piercing, and noxious. Peak Sweet Mango Delight Mango scents in general - If you could split the scents of garbage, spoiled poultry and/or vomit into their individual scent components, mango would be one of them. Bleh! Peak Mary Jane - It's as if someone slipped a bit of skunkweed into a floral arrangement.

I've had to wick down two sizes in 464. I'm currently using 464 from Lot F of Feb. 2017.

I wouldn't say that it cuts the hot throw. I wasn't too crazy about the hot throw of this coconut/apricot blend after a bit of testing, although, I may not have cured the candles long enough. I usually give a 3 day cure when testing with this wax. Some FO's seemed weak and others were great. I guess, like soy, some FO's are going to work and others aren't. The 50/50 blend, for me, had a good cold throw and good hot throw after a three day cure at 8% FO. Two 2.5" jars fully scented a roughly 144sqft room. Maybe a single candle to fully scent the room if I give them a two week cure. I found that blending soy with coconut helps cut down on that waxy lit candle smell (I'm not fond of melted soy's scent) of full soy candles, and the scents seem "cleaner" and more robust. Does beeswax do well with fragrance throw? I'm glad to be rid of those rough tops after burning soy candles. Coconut also seems to be suited for hot pouring as well, so no having to wait until it cools to a certain temperature or adjusting pour temps around the weather. More reasons to switch from soy.

@MoonstarThe sparkle light from Peak was a pain on its own. Even with holes poked and topping off, I still got huge cavernous spots in the center of the candle. Probably due to my inexperience with palm. I wasn't able to find my notes for the testing but I did find one partially burned candle leftover. The label says 80/20, soy/palm, 6% FO, CS lavender dye chip, and ECO 10. There were small air pockets around the melt pool, so I lit it again to see what would happen. More air pockets, some tunneling, and the hang up from before wouldn't melt. Now, I know why I saved it: a reminder to not do that again. If I do give it another try, I'd use a 90/10 blend and something other than sparkle light palm. @ShineOnThe jars I used for the coconut/soy testing were 2.5". (I'm having a newbie moment.) I haven't tried a larger jar yet, but the idea makes me curious. I haven't thought of this before. If the larger sizes of wicks are producing undesirable flames, does it matter what size the jar is? If an ECO 2 in a 2.5" jar produces an ideal flame, yet larger sizes in the same jar do not, then wouldn't using a larger size in a larger jar produce undesirable flames... especially if the problems noted are happening before a complete melt pool? Wouldn't that be a quality of the wax - that only a particular wick works in it - and not so much the size of the jar? Doesn't the size of the jar only matter when considering melt pool formation? I've gone and confused myself again. I think I'm going to try a larger jar tomorrow to see what happens. I'm hoping I don't have to trial a variety of wick styles again...

@ShineOn Where 100% coconut/apricot was a bit too much for the smallest ECO size I could get, the 75/25 blend gave me a decent burn with the same size (ECO 2). Upping the soy to a 50/50 blend allowed me to move up to ECO 4 and 6 for a good burn. I used different scents for each blend so I can't make a comparison on hot throw. The cold throw in the 50/50 blend with CS Pumpkin Caramel Crunch had me wondering if I needed to light a candle at all. The 70/30 and 60/40 are good starting points. I think you'll have better results with those. Keep us updated. @Moonstar For me, Candlewic's coconut/apricot blend on its own was rapidly consumed in comparison to 464. I don't know if it was due to the styles of wick used (CD and ECO) or if it was a property of the wax. The wicks were burning very hot. It seems the other coconut waxes are more slowly consumed. Those ribbon wicks do look cool. I think Northwood suggests using those with their coconut wax. I'd have to see one in action before giving them a try. The thought of a larger, wider flame in coconut wax makes me a little anxious. That pillar/tart blend is a bit pricey... a little too pricey for my tarts. @pcbrookI've been using Candle Science's liquid dyes to color mine. The coconut/apricot blend is quite white on its own, slightly translucent, and doesn't frost so it holds colors well. If I'm working with red dye, I know I'm not as likely to end up with pink as I would with soy. Speaking of palm wax, I haven't tried that yet. I did soy and palm (sparkle light), and that was... frustrating. Apparently, I needed to poke relief holes. Hot throw was amazing, however. Haven't touched it since. Anyone have any success blending the two?

Oooh, how did the wood wicks turn out? I've seen some retailers using those in coconut wax candles. Beeswax was next on my list to try blending with coconut. Had a hunch that hardening the coconut wax might lessen the wild flames, and people use coconut oil with beeswax so why not. I'd like to get my hands on other natural waxes but the list of suppliers here is very short compared to those in Europe. They have canola, almond and all sorts of things to play with. I'm a little jealous.

The coconut wax from C&S is a coconut/soy blend, as is the coconut from Northwood. I'm not certain what the percentage of soy is in the C&S blend. I'd guess it's a proprietary blend with a higher % of soy. The Northwood blend is 90% coconut with the rest being palm and soy. Another proprietary blend, I'd guess... but maybe coconut 83 in disguise? Coconut 83 by ACCU-Blend (Accu-Pure 83), sold by Calcandlesupply, who also claims that it is mostly coconut wax, is a coconut blend that contains vegetable and soy waxes. Candlewic's coconut blend contains apricot and a small amount of paraffin. They supposedly blend their own, so I'm not familiar with the percentages. Northwood's high percentage of coconut might explain the mushrooming. I had both these issues - large flame, smoke/mushrooming - with Candlewic's coconut/apricot blend. However, I did manage to "tame" it by mixing with soy. I've found that, as the percentage of soy increases, coconut/soy blends are much easier to wick in comparison to straight coconut. That may be due to my familiarity with working with soy. Nevertheless, I'm testing 75/25 and 50/50 blends of my own creation with ECO wicks and the results are very promising. I'd suggest blending the coconut wax with soy. Since coconut 83 already has a bit of soy in it, I'd start with a 60/40 blend, coconut to soy. The soy you use may have an impact. I used 464 with my blends. Personally, I think blending spares the headache of trying to wick a high percentage coconut. To add to that, you get properties from both waxes depending on the ratio.

Are these the long, serpentine wicks seen in some shallow oblong candles? I always thought those were made of some sort of metallic or wooden mesh. I have been eyeballing those ribbon wicks from Northwood for use in coconut wax, but if they burn hot that's out of the question.

CS Toasted Pumpkin Spice CS Apple Harvest CS Candied Apple CS Cinnamon and Vanilla CS Macintosh Apple RE Autumn Spice RE Pumpkin Creme Brulee RE Falling Leaves (smells like a strong earl grey tea to me) RE Sweet Potato Spice RE Coffee House Flaming's Irish Cream Coffee Flaming's Witches Brew Flaming's Autumn Night Candlewic Apple Cider Donut EBB Sweet Pumpkin Peak's (soon to be Keystone's, I hope) Pumpkin Honey Chai

Is that a woodwick? If so, do you prime yours?

Do you happen to know the lot number of the wax? I'm hoping this isn't the beginnings of a new Lot F.