new supply of GG Palm is different

[Wessex]

OK, think I have the nightmare scenario. Just got a new case of GG Palm from the usual supplier. Poured last night and the wax is different . Tried several different pours with tested recipes, at different pour temps, just in case. But wax is not the same. Supplier is same, all info on case is same from manufacturer, but is a new batch. Called the supplier and they said they have had no complaints and the wax is in tolerances.

So instead of showing a nice crystal pattern, the new stuff is much more opaque with very small crystalline structure. You can kinda see the large crystal formation, but is obscured by the small crystalline structures. (kinda like it was poured into a cold container, if you know what I mean) I also noticed that it set up alot slower as it cooled. It remained liquid much longer than the previous batches. Kinda reminds me of the "crystal" palm wax that some other manufacturers sell.

So I am thinking that the past months of testing are not worth a damn now. I hate to have to test everything all over again. If it comes down to that, I quit ! Anybody ever had this problem? Am I totally screwed, or what? Rant, rant, rant.

Steve

[mparadise]

Where did you get it from? The reason I ask is that a little while back (laast spring maybe??) CandleScience was out of stock for a little while. When I called to get an ETA they said they were waiting for a new batch because the batch they received didn't pass their quality control's testing and it had been sent back to the manufacturer. I am wondering if another vendor didn't test and ended up with some of that batch.

[mparadise]

Another thought....what temp did you heat to? Sometimes when I am not paying attention as well as I should and it gets +10ish from my normal temp it can affect the way it crystalizes/sets up.

[Wessex]

This is from CS, they just got it in about a week ago. I actually poured it at 3 different temps and had the same outcome each time. I have found that GG is not as touchy as some people think when it comes to pouring temps. I've poured from 205 down to 175 and pattern comes out the same. Cooling is where there is a difference.

Cheers,

Steve

Edited September 29, 2010 by Wessex

[mparadise]

Hmmm. I get mine there too. I agree it isn't TOO touchy. I usually melt to 195-200 and pour as soon as I have everything mixed. If my jars aren't warmed I just hit the outside of the jar with the heat gun before it sets up completely and it is all good.

If there is a problem I hope it gets resolved quickly!

[soy327]

Is it powdery? It should be, I had a bad experience with starburst I bought, It was marked Starburst but was GG I was trying to make pillars out of it:laugh2::laugh2::laugh2:until Top suggested maybe it was the wrong wax, after investigation :laugh2:It was. Call your supplier and ask, no insist and send them a picture.

Edited September 30, 2010 by soy327

[Wessex]

It's definately GG. Comes case packed from manufacturer. SAW 2268.

Cheers,

Steve

[vagabond66]

Steve,

I just received a few 55# bags yesterday from the new batch so I'll let you know if I have the same results. Will be making a call to CS if they are.

[lovemylabs]

Just great. I almost got a sick feeling when I read your post Steve. We've been testing our fist bag of GG and are really feel confident about how we are doing. Then, to jump on here and read your post. This brings back the memories of the GW464 issues we had in the spring...nothing worked, no matter how hard we tried and then realized everybody was having issues. So, I understand your frustration. It just ticks ya off because so much time and money has been put into something...and for what? Lets hope that vagabond66 does not have any issues and see what their results are. Let us know if you decide to call CS and what their response is. Crap... I was just about to order more!

[Wessex]

I did talk to the people at CS. As always, they were nice and helpful, but did not really have an answer. They are supposed to email me if they come up with anything. They said they tested it and it performed like it was supposed to do. I have a few candles poured with recipes I know work well, just waiting a day or two to burn them. Will let you know if things are different.

Here is something else interesting about the new batch. I poured some candles last night, and just for giggles decided to not cover them as they cooled ( I usually cover). They actually turned out better! The crystalization showed more clearly and they actually looked pretty good (but still different than previous batches). Hopefully things will be just fine and I am freaking out for nothing.

Cheers,

Steve

[vagabond66]

Steve,

Would you mind posting a pic or two of the new ones you made...maybe compared to how they usually turn out? I'll do the same with the ones I just poured and post once they cool off.

Thanks,

Jeff

[Wessex]

The old batch in on left, the new batch on right. Yes, they are different colours. Poured exactly the same, cooled exactly the same.

Edited September 30, 2010 by Wessex

[vagabond66]

[ATTACH]20677[/ATTACH] The pink and silver candles were made with the old batch.

[ATTACH]20678[/ATTACH] The orange and dark pink/red candles were made with the new batch.

I'm going to give CS a call to see if they've changed their story about the new batch of wax. This is obviously a different crystal pattern and not nearly as vibrant as the old. The larger crystal pattern is there like you said but it is being filled in by smaller crystals It almost looks like a cross between Glass Glow and Frost Palm or Crystal Palm.

[Wessex]

I'm glad to see it is not just me. Test burning a few right now to see if they burn differently. I will be PO'ed if they do!!! So far HT appears to be same. Thank the gods for small favors.

[Wessex]

This is under the description for the GG palm. Don't know if it is a new addition or not, don't remember seeing it before. But it may have been there before.

This wax is 100% natural, and therefore may produce some slight variations in appearance. While we quality test every batch produced, you may experience textures slightly different than what is shown in our picture.

Not getting a warm, fuzzy feeling. Still have not heard from them about my concern.

Cheers,

Steve

[grama]

From the pictures it makes me think of the frost palm, which personally I liked best!!

[vagabond66]

As far as I can tell, GG has had the same pattern since 2007 so I really hope this is just a fluke that the pattern looks like this with this batch. I placed an order with Peak for a few cases of their GG to replace this stuff.

[Candybee]

That looks just like the crystal container palm I used to get from C&S before I started using GG from CS. The difference in the crystal patterns is huge. This definitely is not the same product if its creating such different patterns. I hope you get answers from CS. They really need to address this. I get my wax from them too and if you can't get an answer that may mean many of us will have to look elsewhere for our GG.

Have you tried emailing them those pics of the pattern diff? Maybe seeing those will help your case. Good luck!

[Judy, USMC]

This wax is 100% natural, and therefore may produce some slight variations in appearance. While we quality test every batch produced, you may experience textures slightly different than what is shown in our picture.

Not getting a warm, fuzzy feeling. Still have not heard from them about my concern.

I'd say that the variation in the new batch is more than "slight." It still is a nice pattern and appealing ... but not really as impressive as the old stuff ... especially if you are used to seeing the larger pattern.

[mparadise]

That looks like the crystal palm I used to get from Candlewic. I am wondering if it was possibly mislabeled at the manufacturer????

[Wessex]

I found a small bag of Crystal Palm wax I had from many moons ago from C&S and made a pour. Same stuff! Looks like somebody, somewhere screwed up. Still have not heard from CS about the issue, which is unusual. I am PO'ed because getting the wax from CS is so much cheaper (and faster - 1 day shipping if I did not pick up) than where I used to get it. Oh, and after many months (and many cases) of testing, I was geared up to do some major pouring this weekend. Now what am I supposed to do? Actually go outside and enjoy the sunshine that finally showed up after 10 inches of rain . Oh, well, it will work out. Anyone want to buy about 45 pounds of CRYSTAL Palm wax, LOL.

Cheers,

Steve

[vagabond66]

I sent off an email to CS Support and attached the two photos I loaded here in hopes for some kind of an explanation or refund. The difference in the crystal patterns is just too great. The wax also sets up differently and dips slightly in the middle as it cools which doesnt happen with the GG.

[mparadise]

I am guessing this is all that CS has instock so you might try calling C&S with your lot # from the bag and see if they can tell you if they have a different lot # in stock. If I had to bet, either the manufacturer mislabeled the bags.

[vagabond66]

Yup you're correct in that this new CS shipment is all they have. Apparently they tested it back in July before they would accept the shipment and the results were within acceptable standards. I'm not sure exactly what these standards are and the gal on the phone wouldn't fill me in on them. She did say that she would pass the pics I sent to the folks that do the testing for them to see and email the responses back to me on Monday sometime. According to her though, the wax passes as Glass Glow as long as it showed some form of vertical crystal structure forming....which it does it's just not very pronounced and it's also filled in by all these smaller crystals which also makes it harder to see. As I stated earlier though, Peak still has some of the older batch so if you're in need you may want to get with them and place an order before they run out.

[Wessex]

So it passed their tests. Good for them. It does not come close to passing mine. Burns slightly different, takes color different, and is no way acceptable to me as Glass Glow Palm wax. I am getting the feeling they are not prepared to make this right. I have been nothing but happy with all aspects of CS. I hope this does not signal a beginning of the mighty dollar trumping their customer service! Hopefully they will figure out some way to do the right thing here. I have not asked them for anything, other to aknowledge that this is not GG Palm. So far they have not stepped up.

Cheers,

Steve