Can you direct me to the right thread ?

[jamie]

I have read post about the customers asking "where do you get your stuff ?" and ? "I've been wanting to make candles, what do you use?" I have someone who kept on, and on with the questions. She said she bought some jars and wanted to making candles, when she heard I did, she bugged me to death. She got my phone number and said she would be calling me and come over to talk candle stuff What am I supposed to do ?

I didn't know what to say. I want to be nice, but not reveal my secret stuff. I don't want to hurt their feelings.

I need to know what you tell people who want to know where we get our stuff, or how we make this or that particular candle.

I did a search, but I'm not sure how to find this. I'd appreciate any advice.

Jamie

[Fire and Ice]

Tell her to do HER OWN research like you did but don't say anything else. She'll go away. Newbies have got to learn to do their own research. Heck, I didn't even have the internet when I learn to make soy candles. They have got to learn from their own mistakes and successes. But be sure to tell her it cost lots of money, there's lots of testing involved and that she must have good libablity insurance. She'll probably quit right then and there!

Fire:cool2:

[BruceCarvesWax]

Tell her Yankee has a toll free number she can call and get all the information she needs from them.

Her---> OH they wont tell me anything because their a business and its a trade secret which i understand. You------> and I should tell you my hard earned secrets because why???

Or you could be nice and give her a free candle, of course the scent on the jar should read "eat sh*t and die". :laugh2:

Sorry i'm tired and act up when i need sleep.

Bruce

[SunshineSundries]

Tell her Yankee has a toll free number she can call and get all the information she needs from them.

Her---> OH they wont tell me anything because their a business and its a trade secret which i understand. You------> and I should tell you my hard earned secrets because why???

Or you could be nice and give her a free candle, of course the scent on the jar should read "eat sh*t and die". :laugh2:

Sorry i'm tired and act up when i need sleep.

Bruce

You go, Bruce! I'm going to have to make myself one of those candles.... LOL

[SatinDucky]

Tell her Yankee has a toll free number she can call and get all the information she needs from them.

Her---> OH they wont tell me anything because their a business and its a trade secret which i understand. You------> and I should tell you my hard earned secrets because why???

Or you could be nice and give her a free candle, of course the scent on the jar should read "eat sh*t and die". :laugh2:

Sorry i'm tired and act up when i need sleep.

Bruce

ROFL! Must be past your bedtime

Added: I have had a few who ask about making candles, but none be an actual pest. I tell them to begin with that it took around a year and $2k in research and testing before I even came close to having a quality candle. Explain that it's not like baking, there is no exact recipe. Two people can try the exact same thing and end up with completely different results. I suggested googling suppliers and informations sites to get started. They usually just shake their head and say "oh, wow" and walk away

[jillgunter]

I would tell her your supplier has like some huge min order. If shes really insistant on candlemaking, just tell her one of the suppliers so she leaves you alone. When she sees how much it costs in shipping buying wax maybe she will go back to buying candles somewhere lol.

[jldorrington]

direct her to a bad supplier... search for the suppliers with the worst customer service.. that'll teach her..

or go with bruce's idea its the best so far LMAO

[debscent]

Actually I don't see a problem with this at all. We share information on this board freely every day, why not to someone visibly in front of you. You can't be that nervous about competition. I started out without knowing about this board, and someone I had bought candles from was very encouraging and even offered to help me learn. I am thankful for her patience and ability to answer endless questions. She is no longer making candles--but I am.

[Joanne]

I make and sell soap and tell 'customers' who want to know who my suppliers are that 'it varies'. If they are too persistent I name the highest price supplier in my area that I know of. I have a neighbor (not a good friend by any means) that pestered me over and over again to show her how I make soap. I was vague and finally told her that when I make my batches I begin at 4:00 a.m. and that I really don't want anyone over that early because I didn't want to wake up the entire household. Although I've altered my schedule to make soap with friends I wasn't going to do the same for her. For other 'customers' I will suggest one book and tell them that is the way I learned how to make it - they can do the same. It takes money and lots of practice. I don't think you need to be rude especially if there is a friendship or a potential sale involved. You are still a business and need to keep that in mind.

[jamie]

Thanks for the advice. I am sure she will come by or call. She seemed very persistant even though I "tried" to blow her off nicly. I think I will do like you said, give her one supplier and tell he to google. I too have spent 6 years and at least 2k trying and testing. I may give her this board site so she can read herself. But I will tell her that my exact candle combo is a family secret. That commercial comes to mind with the baked beans and the dog ! So we as candle makers aren't the only one who protects our creation !!

It just makes me so nervous when I get questioned like a criminal. I'm not the type who can just come back with a fast remark that will shut them up.

I'll let you know how it turns out when she comes a callin'

Jamie

[Scented]

LMAO Bruce!! You're always hilarious.

Pretty simple with the gal ... hand her a business card that says: www.google.com If you must explain anything to her, just say normally I'm not a violent individual, but you do understand if I tell you my secrets I will have to kill you. Or if you just point her to google, tell her to come back when she is done with that and then hand her another card for a search engine.

[BruceCarvesWax]

Well, I got 8+ hours of sleep.... and I STILL like my idea best!

:laugh2:

She may not realize that she is even being rude by asking those questions. Just like everyone comes here and expects everyone else to give them ALL the answers. If shes brave enough to ask I would be brave enough to just plain out tell here the TRUTH. You worked and spent too much time to just give your findings away to everyone.

Bruce

[Crowded House]

Just do it really politely so you don't potentially offend any bystanders.

[prairieannie]

Actually I don't see a problem with this at all. We share information on this board freely every day, why not to someone visibly in front of you. You can't be that nervous about competition. I started out without knowing about this board, and someone I had bought candles from was very encouraging and even offered to help me learn. I am thankful for her patience and ability to answer endless questions. She is no longer making candles--but I am.

LOL, and if I were you, I'd be careful cause someone may be saying this EXACT same thing about you one day. Loose lips sink ships!!

NO harm at all in encouraging someone, and helping a fellow chandler out, but .. well, if it has to be explained, it will lose something in the translation, so I'll just leave it. And before I get jumped on by anyone, I fully realize that the mentor could have many many reasons for not making candles anymore. Just kind of makes one wonder though no?

[debscent]

LOL, and if I were you, I'd be careful cause someone may be saying this EXACT same thing about you one day. Loose lips sink ships!!

NO harm at all in encouraging someone, and helping a fellow chandler out, but .. well, if it has to be explained, it will lose something in the translation, so I'll just leave it. And before I get jumped on by anyone, I fully realize that the mentor could have many many reasons for not making candles anymore. Just kind of makes one wonder though no?

I'm nice, but not stupid. LOL! She had a baby and lost her full time job...I'm not saying you have to lead them by the hand but sometimes introducing someone to some new "project" is paying it forward. If I were making perfume (for instance) and had "secret" methods, ingredients, yeah, they would be coveted.

[bugtussle]

Scented, I must have gotton this from you a while ago I use it everytime. "I'm not a violent individual, but you do understand if I tell you my secrets I will have to kill you.

They get the message!

Thanks, Carole

[NewOrleansLady]

I've had lots of people ask me and it strictly depends on how they ask. Sometimes after asking a few questions if they are truly wanting guidance I'll give them sites with starter kits but not if they come at me rude. Two ladies called one day very rudely...one called from one number and when we wouldn't give info out it seemed like she had a friend call up from a cell phone asking the same questions & literally demanding info...then they actually came to the shop and started saying how I must use at least 2oz. of scent cause they were strong etc.....I told them that the internet was open to anyone and they could do exactly what I did and Google and read read read. The woman flat out said...just tell me where you get your stuff...well she was rude first so I told her "This is MY business... so that makes it NONE of yours!" They finally left!

[David Fields]

We have had this problem for years. After trying to be nice and polite, we now say "NO". If they persist, we say "Look. It's our business and our livelihood. The answer is always going to be no". I have noticed that there are two kinds of people in our business. The ants and the grasshoppers. We give the grasshoppers nothing but a courteous no. They are simply looking for a way to make money without actually working. They want to quit their boring jobs, make tons of money with little effort, and stay home with the kids. That type never lasts very long as a chandler. The people we say no to are always offended, but what the heck. How do we not offend them unless we give them the supplies and make their candles for them. Not offending people is over-rated anyway.

[David Fields]

addendum: The week before Christmas a man came in and started asking questions while we were waiting on customers. The line had four customers in it, and he just came up to the counter and started asking. He has come in ofter because he is a distributor for gift things. We bougjht once from him to help him out, but the mdse was overpriced and of poor quality, so we had been telling him not interested. This time he says he wants to start a business here in the states and transfer it to Brazil where he wants to go as a missionary. He said it would be so good for the poor Brazilian children if we would just help him get started and maybe help him with supplies and things. My wife tried to be polite in front of the customers. My testosterone was up, so I couldn't spell nice. I said, "Kelly, the answer is NO". He asked why, and I told him loudly in front of the customers, "Because it is our business. Period." He was very embarassed and offended and left in a huff. To top it off, he brought his daughter with him. Guess he thought that would help. I am beginning to like the simple word "NO".

[NewOrleansLady]

David,

I love your thinking. Very simple and to the point....NO! Reminds me of a magnet I had on my fridge while my kids were growing up "Because I'm the Mom that's why." but the one that took it's place says it even better..."I have PMS and a .38...now do you really want to ask me a question????" Since I've gone thru menopause I now have a coffee mug that sits on my desk that says "That's Ms. Bitch to you!"

Gee, now that was a walk down memory lane! I don't guess I qualify for "mellowing with old age"...lol

[damsels_creations]

I have had a few people ask me how to do things and where I get supplies. I tell them that everything is shipped to me from out of state. I order my stuff online. Point them to candletech.com and say: Here is where I started learning and still am Learning from all the wonderful ladies and gents.

Even had a neighbor come over just as I was starting to make soap. Made her put gloves on, goggles, smock and tie her hair back. She had ask me to show how to make soap. I did have the forum up at the time to and told her to check it out when she got home. lol should have seen her. She asked Why all the gear.

Told her for her own safety, handed her the Handbook (Robins instructions and the instructions for HP) soap and told her to start reading while I finished gathering supplies. hmmm now that I think about it

That was about a week or two before Christmas and haven't seen her since.:undecided

Tammy

[Freezin]

LOL that was a good one Tammy. I have so many people ask me to show them how to make candles. They are usually not good friends because my good friends would feel rude asking because they know how much time and money it took to test and continue to test new stuff. I usually tell people I just don't have time to show you, but you could look it up on the net.

[Wildheart75]

My best friend wanted to make candles and as angry and disrespected as I felt at the time I showed her, she bought her supplies and came over and we made candles together. I wasn't going to give her false information or tell her to research it herself..I just showed her everything I do and gave her all the info she needed...she made her candles with my equipment but her supplies and she hasn't done it since. I felt angry and hurt at first but I believe in Karma.

I believe by telling people to research themselves like you did and giving them info on bad suppliers and most expensive suppliers is going to fall back on you. Candle making is a form of art...if all the great musicians refused to give people tips on how to play then music would practically disappear. Yeah it may be your business but you dont have to tell your exact solution and you dont have to be rude about it either. You can explain to them about this board, that there are many wax, wicks and fo combinations and not everyone who wants info on how to make candles is going to rush out and start a business. Even without testing and a ton of supplies just the cost of starting up a biz is much more than what most people can afford. Especially if they are looking to start right away. If you have a good quality product then why should you feel so threatened with a little competition?

You could also turn it into a positive by giving them lessons...for a fee of course. They also might be able to help you up your production, especially those with wholesale accounts. Most businessess start out as a mom and pop shop and then as they acquire more employees get bigger and turn more profit. This of course is just my

[BruceCarvesWax]

If you have a good quality product then why should you feel so threatened with a little competition?

That's how most people think at the hobby level but it does... or should change as you grow. You don't become as big as yankee and the others by giving out how you got there. Anyone that wants to learn candle making has tons of resources they can access with the click of a button. Much easier than I had it almost 30 years ago when I started. Ask any large successful company to give you their secrets on how they became that way and see what they say. Some of us just have too much invested in it to blab it all away to everyone that asks.

Sorry but its not miracle on 34th street, I don't believe in Santa and its not a perfect world.

Bruce

[doris]

Re: having a good quality product and feeling threatened by competition: most people wouldn't know good quality if it bit them on the nose. It would be so easy for someone to buy wax and wicks and make candles without any knowledge at all; then when they were sold and didn't burn or caught the house on fire, in the eyes of many people, this would reflect on all candlemakers. Most people probably wouldn't feel threatened by a good quality candlemaker unless they themselves were producing garbage, but the ones producing garbage are a threat to everyone.

Also, there is a learning curve involved with anything you do. I've been involved in the craft business for years, and knew people who would take 3 pottery lessons, start selling, and then wonder why no one wanted their stuff. They saw it as a quick money-making opportunity, and were uninterested in putting any real time into it. You have to learn first, and you have to do your own research for the most part. This is how you learn. When people come wanting quick answers, I for one would steer them in the right direction, but from then on it is up to them. How much they learn depends on how much effort they are willing to put into it.

Doris