KMB Posted July 1, 2021 Author Share Posted July 1, 2021 4 hours ago, ErronB said: I don't think 6006 is a good wax for new candle makers to learn with, it's a tough burner and has a high melt point so it's only going to confuse people trying to learn all the other moving parts involved. I hate soy with a passion and won't use it, but I learned years ago with 464 in tins and it was easy to figure out the wicking and other stuff. Thank you. I can appreciate that. I started with 464. I didn't like the appearance and no ht. Now I am waist deep in 6006. I have read good things about c3 that had tempter me but I am committed to figuring g 6006 out Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ErronB Posted July 1, 2021 Share Posted July 1, 2021 1 hour ago, KMB said: Thank you. I can appreciate that. I started with 464. I didn't like the appearance and no ht. Now I am waist deep in 6006. I have read good things about c3 that had tempter me but I am committed to figuring g 6006 out The problem is, if you don't have the knowledge of how to wick high melt point waxes in the first place you're literally just throwing yourself in the deep end, parasoy waxes like Problend 600 aren't so tough to burn and are easier to learn with if you want something similar to 6006. Good luck with your wicking journey, I remember going through it, it's tough. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NightLight Posted July 1, 2021 Share Posted July 1, 2021 Have to agree with ErronB. This takes a long time to master, there are many variables. I don’t like 6006 myself. As others have said pick a straight side jar, or glass no wider than three inches for practice. If 6006 is a stinker, then get samples of c3 and problend both at Flaming Candle to try. C3 has its own set of peculiarities FYI before you jump in. Sample packs of different types of wicks are good. Each wax like certain wicks with fragrance. Buy fragrance from reputable candle companies - not every fo is good in your wax. Some aren’t strong when burning, some are dang hard to wick. Keep your test candles 6-8 per cent with fo. Adding more fo does not make a better candle and the fragrance can leach out the top of your candle. Pick four fragrances you love for testing. It has to be simple, because it complicated. Once you understand different waxes, how they burn and throw and the qualities of wicks, you will be able to ,ale quality candles. You are not failing, learning. By the way, hahah I am waist deep in waxes. I have many many types in my workroom. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KMB Posted July 1, 2021 Author Share Posted July 1, 2021 8 hours ago, ErronB said: The problem is, if you don't have the knowledge of how to wick high melt point waxes in the first place you're literally just throwing yourself in the deep end, parasoy waxes like Problend 600 aren't so tough to burn and are easier to learn with if you want something similar to 6006. Good luck with your wicking journey, I remember going through it, it's tough. Isnt 6006 considered a parasoy? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BusyBee Posted July 2, 2021 Share Posted July 2, 2021 11 hours ago, KMB said: Isnt 6006 considered a parasoy? Yes. 6006 is a parasoy that might have been one of the best wax available back in the days when all other soy waxes had poor quality. Now it is one of the hardest wax to work with. Even hardest to achieve good HT 464 would be much easier than 6006. What others (including myself) are trying to tell you is that you are up for tougher challenge than 464. 6006 forms concave shape melt pool with thick hang up on the sides which sometimes get really deep(see below picture). With this kind of melt pool, it is going to impossible to have constant HT through out the candle life. I have tried about 50 different types of wick(*Candle suppliers sells only about 15 different types not counting wooden wicks.) with many different sizes, but none of them seems to be working well for 6006. HTP appears to be working best among many wicks, but HTP creates too strong air current which causes scent to be escaped to other rooms rather than filling up the room where candle is burning. Below picture is 464. 464 has great appearance when it is melted, mixed & poured at right temperature. Clean mirror like top after burn like in the picture can be only achieved by using the right wick. When you get that clean top after burn, then that is the wick that will produce great HT also. You might have noticed by now that candle making is not just matter of melt and pour & sticking a right wick. There are a lot more things that goes into candle making. Welcome to candle makers world and good luck with your journey! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KMB Posted July 2, 2021 Author Share Posted July 2, 2021 2 hours ago, BusyBee said: Yes. 6006 is a parasoy that might have been one of the best wax available back in the days when all other soy waxes had poor quality. Now it is one of the hardest wax to work with. Even hardest to achieve good HT 464 would be much easier than 6006. What others (including myself) are trying to tell you is that you are up for tougher challenge than 464. 6006 forms concave shape melt pool with thick hang up on the sides which sometimes get really deep(see below picture). With this kind of melt pool, it is going to impossible to have constant HT through out the candle life. I have tried about 50 different types of wick(*Candle suppliers sells only about 15 different types not counting wooden wicks.) with many different sizes, but none of them seems to be working well for 6006. HTP appears to be working best among many wicks, but HTP creates too strong air current which causes scent to be escaped to other rooms rather than filling up the room where candle is burning. Below picture is 464. 464 has great appearance when it is melted, mixed & poured at right temperature. Clean mirror like top after burn like in the picture can be only achieved by using the right wick. When you get that clean top after burn, then that is the wick that will produce great HT also. You might have noticed by now that candle making is not just matter of melt and pour & sticking a right wick. There are a lot more things that goes into candle making. Welcome to candle makers world and good luck with your journey! Thank you I liked the "idea" of 464 but I did not like the appearance. I used several techniques. Even when I had beautiful tops and thought I had it down test burns would reveal that chunky uneven weird top. I have to keep trying with 6006. I have been trying to "get it" for a bit now. I came to this site in Hope's that I would get ideas and brainstorm. I have recieved support for the struggle and encouragement to throw in the 6006 towel. I cant I "must" figure it out 🤦♀️🤷♀️🙋♀️✔ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BusyBee Posted July 2, 2021 Share Posted July 2, 2021 2 hours ago, KMB said: Thank you I liked the "idea" of 464 but I did not like the appearance. I used several techniques. Even when I had beautiful tops and thought I had it down test burns would reveal that chunky uneven weird top. I have to keep trying with 6006. I have been trying to "get it" for a bit now. I came to this site in Hope's that I would get ideas and brainstorm. I have recieved support for the struggle and encouragement to throw in the 6006 towel. I cant I "must" figure it out 🤦♀️🤷♀️🙋♀️✔ I made 464 work while many others had given up on that wax. So I am sure that you are going to able to make 6006 work also if you keep working on it. Candle developing would be much easier if you learn about candle flame first. Pay close attention to conduction & radiation of candle flame to control melt pool, and observe melt pool temperature if possible. That would be key to achieve good HT out of a candle. Then convection & air current caused by candle flame would be key for that HT to spread out in a room. Make sure the air current is not too strong if you want scent to be spread out the room instead of it to go up to the ceiling and travel to others rooms. Also, start thinking about blending little bit of other waxes to stock waxes. For 464, it becomes a lot better wax if 4% of palm wax(IGI 2322) is added to it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LisaMG Posted July 7, 2021 Share Posted July 7, 2021 I had the same problem, I am a begginer I think you see all the lovely fragrances and just want to make everything. I found for me (and with a lot of reading information found here) you might want to dial it all back. Naked candles no color, just one jar etc.... to cut down on the variables. I have one scent that I put on the back burner because it just seemed too difficult and revisited it later armed with a bit more knowledge. Candle making is hard, and then once you seem to get a scent it seems like it is over wicked. Keep working at it. This site is excellent for information. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Forrest Posted July 9, 2021 Share Posted July 9, 2021 (edited) On 6/30/2021 at 10:08 PM, KMB said: Thank you. I can appreciate that. I started with 464. I didn't like the appearance and no ht. Now I am waist deep in 6006. I have read good things about c3 that had tempter me but I am committed to figuring g 6006 out That's the same path I followed A year after I gave up on 464 I found one of the candles that had "no HT". When I burned it the HT was stronger than any candle I have ever seen. There is no substitute for cure time, an two weeks is not a magic number. I never found the answers I was looking for with 6006, but I did start making my Christmas candles in June. I've since switched to paraffin, but that has its own set of problems. Edited July 9, 2021 by Forrest 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bfroberts Posted July 10, 2021 Share Posted July 10, 2021 Interesting comments on this topic. I ditched 6006 mostly and mainly for aesthetic issues, but I still use a bit from time to time. I don't think it's hard to master at all...once you accept that a FMP early on isn't going to work. I don't even really understand why or how that became the benchmark of success. With the exception of multi-wicked candles and maybe some small el cheapo's, I haven't bought a commercially made candle that reaches a FMP on the first burn in forever. Anyway, OP, keep plugging away at it. I think you are much closer to success than you realize. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ErronB Posted July 10, 2021 Share Posted July 10, 2021 (edited) 8 hours ago, bfroberts said: Interesting comments on this topic. I ditched 6006 mostly and mainly for aesthetic issues, but I still use a bit from time to time. I don't think it's hard to master at all...once you accept that a FMP early on isn't going to work. I don't even really understand why or how that became the benchmark of success. With the exception of multi-wicked candles and maybe some small el cheapo's, I haven't bought a commercially made candle that reaches a FMP on the first burn in forever. Anyway, OP, keep plugging away at it. I think you are much closer to success than you realize. It doesn't burn the same as it used to, it needs to be wicked down even more, which is a problem for a lot of situations / containers. The last 3 recent lots I've had, any size Eco is too big even for a jelly jar, that should give you an idea how bad it is lol. And each case wanted a different temp for good glass adhesion, it's like it has a mind of it's own now. Edited July 10, 2021 by ErronB 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bfroberts Posted July 11, 2021 Share Posted July 11, 2021 2 hours ago, ErronB said: It doesn't burn the same as it used to, it needs to be wicked down even more, which is a problem for a lot of situations / containers. The last 3 recent lots I've had, any size Eco is too big even for a jelly jar, that should give you an idea how bad it is lol. And each case wanted a different temp for good glass adhesion, it's like it has a mind of it's own now. I’ve heard about some problems but I haven’t had any 6006 in a long time that required wick adjustments. I’ve never ever had good adhesion so I’d never notice a difference there....lol 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KMB Posted July 11, 2021 Author Share Posted July 11, 2021 13 hours ago, bfroberts said: Interesting comments on this topic. I ditched 6006 mostly and mainly for aesthetic issues, but I still use a bit from time to time. I don't think it's hard to master at all...once you accept that a FMP early on isn't going to work. I don't even really understand why or how that became the benchmark of success. With the exception of multi-wicked candles and maybe some small el cheapo's, I haven't bought a commercially made candle that reaches a FMP on the first burn in forever. Anyway, OP, keep plugging away at it. I think you are much closer to success than you realize. Thank you. I appreciate that. You left 6006 because of aesthetics? Compares to 464 it is smooth as butter! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ErronB Posted July 11, 2021 Share Posted July 11, 2021 9 hours ago, bfroberts said: I’ve heard about some problems but I haven’t had any 6006 in a long time that required wick adjustments. I’ve never ever had good adhesion so I’d never notice a difference there....lol I've had good adhesion most of the time but only pouring at near enough mixing FO temps. It's a 'puller' so to get the clean pull away from the glass look in JJ's with no wet spots it took pouring that hot. Utter nuisance. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bfroberts Posted July 11, 2021 Share Posted July 11, 2021 10 hours ago, KMB said: Thank you. I appreciate that. You left 6006 because of aesthetics? Compares to 464 it is smooth as butter! I prefer a creamier look, closer to a 50/50 parasoy blend. The newer 6006 is greasier and goopier, and IMO it doesn't burn as easily as it did several years ago. In terms of more recent years, I haven't seen the wicking problems others have indicated. I've never been able to maintain good adhesion with 6006, but that is probably partially environmental on my end. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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