Wicking Parasoy Blends in Tins

[anncal]

Hello!

I'm pretty new to candle making and tried my hand at soy wax but wasn't terribly pleased with it.  I have an order in for 6006 and ProBlend 600 which I plan to pour into the 8 oz tins.  What have y'all used as far as wicks and fragrance loads that work well with these?  Any lessons learned or things you wish you'd known going in?

Thanks in advance!

Anne

[bfroberts]

Use the wick guide offered by Candle Science. They also have wick suggestions directly on the product page for each container they sell.  The recommendations for 6006 are generally accurate, and PB 600 wicks similarly, give or take a size.  You won't get a full melt pool on the first burn, and you don't want to.  6-7% FO is appropriate.  More isn't better.

[ErronB]

8oz tins are literally the worst container for parasoy waxes to wick for newbies, if you're starting out then you should learn to wick something with a smaller diameter like 6oz tins or 8oz jelly jars. Pro-Blend 600 is easier to work with than 6006 because it has a lower melt point, isn't as finnicky with the temps to add FO, and generally works pretty decent with a variety of wicks like Eco, CD, HTP (which is good because right now getting hold of specific wicks can be a pain). 6006 has a better hot throw and is better for shipping in hot weather, but it requires a bit of knowledge to understand it properly, it's not as newbie friendly.

 

Wicking and fragrance load is a completely different story for everyone, it's all personal opinion. My suggestion is try as many wick families as you can and get to know how each one burns, it's very useful knowledge to have and people tend to quickly find their favorites. When it comes to fragrance load, don't just do the maximum load that the wax can handle because maximum fragrance doesn't automatically mean maximum throw. Try to stick to 8% or less and make sure you give the candles a chance to cure before judging the throw, at least a few days for parasoy.. The only thing I'd tell you to ignore is the same thing bfroberts mentioned above. The whole 'full melt pool' thing on the first burn is just ridiculous. If you're shooting for that then you're guaranteed to have a overwicked candle. Especially in tins, they get so hot burning near the bottom.

 

 

 

 

[anncal]

14 hours ago, ErronB said:

8oz tins are literally the worst container for parasoy waxes to wick for newbies

 

Is there a particular reason for this?  This is the container I'd very much like to use, and I don't want to put a ton of time and effort into learning to wick a different type of container that I'm not really interested in using.  

[TallTayl]

My 2 cents on tins... I have used them for over a decade with various blends.  The tin proportions are wider than tall, like a giant tea light.  It takes time to balance the top of the burn against the bottom half of the tin.  If wicking for early wide melt pool the second half of the tin gets scorching hot and can easily burn tables.

 

hard soy blends (Midwest soy, C3, C1, etc) will tunnel if too small of a wick, even if the flame of that wick is tall and reasonably hot. Soft blends like coconut waxes and many paraffin melt super easily and turn to a tin full of hot liquid if not careful. 

 

the metal conducts heat differently than glass, making many believe tins are under wicked. Also, most tins are filled to the little line embossed in the side wall.  This leaves little head space to get early convection going. Once the convection cranks up in the second half the heat builds quickly.  
 

with most glass containers the wax on the sides melts reasonably easily, so melt pools are quicker and easier to manage. Most people also leave more head room in glass, which makes wicking a bit easier. 
 

tins are not impossible, but can be tricky to master.  

[ErronB]

7 hours ago, anncal said:

Is there a particular reason for this?  This is the container I'd very much like to use, and I don't want to put a ton of time and effort into learning to wick a different type of container that I'm not really interested in using.  

 

I could be typing all night to explain all of the reasons behind it, but really if you insist on using the 8oz tins then I'd stick to the Problend 600. I've used it before in those and it won't give you as much of a hard time as 6006 will because it's not as tough to burn or wick. Problend 600 has a lot more soy so it's more tame. 6006 has some very specific quirks with it that aren't newbie friendly so I'd not put too much time and effort into that just yet until you have built up some good knowledge from experience.

 

Talltayl wrote a lot of good points about the tins above, it's good to keep those in mind when you're making your candles as that kind of stuff is important for safety.

 

 

 

 

[Forrest]

On 3/8/2021 at 1:16 PM, anncal said:

Hello!

I'm pretty new to candle making and tried my hand at soy wax but wasn't terribly pleased with it.  I have an order in for 6006 and ProBlend 600 which I plan to pour into the 8 oz tins.  What have y'all used as far as wicks and fragrance loads that work well with these?  Any lessons learned or things you wish you'd known going in?

Thanks in advance!

Anne

Using 6006 in 17 different FO at 7% I used WI745, Zinc 44, CD 6, HTP93, WI755, WI750, and Zinc 5.

[TallTayl]

31 minutes ago, Forrest said:

Using 6006 in 17 different FO at 7% I used WI745, Zinc 44, CD 6, HTP93, WI755, WI750, and Zinc 5.

 

This reply would also fit wel with another thread that is active today... Specifically this post:

https://www.craftserver.com/topic/117187-advice-for-someone-new-to-making-candles/?do=findComment&comment=1102748

 

 

[BusyBee]

Wider mouth and shorter tins would require totally different wicking approach than glass jars, which is the reason why I love tins or any container of tin shape.  I can make more safer candle using tins.  For narrower regular glass jars, we will need to pay attention to convection for HT and could use the heat inside of container & heat of container itself to melt waxes to achieve full melt pool.  But for the tins, we would need to control air flow from the flame itself for strength of HT and use conduction and radiation of wick to melt wax for full melt pool.  If you can find wider and but cooler flame wick, then it would work really nice in tins. 

 

Different wax will work well in different containers too.  Soy with little bit(about 5%) of other wax added would works really well in tins.  Coconut 83 works well in narrow and tall container since it requires smallest wick.  6006 did not work well in tin, and I find that soy or soy blend is the best for the tins.

 

This is Coconut 83 with Helix 1(smallest size of Helix series) in 9oz straight jar.  It's not perfect due to very tiny mushroom balls forming at the wick, but it works decently.  Since this type of jar gets hot really easily, I had to find wax that requires smallest wick which is coconut wax.

 

This is 464 with 4% additive wax in 14oz tin, and it is almost at the bottom.  I get full melt pool from top to bottom, and it does not get that much hot at the bottom that I can grab it comfortably.  

*No that is not wooden wick in the picture.  Wide wooden wick would work really well and provide what we need to achieve for the tin shape containers, and I highly recommend wooden wicks to soy candle making hobbyist.  But it is not stable enough to be used in candle business and cannot be trusted to be used in candle production.

 

If you like tins, then you might want to stick with soy blends with highest percentage of soy in them.  Good luck and be creative in candle development.  And don't forget that there is no one size fits all solution in candle making.

[bfroberts]

I really don't have difficulty with any of the parasoys in tins.  We've done several sizes of tins, and they all work well.  We've used 6006 (the most), PB600, CBL130 and multiple other parasoy blends of our own.  Here's a couple of tricks that might help, or at least help you know what to look for. 
-Do not to get hung up on getting a full melt pool early on. You want a little wax clinging to the sides of the tin until the candle is nearly spent.  The last of the wax will melt off the sides near the end and you will be left with a clean tin.  If you wick hot enough for a full melt point early on, it will be too hot as the candle burns down lower in the tin.  6006 doesn't melt outward into a wide melt pool like some waxes, and sometimes people don't understand that is just the nature of this wax.  I see a lot of people just keep wicking up, up, up trying for that full melt pool, and they eventually end up with a hot, sooty candle.

-Allow the candle to cure. I like to wait a couple of weeks w/parasoy, but that seems to stretch the limits of patience for new makers, and I get that.  Still, you really do need to wait at least a week to test burn, although 2 weeks is more ideal. If you burn too soon, parasoys (6006 especially) seem to struggle to burn efficiently, your test results won't be 100% accurate and you'll be wondering why things aren't working the way they should.  A good cure fixes a lot of that.  

-Don't fall into the trap of wanting to use a high % of FO.  More FO doesn't really mean it's going to throw stronger, but it can make wicking more challenging.  

 

[anncal]

1 hour ago, bfroberts said:

I really don't have difficulty with any of the parasoys in tins.  We've done several sizes of tins, and they all work well.  We've used 6006 (the most), PB600, CBL130 and multiple other parasoy blends of our own.  Here's a couple of tricks that might help, or at least help you know what to look for. 
-Do not to get hung up on getting a full melt pool early on. You want a little wax clinging to the sides of the tin until the candle is nearly spent.  The last of the wax will melt off the sides near the end and you will be left with a clean tin.  If you wick hot enough for a full melt point early on, it will be too hot as the candle burns down lower in the tin.  6006 doesn't melt outward into a wide melt pool like some waxes, and sometimes people don't understand that is just the nature of this wax.  I see a lot of people just keep wicking up, up, up trying for that full melt pool, and they eventually end up with a hot, sooty candle.

-Allow the candle to cure. I like to wait a couple of weeks w/parasoy, but that seems to stretch the limits of patience for new makers, and I get that.  Still, you really do need to wait at least a week to test burn, although 2 weeks is more ideal. If you burn too soon, parasoys (6006 especially) seem to struggle to burn efficiently, your test results won't be 100% accurate and you'll be wondering why things aren't working the way they should.  A good cure fixes a lot of that.  

-Don't fall into the trap of wanting to use a high % of FO.  More FO doesn't really mean it's going to throw stronger, but it can make wicking more challenging.  

 

I poured a PB600 and a 6006 unscented yesterday to start finding my base wicks.  What do you like/dislike about each of these blends?  Off the bat I noticed my PB600 gave me a more satisfying top and seemed more pleasant to work with.  Do I need to wait the full cure time to wick test these, or is that just the time for the scent to cure?

[BusyBee]

6006 forms concave melt pool in the picture.  It melts downward more than outward which is not the case with most other waxes.  If you use bigger wick to achieve near full melt pool(full melt pool was even more impossible with 6006), then it will melt downward more than the picture.  You will need to find rigid core wick that can stand firmly in place in deep melt to make 6006 work which I was not able to do.

 

[anncal]

Thanks to all for your help!  This has been really informative

[TallTayl]

47 minutes ago, anncal said:

I poured a PB600 and a 6006 unscented yesterday to start finding my base wicks.  What do you like/dislike about each of these blends?  Off the bat I noticed my PB600 gave me a more satisfying top and seemed more pleasant to work with.  Do I need to wait the full cure time to wick test these, or is that just the time for the scent to cure?

I find a reasonable cure time very beneficial to finding a base wick also. An awful lot happens at a microscopic level over the days and weeks after pouring waxes.
 

With palm-based wax is three days is typically suitable. With soy based wax is the longer the better. Any wax that has any amount of soy in it also benefits from time. 

[bfroberts]

1 hour ago, anncal said:

I poured a PB600 and a 6006 unscented yesterday to start finding my base wicks.  What do you like/dislike about each of these blends?  Off the bat I noticed my PB600 gave me a more satisfying top and seemed more pleasant to work with.  Do I need to wait the full cure time to wick test these, or is that just the time for the scent to cure?

PB600 is easier to use.  It pours beautifully and has better adhesion.  It does not have the throw of 6006.  It is more finicky about which FO's will throw (kinda like pure soy) and some of my best performers in 6006 just are not as strong in PB600.  That's not to say it can't make a very strong candle.  It can, but it's not as versatile in terms of FO's as 6006.  Part of that is due to a higher soy content and part of it is due to something I don't know.  I can get a better throw out of other parasoys with a similar soy %, but they aren't as pour-friendly by a long shot.  If you don't mind more trial and error in terms of which FO's to use, PB600 may be the way to go for the best aesthetics and overall ease of use.

 

Cure time is crucial for a quality burn, especially with 6006.  Throw is only a secondary concern.  The wax changes quite a bit over time.  A burn that looks good after a couple of days cure time can look totally different after a couple of weeks or a month, etc.  Curing is a step that so many people skip, and it can turn around and bite you in the rear.  Been there, done that, and learned the hard way.