full milk soaping question

[jackie]

As I was mixing in my lye with my artly frozen/slushy coconut milk, it dawined on me--when I mix lye with water, I can tell when it's dissolved because it goes from cloudy to clear (just like sugar does when dissolved in water), but with coconut milk, it's not clear to start with so how do you tell when the lye is fully dissolved? I just kept stirring and stirring and hoped I got it all dissolved. Anything suggestions to tell when it's dissovled? When I used goat's milk, since it's suppose to be diluted, I dissolved in the water part first then added to the goat's milk.

[TallTayl]

You can feel when grains of lye remain undissolved in milks as you stir the bottom of the lye solution container. It feels a bit like grains of sand. As a general rule I strain lye solution as I pour it into the waiting oils just in case a grain or so gets by...

When making GM soap, I use frozen solid GM and know when it's ready as the milk just barely turns yellow and I no longer feel grains in the solution pitcher. Pouring it through a strainer is challenging as the globs of milk fats begin to saponify, but not impossible.

[Candybee]

Even when I put frozen gm in my lye water I never worry about the lye grains not dissolving. The lye water/milk just gets too warm. I do stir a lot thou, and again before I add to my oils.

I have been using calendula petal infused distilled water for my lye solution. It makes the water cloudy and milky looking even when the lye is dissolved. I just do what TallTayl says and stir until I can't feel the grains on the bottom of the container anymore. The heat created by the lye and stirring always dissolves it for me.

[Kitn]

I just stir until I am sure they have dissolved, you can tell after doing it a few times.

[jackie]

Thanks.

I tried straining just to be safe with lye water and it did ok (though after a few times I got a hole in my strainer--prob because I didn't rinse it off right away), but doing it with GM didn't work well so I didn't even try with the coconut milk--just kept stirring and stirring. Then I'd walk away and come back in a few mins and stir some more. Next time I'll try to be more sensitive to the feel and see if I can tell the difference.

[TallTayl]

Thanks.

I tried straining just to be safe with lye water and it did ok (though after a few times I got a hole in my strainer--prob because I didn't rinse it off right away), but doing it with GM didn't work well so I didn't even try with the coconut milk--just kept stirring and stirring. Then I'd walk away and come back in a few mins and stir some more. Next time I'll try to be more sensitive to the feel and see if I can tell the difference.

Were you using a metal strainer? If so, it does not sound like it was made of stainless steel; non stainless is kinda dangerous to use for CP...

Mine is a fine mesh plastic material. No worries about off-gassing or DOS inducing metal flecks in the finished soap.

[jackie]

Oops. Come to think of it, I don't know what it was made of, I had assumed it was stainless mesh. I didn't even know they came in plastic--gotta check on getting one of those. thanks.

[wheeler]

Why do you freeze your coconut milk? To avoid overheating? Coconut milk is not really "milk", the only milk you need to worry about overheating and partially freezing before adding lye is animal milk. Vegetable derived like coconut will not heat up

[TallTayl]

Coconut milk sure does heat and scorch. The natural sugars in the product react with the lye just like sugars from any other source. If using coconut milk as the entire liquid portion of your solution freezing it helps control the scorching of the sugar and other proteins. Overheated coconut milk smells every bit as bad as overheated animal milk (of any species).

[Candybee]

Just wondering how many of you do a full milk?

I have been halving my liquid; half water, half milk. I always chill the milk and add to my oils instead of mixing with lye. My last batch I tried using slightly more milk and proportionately less water for the lye mix. But so far have not tried a full milk and no water.

Doesn't most of the water eventually evaporate out of the finished soap as it cures leaving the milk more concentrated anyway? Or am I wrong?

Edited April 29, 2012 by Candybee

[TallTayl]

I do full milk for GM (most often using fresh since I have a giant freezer full of it). When using powdered, I use the amount of powder required to equal what is needed for full milk, but mix the slurry using only enough milk to reconstitute it using the rest of the water for the lye solution. Like you, when using reconstituted I add it to the oils (without chilling).

My process may be different from yours in that I use a pretty steep water discount from the start. Most often I use a 40% solution only occasionally using 33%-35% when using a new-to-me fragrance or one that I know to be problematic. When using 40% solution there's not a whole lot extra to evaporate out... When using full water, then your hypothesis about evaporation hold water (pun intended)

When using other milks (bovine, coconut, yogurt, kefir, evaporated milk, etc.) I use them at a much lower rate. After many experiments (including a recent lather swap which included 25 additives) using most milks for the full amount of water decreased lather. With some the texture and color changed quite a bit. When using small amounts of cream, coconut, yogurt (perhaps 1 oz PPO) IME the lather has increased and improved in quality.

[kidsngarden]

I make mainly milk soaps using fresh goat milk. I only use 100% GM on a few varieties however. Of course the water naturally found in the milk does evaporate out eventually, BUT because the value that is leftover from milk is fat, if you use 100% really what you are getting from milk is MORE superfat. So, 100% gm soaps will have a higher superfat then soaps with a water/gm mixture.

I used to ONLY make 100% GM soaps, but the logistics became too much with the volume I was doing. I really hate dealing with dry lye as you do with 100% milk soaps, preferring to use premixed and cooled lye solutions. I now use a 50/50 lye/water mix and add liquid GM at emulsification with most of my varieties.

[Candybee]

When using other milks (bovine, coconut, yogurt, kefir, evaporated milk, etc.) I use them at a much lower rate. After many experiments (including a recent lather swap which included 25 additives) using most milks for the full amount of water decreased lather. With some the texture and color changed quite a bit. When using small amounts of cream, coconut, yogurt (perhaps 1 oz PPO) IME the lather has increased and improved in quality.

So for a coconut milk soap would you do full milk with a water discount? Or am I reading this wrong. I have been using full water and halving for the coconut milk. Wondering if my lather could be better if I used full milk and a water discount?