ProudMarineMom Posted March 8, 2012 Share Posted March 8, 2012 So, a couple of questions for those of you that make milk soaps. I have read that these soaps should be put in a slab mold instead of a loaf mold due to overheating. Is that really the case? Ladysj, I saw that you used your silicone loaf for your buttermilk batch. Any issues?Since milk soaps tend to heat up would it not be recommended to put these in the oven to force gel? Either in a loaf or slap mold? Just insulate well?Thank for your any insights you have. J Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ladysj Posted March 8, 2012 Share Posted March 8, 2012 No issues what so ever This last batch did crack a little on the top but I think that's because I put it in a warm oven so will not do that next time just put in the oven no heat. The previous batches I made I didn't insulate or cover with anything & they turned out great & haven't had any of them get ash YAY HTH Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ProudMarineMom Posted March 8, 2012 Author Share Posted March 8, 2012 Thanks for the info. I will eventually do a slab mold, but I'm still learning and experimenting. So, these little molds are a nice size. And, I have a consistent batch size while testing.Read a tip somewhere to spray the top with 91% alcohol to help prevent ash. If I remember correctly it was for those that are put into a warm oven. Don't see why that wouldn't work if you don't tho.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TallTayl Posted March 8, 2012 Share Posted March 8, 2012 You absolutely CAN make them in log and block molds. I do it all the time - even with additives that people claim you cannot, like honey. My molds are wood with 1/4 inch closed cell foam liners that can get pretty darned heated.Just make sure you keep the mixtures cool as you make the soap. Beginning with frozen milks really helps. I posted my method on this board not too long ago.I would not insulate immediately or try to force gel using the oven. That's a recipe for overheating and separation. I DO often insulate AFTER the initial violent chemical reactions settle down to help things SAP a little more thoroughly and quickly. HTH Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TallTayl Posted March 8, 2012 Share Posted March 8, 2012 Read a tip somewhere to spray the top with 91% alcohol to help prevent ash. If I remember correctly it was for those that are put into a warm oven. Don't see why that wouldn't work if you don't tho.... I spray every batch with 91% iso alcohol. It keeps my textured tops shiny and ash free - even with palm oils that tend to get weird ash. Rumor has it you can even spray the tops with plain distilled water and achieve the same end. The ash is supposedly caused by relative humidity changes in the micro atmosphere surrounding the soap surface (which is why covering with plastic wrap often prevents ash too). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ProudMarineMom Posted March 8, 2012 Author Share Posted March 8, 2012 Thanks TallTayl! I did freeze the milk portion but it stilled move a bit quick on me. Oils needed to be cooler. I have a few more nob questions if you all can stand it. Been trying to search but must not be getting the criteria right.If you insulate the mold and don't look at it for 24 hours, how do you know if it gelled? I know for sure one of my batches did because I got a partial. But the others, I guess they did.How long can SAP take? I think I'm under the mistaken impression soap shouldn't zap after 24-48 hours. Think I read if you stop the gel (freezer, etc.) it could take up to a week for the lye to neutralize, is that true? Reason I ask is I have been cutting my soap between the 24-48 hour mark. The sides, middle and bottom seem fine but the tops are still zappy. Maybe I'm not waiting long enough or I'm doing something wrong. I've been using the RTCP method (cool oils / hot lye), 30% lye solution and 7% superfat. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scented Posted March 9, 2012 Share Posted March 9, 2012 I just got done running various tests on amounts of milk in soap and with all of them I did everything I could to prevent gel. That said, all of them needed at least two weeks to sit before I even thought about cutting them. You should be able to tell if your soap gelled. For me, there's a color difference, slight as it is, but it's there. I did a milk and honey with milk and it actually went from a creamy white (no milk in that batch) to a light tan. Sigh. But anyway, I find the color loses its luster when I gel and doesn't when I don't if that makes sense to you. With my milk soaps, I waited at least 2 to 2 1/2 weeks to cut and then I waited another 2 weeks before I did anything with it, because the bar was still soft. I didn't want it to mush on me in the shower. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kitn Posted March 9, 2012 Share Posted March 9, 2012 It can take a week for ungelled soap to be zapless, I just had this happen the other day with a new silicone mold. I cut the soap with my tank and set it on the curing rack, it is just fine about a week later. If you didn't look to see or even just feel the mold to see if the soap was gelling, ungelled soap is pale compared to gelled, gelled soap looks more opaque imho. I use milk in a log mold every batch I make. I set the mold on a towel and spray with alcohol and put a piece of saran , then put my handmade styrofoam lid on top the soap and let it do it's thing..If your recipe is good and the soap gels it really shouldn't ever zap in my experience. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ProudMarineMom Posted March 9, 2012 Author Share Posted March 9, 2012 I just got done running various tests on amounts of milk in soap and with all of them I did everything I could to prevent gel.So, I guess we just have to embrace the gel and make sure it isn't a partial for milk soaps. I assume you were trying to get a nice, creamy white bar. No TD?Kitn, does the plastic wrap mess up textured tops? Not that mine are all that spectacular to look at yet, so maybe that would help! Wonder if I'm losing too much heat out of the top. I have the silicone mold inside a shoe box with small towels wrapped around the sides. Put on the shoe box top, put that box in a post office box, wrap that in towels with another towel on top. I just have not been putting plastic wrap on the mold itself, nor do I have a 'lid' for the mold.No, I've been trying not to look at the soap for 24 hours. The very first batch I kept peeking and figured I probably caused the partial gel. But, I was excited. So, been making a batch the night before an in-office day since I have to hit the sack early because I get up at 0' dark hundred. And, since I'm at work I can't look. I assume it's in it's little cocoon doing it's thing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chuck_35550 Posted March 9, 2012 Share Posted March 9, 2012 I often use a 100% gm recipe in my acrylic log mold and always try to soap as cool as possible. The non-gelled milk soap is creamy and may initially have an ammonia type after fragrance but that disappears and I usually cut my bars the next day with no problem. I use a 38% water content with milk recipes and find that gives me more time to play with the batter. I never cover the mold and check to make sure that the most gel might be around the corners but overall the rest of the soap does not gel. I can't remember the last time I did cpop but used to do that all the time for soaps that had intense color swirls. It's always a matter of personal preference. HTHSteve Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChrisR Posted March 9, 2012 Share Posted March 9, 2012 I use 100% fresh goat's milk in all my soaps with a 40 to 45% lye solution, mix when lye and oils are 90 or a little lower, in wood log molds and put them in my freezer for 24 hours to prevent gel. I let them sit a few hours to thaw the next day and cut them. I have always used a bar after 7 days and never had a problem with any zap. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TallTayl Posted March 9, 2012 Share Posted March 9, 2012 Typically, all my soaps use a 40% solution, milk is no exception. I dump the lye on the chunk of frozen milk stirring it til the milk is melted and the lye is dissolved. The milk at this point is a light yellow. No ammonia smell at all.The oils/butters are barely melted into a slurry. The milk solution gets poured in through a sieve and stirred well. I add the fragrance, then color(s) pretty much right away.Once it's at the desired trace I pour. It gets thick enough to texture tops within a few minutes. When I'm happy with the textures the log or block gets a spritz of alcohol and it's off to the next batch or to clean the equipment if that's the last one. Then it get's spritzed again if it looks dry. I don't chill anything to prevent gel - no fridge or freezer large enough or close enough to the workshop for the number of molds they'd need to hold. If things feel like they're getting really warm I'll elevate the mold off the counter on dowels. If it's REALLY beginning to get warm I'll turn the fan on it for a while. After an hour or so it cools considerably even if I've avoided a hard gel. Then I'll wrap it til it's mostly cool - at least overnight.I cut within 12 hours - sometimes as long as 24 hours - and am able to use the soap right away; the bars are all very firm and completely sapped with no signs of zap. Of course it gets better with age and isn't sold until about the 4 week mark. I don't have any ammonia smell using this method. The only time I get that smell is if I let the milk get to the slushy stage where it is on the cusp of turning orange before adding to the oils. On occasion I don't catch the timing just perfectly and will get a telltale ring in the centermost bars. Nobody ever notices or seems to care - just me Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chuck_35550 Posted March 9, 2012 Share Posted March 9, 2012 Does anyone find that silk causes some acceleration? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ProudMarineMom Posted March 9, 2012 Author Share Posted March 9, 2012 You know, I've made all my batches with silk so I have no basis for comparison. Will have to try one without it, see if I'm able to play with the swirls or layers more. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JacquiO Posted March 9, 2012 Share Posted March 9, 2012 I refrigerate my milk immediately after pouring into the mold. Log or slab. I do admit I occasionally get a partial gel. But either way it makes a great bar of soap and no cracking. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scented Posted March 12, 2012 Share Posted March 12, 2012 (edited) So, I guess we just have to embrace the gel and make sure it isn't a partial for milk soaps. I assume you were trying to get a nice, creamy white bar. No TD?Kitn, does the plastic wrap mess up textured tops? Not that mine are all that spectacular to look at yet, so maybe that would help! Wonder if I'm losing too much heat out of the top. I have the silicone mold inside a shoe box with small towels wrapped around the sides. Put on the shoe box top, put that box in a post office box, wrap that in towels with another towel on top. I just have not been putting plastic wrap on the mold itself, nor do I have a 'lid' for the mold.No, I've been trying not to look at the soap for 24 hours. The very first batch I kept peeking and figured I probably caused the partial gel. But, I was excited. So, been making a batch the night before an in-office day since I have to hit the sack early because I get up at 0' dark hundred. And, since I'm at work I can't look. I assume it's in it's little cocoon doing it's thing.If I still had the bars I'd show you. One came out a nice off white. THe other a really light camel (super light tan I suppose) and then the milk n honey went to a darker light tan color if that makes sense. So it all varied and every one of those batches went into the freezer for at least 12 hours. All of them sweated like pigs too when then came out of the freezer lol.Plastic wrap, when I use it, as long as it doesn't fall on top of the soap, messes up nothing. Edited March 12, 2012 by Scented Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scented Posted March 12, 2012 Share Posted March 12, 2012 Does anyone find that silk causes some acceleration?NO! But fragrance does and milks, when I soap with them, do. Silk does nothing but affect the feel of my bar IMO. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kidsngarden Posted March 13, 2012 Share Posted March 13, 2012 All I use are log molds and they work great! But I am totally fine with gelling. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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