C-1 Vs C-3 - Any Feedback Greatly Appreciated

[bart70]

Hi all,

I am considering a change from 464 to either C-1 or C-3. I am after some feedback from users who have tried both in terms of the differences, and what are the good/bad points of using each one?

My understanding is that C1 is made from blended vegetable oils and is poured a little cooler than C3, where C3 is 100% soy based, poured a little hotter, and has better glass adhesion. From what I read both have reasonable CT & HT with many FO's

I would be keen to hear any experiences from those who have used both and would like to share their thoughts on them both in comparison. My instinct is telling me to try C3 but would like to know what others thoughts are before making my final decision.

Cheers,

Bart

[Stella1952]

Try a sample of both to see which one YOU prefer.

[ChandlerWicks]

Hi There Bart,

I've read y'alls posts about how hard it is to aquire supplies way down there. Now that a supplier has C-3 available, I hope one of the experts will come on & help! Tracey

[Stella1952]

I'm no "expert," but I chose C3 over C1 a long time ago and I still like it better. If I couldn't get C3, then I'd use C1, but each person really has to test for themselves. Some folks started with C1 and wouldn't use anything else. So long as the wax pleases YOU, that's the right one to use. :-)

[quickwick]

Well, I just tried C-1 for the first time. I'm a beginner, tried CBA & 6006 only, before this. I just made the C-1 candles Tuesday night and haven't lit them yet. But boy were they ugly after they cured. I used 4 10oz glasses, C-1, no dye, 10% FO and htp wicks. Heated the wax to 200, added FO@ 180, poured at 110 and at 150, put them in a warm oven to cure. The candles that I poured at 110 were CHUNKY at the surface. The one's that I poured at 150 were a little smoother, but not great, major sink holes. So far I hit them all with the heat gun every day for 3 days. And they still look like crap. I'm going to give it another go on Sunday. This time I'm going to pour hotter. And I do have photo's, just need to figure out how to upload them.

[bart70]

Thanks everyone,

Stella - What was it in particular that swayed you to the C3 over the C1 from your experiences?

I have some in transit C3 that will land here tomorrow. I chose C3 after researching its qualities and reading what I could about the two and deciding that the qualities that C3 were designed with were more to my liking.

If I get the results I want with C3 I ill be very happy, otherwise I will try the C1 and see how it compares.

Bart

[Circle]

I prefer C3 as it is very flexible with pour temp at different times of the year and I always get lovely smooth tops. I like the C1 too but there is a big controversy over palm wax and I think that palm wax is an ingredient in C1. As Stella says, if no C3 around I would use C1.

[bart70]

Thanks for the info,

I have been playing with C3, my C1 should land here tomorrow. Early impressions were very good for the C3, but having problems with tops at this point in time. I have tried heating to 180 and pouring at 160 (always in preheated glass), then pouring at multiple 5 degree increments above and below 160 with similar results.

I have only been pouring plain wax without FO at this stage to get used to how it wants to pour. I have several on the test burning table (again plain wax) which are going well by early indications. Overall I much prefer the look and feel of C3 over 464.

I am confident that I can perfect the issue with the tops with time and experimentation - it is just frustrating trying to work it out. I will do some with FO in the next few days just in case having FO included helps the tops.

Cheers,

Bart

[TallTayl]

How have you been cooling your candles?

As a recent convert from 464 to C3 myself, I've followed the sage advice from Stella and other C3 advocates: elevate the containers (like on a cookie cooling rack) and cover them (like with a box) to help them cool from the bottom up. The result has been smooth and beautiful tops (knocks wood the trend continues).

[jeanie353]

How have you been cooling your candles?

As a recent convert from 464 to C3 myself, I've followed the sage advice from Stella and other C3 advocates: elevate the containers (like on a cookie cooling rack) and cover them (like with a box) to help them cool from the bottom up. The result has been smooth and beautiful tops (knocks wood the trend continues).

Am also a recent convert to C3 for a couple months only. I was putting them up to cool on the inside rack of a large roaster pan and then covered the jars with towels. They came out perfect. Then I got sick of doing that and went from the Presto to the pour pot to the jars and am still getting a smooth top, excellent adhesion but do get the faint hint of a ring sometimes around the wick. A quick heat gun blast takes care of it. Am guessing my pour temp is about 155-150. The Presto gets heated to 185, FO poured in, Presto gets unplugged, stir 1-1/2 - 2 mins, then into pour pot and into jars.

Have never tried C1 so no help there but of all the soys I've worked with over the years....imo...it has awesome HT..close or equal with 415 and sets up so pretty without having to wait for slush stage to pour.

HTH

[kandlekrazy]

I can tell you my experience, but as others have already said you really need to decide what works best for you. I switched to C3 about 6 years ago and while I have learned to work with it, it has some quirks (imo all soy wax does). I tried C1 after I was using C3 for a couple of years. It seemed to be a harder wax and I thought it might ship better in the hotter months. My experience was awful. I did not like the C1 at all and I think most of it because I was already used to working with C3. In addition, I could find much more info on the C3 issues and how to deal with them both on this board and on other boards. Very much like Stella, if they discontinued C3 I would most likely switch to C1 and learn to work with it but for now I'm happy with the C3.

[bart70]

Thanks everyone,

Elevate and cover - That was the secret! :smiley2:

We have had shocking weather here the last week (high temps and abnormally high humidity) so I held off testing until the weather normalised. This evening I poured a number of plain (unscented, non coloured) C3 testers in a number of container types.

Wax was heated to 180 then left to drop to 160 and poured between 160 and 155. All were elevated in racks and covered with towels after pouring - all have perfect tops.

I have not had a chance to play with the C1 yet, but I am very happy with the C3. Once I finish learning the plain wax I am hopeful that I will get the same results once I start using FO.

Thanks again to everyone for their assistance and advice. :smiley2:

Bart

Edited March 2, 2012 by bart70

[Stella1952]

Yep. You are on the right track, Bart. Knowing how the wax performs give you a baseline for comparison. You can expect the addition of dye or FO to affect the size wick that you use vs. the size used in the same container. Once you have ascertained your baseline, when you add FO or dye, wick up one size from the baseline and see if that gets you close to where you need to be. Have fun! Remember to allow the candles to sit at least 48 hours before testing. This gives the newly formed wax crystals a chance to harden. When you add FO, let them cure 5-7 days before testing to give the most accurate results for how the FO will perform.

You were very wise to pay attention to the environmental conditions when pouring and testing. It makes an appreciable difference! Keep us updated on your progress, please. :-)

[cgoff]

So I am in the same boat as you Stella, 444 or 464 is a 6 hour drive from me each way, and a new local supplier (45 minutes away by car!!!) of C1 and C3 http://gacwholesale.com/ I took the plunge. I called him and he shipped me 5 pound testers of each, which I actually got today and started to test with.

I do use a very high scent load (2oz added to 17 oz wax for 19 oz candle, or 12.8%) and was getting great results with the 444, a tsp PP of USA, and 1/4 tsp of UV inhibitor added to the presto pot, not each candle.

I heated to 200, added color, then FO, stirred until 175, poured into the jars inside my cooling box (insulates the candles while cooling so they harden w/o caveties)

I'll see how these work, and let you know what I find. I have them double wicked with LX24's in my golf-ball jars, I made 2 for each the C1 and C3, one with no additives, and one with the USA and UV. I'll take pictures after they dry.

-Chris