Frosting Frustration

[Holly]

Ok, the colder weather is setting in and my house is much colder during the night. I like to keep the heat on 58-60 for sleeping comfort and also to cut down on energy cost. I made three test candles later last night and on the two darker ones I used the pryme colors and did all the others steps the same way. One of them though, I did not make it a real dark brown but used the pryme color anyway because I have a lot more frost with the other brown dye.

When I woke up this morning the candles had frost -- the Vanilla one did not show as much frost. I will usually get a slight bit of frost (this got MUCH better with the pryme colors) but this morning it is that "frost all over look". I can't see myself selling a candle with that kind of frost. It may not be the worst but to me bad none-the-least. I took the heat gun to the outsides of one jar and it seemed to help. But that will be a pain in the neck to do with many jars.

My question is, is it more incline to frost in the cold when they are cooling than if they are already cured and then it gets cold? This appears to be the case, but I am not positive. I do heat my jars before I pour. I don't notice any more frost on my other candles that were previously made. Should I now only make them during the day so they have enough time set before the colder house temp sets in? Or, should I buy an electric heater with a fan and have it in the kitchen? I doubt my husband will like that idea. Do any of you use a small electric heater with a fan for the same reason?

Any suggestions? I love this soy wax, but hate this side of it. I am not sure if I could live without color. What do you guys do who live in colder areas and keep the house colder?

Sorry to complain and ask so many questions. Thanks for your help in advance.

~Holly

[Lorrie]

As it gets colder alot of things will happen that didn't happen before. You may also get sink holes. I believe that frost will show up whenever. I have some candles that I made last year and they were great looking. Now they have alot of frost. My customers do care if they have frost or not. Some of them actually look for frosting on the candles. It doesn't affect the burn so they don't care.

If it is getting alot cooler than what it was I would suggest trying to cool the candles slowly. Maybe placed them (if you can) in a warm oven. This is what I do to stop the sink holes.

[Holly]

Hi Lorrie,

Thanks for your insight. I guess I am still a little more paranoid about large amount of frost because I have not sold to the general public yet and really don't know what their response will be. Only selling to friends does not really give me the assurance, because I have more time to explain to them why it has the frost and that it is not a "defect."

Thanks for the oven idea. I have thought about that but how do you move them to the oven without the wax moving around on the glass above and getting residue where the wax should not be. I guess the good old heat gun could take care of that one too. lol I also thought about going back to the box. Maybe I will cover them with a box next time, and if that does not work, try the oven.

Thanks again.

[Abbiepql]

I have noticed for sure that letting soy/natural wax solidify in a cold room will result in more frosting. I am lucky to have a shop to pour in so once the cold weather starts, I crank on portable heaters to keep it toasty.

I instruct my wholesalers and private label customers to keep them at room temperatures as well, because if left in the cold even when once set up they are prone to frost more readily. Although not as badly as if when initially poured.

That and pouring a bit cooler have helped with my frosting issues when it gets colder.

I don't pre-heat my jars although I do let them become room temp before I pour if they have been in my cold temp garage for storage. I don't insulate them while they set up, but I keep the shop warmer than normal until they are solid.

If you are heat gunning them to remove frost I have found tapping the top of the jar while the sides are liquid, to force trapped air bubbles up to the top will get rid of the frosting completely. Heat gunning does nothing for the snowflaking type frost I used to get when I poured too hot.

HTH - Abbie:-)

[Lorrie]

Also another thought is adding bees wax to it. That is supposed to help with the frosting. I was told 1-3% but you may have to wick up.

[Lightning Bug]

Hey Holly, Just about to post this and saw this thread. I was wondering if who makes the colors will effect the frosting issue? I have some soy-based ones and some from Peaks. I think I do better when I use Peak's liquids, but hate to buy all the extra colors if that isn't really true. I'm ready to quit colors totally since I had so much frost on the last batch. As to beeswax, someone told me that it, being a natural wax, also frosts easily and so wondered if this is so, how it would help? An earlier post also said that heating the jars made frosting worse in their estimation. Guess it is what ever works for you. If you get this cured, pm me or post the results...PLEASE!! My hair is turning gray(er). LOL. Beth

[lvnmt]

Just a tidbit from my experimenting...I add BW to my soy and when I was (key word was:grin2: ) coloring my candles I still got frost. I have always added BW, so I don't know if it decreased it, or what. But just thought I would share. I have also heard that BW was supposed to help,but didn't in my case. And you definitely have to wick up if you use it. HTH

:smiley2:

[Holly]

Hey Holly, Just about to post this and saw this thread. I was wondering if who makes the colors will effect the frosting issue? I have some soy-based ones and some from Peaks. I think I do better when I use Peak's liquids, but hate to buy all the extra colors if that isn't really true. I'm ready to quit colors totally since I had so much frost on the last batch. As to beeswax, someone told me that it, being a natural wax, also frosts easily and so wondered if this is so, how it would help? An earlier post also said that heating the jars made frosting worse in their estimation. Guess it is what ever works for you. If you get this cured, pm me or post the results...PLEASE!! My hair is turning gray(er). LOL. Beth

Hi Beth, I feel your pain. :undecided I use the veggie modifier which does help some with the frosting and definitely helps with the tops. I thought about the same thing when it comes to BW. If it is natural, it may be inclined to frost too. I just have not gotten around to trying it instead of the veggie modifier. I am assuming that it won't do anymore for it the the VM. But who knows, maybe it will. I was thinking that maybe heating the jars may not help. I missed that post. I will try to have it room temperature next time. Altough, I think I remember reading before that heating the jars can help with the frost. Boy, all the different advice. lol

Well, I don't know if I will ever get this cured. But if I do, I will let you know. Don't hold your breath. I did read that some sort of ant- frost additive may be coming out. Hey, wouldn't this be great!

Also, I have even tried adding paraffin and it helped the frost issue but it takes away the throw to me and the scents just don't smell as good in it. So, scratch that idea.

Keep testing. We may end up having to go colorless. I think they are pretty when they are white when I see then in stores, but it may get a little boring. :undecided

~Holly

[Jordan]

I found that some soy waxes actually frost more if you heat the jars. I was doing this and having lots of issues, then Vickey from KY told me to stop heating jars, and it does help. I would suggest keeping the room warmer, cooling jars in a styrofoam cooler, or using the portable heaters. I am in Seattle, and have to do this with pure soy---it is just damp and cold here most of the time.

Jordan

[Holly]

I found that some soy waxes actually frost more if you heat the jars. I was doing this and having lots of issues, then Vickey from KY told me to stop heating jars, and it does help. I would suggest keeping the room warmer, cooling jars in a styrofoam cooler, or using the portable heaters. I am in Seattle, and have to do this with pure soy---it is just damp and cold here most of the time.

Jordan

Thanks for pointing that out Jordan. I have heard the opposite too and that is why I was unsure of which way is the right way. I have been thinking about trying not to heat my jars next time I pour. The reason why I thought for sure that heating would be good is because since my house is pretty cool it would slow the cooling time down which I thought helps prevent frosting. I will try it next time and try it with an oil and dye that seems to usually give me frost. Thanks for the insight!

[Jordan]

You are welcome,

Don't know if it will help, but heck it is worth a try.

When I was using the KY puresoy it made a huge difference.

J

[Fire and Ice]

Hi Lorrie,

Thanks for your insight. I guess I am still a little more paranoid about large amount of frost because I have not sold to the general public yet and really don't know what their response will be. Only selling to friends does not really give me the assurance, because I have more time to explain to them why it has the frost and that it is not a "defect."

Thanks for the oven idea. I have thought about that but how do you move them to the oven without the wax moving around on the glass above and getting residue where the wax should not be. I guess the good old heat gun could take care of that one too. lol I also thought about going back to the box. Maybe I will cover them with a box next time, and if that does not work, try the oven.

Thanks again.

Holly,

Try explaining to the public that frosting is a natural occurance with soy was. You will always get it in the colder weather no matter where you keep your candles unless you keep them in a room that is constantly 75 degrees or more.

I embrace my frosting and so do my customers. I had a woman last week say that she loved my candles but that she was so sad that the frosting on them was gone and had I switched waxes?

Delivered fresh candles today and she came into the tobacco shop and was all happy to see the frosting one the Pumpkin Pie candles.! It just made her day. And of course she bought the candles too.

[Holly]

Holly,

Try explaining to the public that frosting is a natural occurance with soy was. You will always get it in the colder weather no matter where you keep your candles unless you keep them in a room that is constantly 75 degrees or more.

I embrace my frosting and so do my customers. I had a woman last week say that she loved my candles but that she was so sad that the frosting on them was gone and had I switched waxes?

Delived fresh candles today and she came into the tobacco shop and was all happy to see the frosting one the Pumpkin Pie candles.! It just made her day. And of course she bought the candles too.

Thanks so much for the encouragement Fire and Ice. I sure appreciate it. I think once I break the ice selling to the general public and not just friends it won't be such a big deal to me. In my thread regarding Pier 1 Import Comparison a little further down the board, I mentioned what I saw in that store also helped my attitude. I am trying real hard to embrace the frosting. Thanks again for your positive note.

[Soyoholic]

Holly,

I won't make candles in the evening in the winter. Not only do the candles seem more prone to frost but also to wet spots. What temperature did you add the FO. I can tell you the worst frost I ever had was when I added the FO at 125 degrees. I had got busy and before I knew it the wax was down to 125. Since I switched to KYSOY125 I've not frosted one time and no wet spots. I never heat my jars. I do make sure that the jars have been in my house for 24 hours. I usually have to bring these in from the garage which is pretty cold.

Bobbie

[Holly]

Holly,

I won't make candles in the evening in the winter. Not only do the candles seem more prone to frost but also to wet spots. What temperature did you add the FO. I can tell you the worst frost I ever had was when I added the FO at 125 degrees. I had got busy and before I knew it the wax was down to 125. Since I switched to KYSOY125 I've not frosted one time and no wet spots. I never heat my jars. I do make sure that the jars have been in my house for 24 hours. I usually have to bring these in from the garage which is pretty cold.

Bobbie

Hi Bobbie,

Thanks for your response. I told myself that I was not going to make candles again at night, and what do I do? Make candles at night -- last night. I did not get enough done during the day so I continued to make them. Altought, they were only testers. I am glad that you mentioned about not making them at night. It reinforces it. That is exactly what I have noticed - that they tend to frost more when you make them at night when it is cold. I don't seem to notice any additional frost on any of my other candles that are setting where they can get just as cold.

Last night I decided to pour a KY-125 candle to see if it has frosting issues. I bought a 3 lb. bag but it has been in my cupboard, and I was in no hurry to test because I really like the scent throw with the CB-3 Calsoy and how the scents smell in it. I also love the quickness of getting it and the better shipping cost -- can get it in WA. Well, I made one with Blueberry Muffin and made it a nice dark blueberry blue. This one normally will frost on me. I could kind of tell right before I went to bed that it was going to be better in the frost department. I just woke up and ran downstairs and NO FROST! There may be a few tiny wet spots but I could careless about that. The tops are shinnier and has a different look but I don't mind that either.

Three of my CB-3 candles that I made last night have the most frost I have ever seen yet! Where's the color! I might as well gone colorless! Then two other ones look great. And I even tried to keep them warmer -- kept them in an oven all night -- not a real warm one but one that was slightly warm to begin with and I am sure it would be a little warmer in there through the night than outside of it. I kept the KY-125 ouside so I could compare performance -- I usually keep my CB-3's out on the counter too.

I actually do not mind some frost. It is the really bad blotchy kind -- all over. To me it just does not look good. I mean this is the ugly kind. I kinda like the kind that is more of a delicate look. I don't know how the scent throw with the KY-125 is going to compare with the CB-3. If it is as good it will be tempting but then I will have more shipping. Also, I hope the fragrances smell as good in the KY-125.

Another thing I can do, is make my CB-3 candles that I normal make a dark color a little lighter. I do notice the more liquid dye I use the worse the frost gets. I am even using the Pryme dye. This can be an option with the CB-3. I don't know if I am ready to go colorless yet.

Thanks again for the tip and I will try to refrain from making canldes at night.

~Holly