Soy Wax...is this accurate?

[Judy, USMC]

I've had experience with both paraffin and soy. With the proper additives you can make the burn last a comparable period of time or the same throw strength. I think with everything you have noted about the modifications you will be making this page will answer a lot of questions your customers may have. If you do not address the safety issues in another area of your site you may wish to address them on this page also.

Breathing problems are legitimate concerns that should be researched and addressed. There is a recent reformulation that was made here in the states - I believe it was Black Cherry. I believe the reason for reformulation was a possible carcinogen was used in the original formula.

Jar warmers have become popular here in the past few years. There are also some warming plates that are being sold to set the candle jar on to melt. The problem is there are also coffee mug warmers that look similar. However the wattage on the mug warmers is higher than the ones specifically designed for candles. The jars can become overheated at the base and shatter and that leads to the exploding jar theory. That's one of the questions you mentioned that I did not see addressed.

I appreciate the thorough research (including the opinions expressed herein) being presented in such a well written document. Will you be posting the final draft?

[NattyCat]

I will post a final draft if people want me to?

I understand about the jar warmers issue, but I didn't mention it as we don't have them here in the UK - they are not available anywhere any nobody really knows about them. I was considering importing them for sale, but they would have to be sold with a voltage convertor and this pushes the price up to over $40 a piece, which a customer is unlikely to pay.

[CareBear]

I will post a final draft if people want me to?

I understand about the jar warmers issue, but I didn't mention it as we don't have them here in the UK - they are not available anywhere any nobody really knows about them. I was considering importing them for sale, but they would have to be sold with a voltage convertor and this pushes the price up to over $40 a piece, which a customer is unlikely to pay.

Love to see what you ended up with - but if you post it you WILL get more feedback!!!

Next time I"d recommend posting a link to your verbiage rather than putting the text here - that way you can edit and people can comment on the most recent version as opposed to what they still see at the top of the thread. Just keep track of when you make changes so that you know to what version they refer!

I think it's great you looked for input on all this! It's a hot topic but everyone stayed pretty cool.

[Scented]

Hi Annie

I understand what you're saying but if you'd read my previous posts you'll know. I spend SO much time on the phone with customers ringing me asking about soy that it's driving me crazy. I had one lady saying that she wanted to buy my soy candles because she didn't want to get cancer from paraffin candles. Another lady said she loved burning 4 or 5 candles in the same small room as her fish tank and the fish kept dying - she was told that they'd be OK if it was a soy candle.

Another lady told me she heard paraffin candles get so hot they exploded and another told me etc etc etc etc..... I am spending so much time on the phone or answering emails that its taking up time I don't always have.

I expect the reason why a lot of soy candle makers are doing this is due to a domino effect. One stupid idiot publishes a wagon full of crap about soy and paraffin on their websites and then along comes a newbie candlemaker, reads that info and copies it onto THEIR website - then another candlemaker reads that and copies it onto THEIR website. Soon enough, you have a bunch of customers all reading the same false information about paraffin vs soy and they then come running to their usual candle supplier asking questions or seeking confirmation. There could be someone who has been happily burning paraffn candles who stumbles across a website spouting false information about it, and its that sort of person who rings up asking question after question.

That's probably why many soy candlemakers put information on their websites. unfortunately most of it is inaccurate and I'm trying to address that.

NOT only that, but they make new shit up. Did you know that paraffin will cause Mona Lisa's smile to fade away and that it will cause oil paintings to flake and peal off the canvas. Just wait. Your lunatic calls have only started and all because of what you said.

However, I still will challenge on my points lol.

[NattyCat]

the fumes from a paraffin candle can make you blind dontcha know.

[DonC]

Just my 2 cents, as I see it.

Para candles are inferior to soy candles in many ways.

Soy candles are inferior to para candles in many ways.

Volkswagons gets superior fuel mileage to SUVs, but if you get hit, you're screwed!!

SUVs are safer for the occupants if they are hit, but get lousey fuel mileage.

People buy what they are comfortable with for different reasons.

For me, burning soy candles in my home is a personal choice based on facts as I know them.

Based on this personal choice, I choose to make and sell them as well.

I don't push soy on anyone. If you want soy candles, you will buy them. If not, you won't.

I sell only soy candles because I believe that in their natural state, they burn cleaner and longer. Only MY opinion.

As for a seperate page on my website to explain what soy candles are and are not, that won't happen. People are perfectly capable of doing their own research and making up their own minds based on their own opinion.

If customers start calling me asking questions, I will give them my opinion and suggest that they do a google on soy wax and come up with answers on their own, and form their own opinions based on the "facts" as they understand them. I really do believe that they will respect you and your business more if you do that, rather than trying to "jam" soy down their throat with "facts" that may, or may not be "facts".

Just my 2 cents...................

[racolvin]

Oddly enough I didn't choose to change to soy for some sort of perceived difference in carcinogens, carbon footprints, etc. I could never find conclusive studies either way. The National Candle Association is no help, since the vast majority of their members are paraffin makers, distributors, and candle makers, they wouldn't say anything bad about paraffin even if it were true, for fear of pissing off the members

Honestly I went with soy for two reasons: 1) economic - soy wax from my local supplier was WAY cheaper than paraffin waxes I used in the past, and 2) the less money I gave the international petroleum markets the better I liked it.

By using soy wax I have a greater probability of helping out my US soybean farmers, since the wax I use is made from soybean oil here in the US. No guarantees of course since Golden Brands could get soybean oil from anywhere but I'd be willing to bet the vast majority of their soy oil comes from local farmers.

[Di_in_AZ]

Sadly US Soybean farmers benefitting is becoming a myth. I just saw on the news the US is now importing 50% of their soybeans from China. The soybean farmers have been cutting production. I never understand why the US does this. I know they get it cheaper from China, but the US farmers cannot compete and end up dropping that product as a crop. I hope alot of the soywax producers continue to buy from US only, but there will be a price increase as the US shifts from petroleum products to eco-friendly products and then the almighty dollar will talk. You can already see this is the grocery store .

[racolvin]

Oh total bummer. One of these days we'll end up not being able to produce a single thing .. we'll be the geographic equivalent of "I'm more of an idea man .."

[cybersix]

In my opinion the only point vegetable waxes have is that petroleum will end, sooner or later. We should learn to be petroleum indepedent, not only for the cost but because in the future there will be no more petroleum to use.

You see everyday the cost of petroleum getting higher and it's not going down (humans already went through different energetic crisis but the cost of petroleum after an increase went back to normal), our paraffin for our candles will cost more and more, and one day there will be no paraffin candlemakers at all.

This is the only point. Then you can push it and say vegetable waxes are healthier to burn and help local economy (this point I don't understand, paraffin industries are every where on the planet and give job to a lot of people.. what those people would do if their industry close? Never thought about it?)

I don't believe in any of the myth or facts about soy. Now it's imported from china as almost everything else. Chinese life is really hard, they work more hours than we do, sleep in the same plcae they work, China is one the worst country in matter of human rights and one of the first in producing pollution.

Would you write this on a site?

I'd say there's no need to expalin what is soy wax. It's a wax.

Natasha I'm not saying you don't have to prepare a page for your customers if this will save you a lot of time.

But I'd simply write that soy wax comes from soy beans, and nothing heard around has been proved.

If you make the customers think there's really something important about they will have always more questions.

Of this stupid debate about soy and paraffin only wax industry is responsible.

And some candlemakers are too.

Then they load up their soy candles to 11%FO now guess how natural and healthier is that candle. Evertyhing that gets burned realeses something in the air. It's burning!!! You don't create anything, you don't destroy anything. Everything transforms into something else.

Just my opinion.

[stacien]

I can honestly say you could put right or wrong on both wax and people will steal eat up the marketing jargan no matter if you are truthful or not. They all believe what they read at some point. If you said manure burns the best and is the safest. People would believe it and start buying it. That is marketing. You all may not like it trying to make it as honest as possible. However there will always be some other Chandler above you because of stratigic marketing.

Out of all fairness it doesn't have to be an essay on the fact's and myth's of soy. People will lose interest about 1/3 down the list. Make it short and to the point. Consumers don't want to hear the downside of soy wax they want to know what makes it stand out from the rest. Why they should buy it over the others. That is what people are tending to forget.

Also instead of enviromentally friendly it should be ecologically friendly.

[Lantern Light Mama]

Dang...just reading the thread made me dizzy! Geez guys, can't we just all get along? I like how some folks said people are going to buy it because they like it. I like the fact that it is renewable, whether it's from china or the US or Africa, it's still something that can help any farmer. How green is green? Carbon footprints? We should all plant our own soy! It's about caring about the earth in the first place, let's not get so technical that we have lost sight of why we started using alternatives in the first place...to decrease our dependency on any one thing. In my experience, the soy does throw better than most candles available, so that's my marketing point. As well as it burns to the edge and you get full use of the candle. Again, proper wicking here. But, I digress...this could go on and on and on.