NattyCat

yes, another supplier bites the dust. First Cierra and now Solas. They will be closing 30th June with 25% off all items. Nat

the problem I find when pouring it in that crystal state top, is that you then get jump lines where the wax instantly cools against the glass. If you heat the glass so this doesn't happen - that affects the temperature of the wax that is closest to the glass - hence inconsistent cooling.

I cooled mine in the oven and under boxes, and the tops came out like regurgitated cottage cheese.

I get cavities with Cb-135 also. I have poured at so many different temperatures, in warmed glass, cool glass, etc etc and I still get them. It ruins the candle. The only thing you can do if you know you get cavities is to do as I do and poke relief holes whilst the candle is setting up - and then do a repour. You WILL get people responding to this thread telling you that you are pouring your candles wrong, and that CB-135 DOESN'T get cavities - but ignore them - seriously - it DOES happen and after extensive testing, I still cannot figure out why. Nat

Does anyone have any suggestions on wicking E-123 Palm Wax? It's a container wax that is non-crystallizing, from Candle Science. I'm wicking a 3 inch tumbler but can't seem to get it to work. Thanks Nat

oh yes indeedy! our stocks have gone through the ROOF! Although perhaps I shouldn't say that, cos technically we're making money from other people suffering! But still - woo hoo!

Got some samples of golden brands 464 and palm 132 (smooth palm/non crystallizing) from Candle Science so will let you know how I get on with those.

On the same note, does anyone know of suppliers of palm wax that ISN'T fancy? I mean like a palm-fat wax which looks like soy when it sets up - without all the feathering/starburst/glass glow stuff? I'd like to try other waxes, like rapeseed and palm that were not crystallizing - but wouldn't know where to start trying to find that sort of wax. Jakealex - I hear you - but if it's no different then I guess it's not really hurt to try it. I'm just gonna try as many waxes as possible seeing as I don't have to pay to get them shipped here! Nat

is 464 definately one pour? Does it have good glass adhesion? Thanks!

Hi All I currently use Ecosoya, and no matter what I do with it, it's not one pour for me. If I pour just once, even if it sets up beautifully, there is ALWAYS a cavity near the wick that sucks down the entire meltpool, which in turn exposes too much of the wick and destroys the candle. I always have to poke relief holes and then heat gun the tops smooth. This amount of work is restrictive when doing wholesale accounts, but I have been told by one of my accounts that they will ship in a new wax for me as it will increase my production rate. SO....what's REALLY a good one-pour wax? I really don't want suggestions as to how I can improve CB-135, or replace with any other Ecosoya product - I'd like a totally different wax. Over here in the UK we only get one sort of wax - which is Ecosoya, so if someone is going to pay to ship me a new wax then I want to try different ones. What's your experience with any other wax? I was thinking about Golden Brands 464. Are there any other waxes out there that are truly one pour? they have to be soy waxes, not blends. Wouldn't even mind palm wax, but not a feathering/star/frost one, more of a palm fat wax if available. Thanks in advance, Nat

no joy with mine - still yellowing. I'm really not satisfied with the answer I got. So it's "environment" that causes this problem? Well, my products are on shelves, being sold to the general public - I can't store my products in a darkened box just to keep the labels white - my products are subjected to light, dust, and are sat on wooden shelving - that's RETAIL! The whole REASON I got my labels printed was because it would be more professional than anything I could produce myself. My labels are beginning to look totally disgusting as they are mostly white. They look like they've been sitting around since the 50's, not two months. Why should I now have to spray a protective gloss onto my professionally printed labels to stop them yellowing? Surely it's a manufacturing fault and it should be the supplier looking into ways of ensuring our label remain white and pristine instead of the piss yellow they seem to turn when not hermetically sealed in a darkened box?

Now that Cierra is closing - gonna need a new source for those boxes!

Another one bites the dust: http://www.cierracandles.com/message.aspx

Jesus Inez, if anyone has ants in their pants it's you - why are you referring to me in the third person?? I didn't realise there was a time limit on when replies should be posted. I backed away from this thread for a little while to a) diffuse the situation and let it calm down, do some research on wax types and c) think about the direction I wanted to go in with regard to the wax and certification. Just as it calms down around here, you come in with your "snippy" little comments, being all touchy with hurt feelings! Ok. I'm not interested in lipidchem as it is not organic, so if they were the only option that I will pass on that. I am interested in the other organic wax you can obtain as long as I could see the documentation first to prove that it was organic. I don't know when I would need the wax, but I imagine 3-4 weeks is too soon, I'm still at the QUOTE stage so haven't even sent them a price or even been chosen as the supplier - it could all come to nothing. There's nothing more I can add. I can't give you a definate yes, no or maybe until I see documented proof that this wax is organic. I already found one supplier - accuwax - who said their wax was organic and it turns out that it's NOT organic, so I need to make sure this isn't the same situation. I also cant' tell you how much I'd need - but at a guess it would be 2,000lbs to start with, and I can't tell you when I'd need, because I don't know. Sorry.

Seriously, you shouldn't even be fretting over this. Air freshener blanks are dirt cheap, small, don't take up any space and you could fit hundreds in a very small box. Take WAY too many with you and then that's your problem solved - you'll always have enough. Take 400/600/800 - it's not like they're going to take up the whole of your car/truck - you can fit that many in the glove compartment. There really isn't a big deal to be made about this, I just think you're in a tizzy over doing the show and have fixated on this too much. Just chill and enjoy the show.

yes, they've just clarified it for me: Hi Natasha, You are correct. All of the ingredients we use are all 100% certified organic but since our facility/process are not certified, the finished blend is not "certified" organic. We usually supply our customers the certification documents of the ingredients that we get from our suppliers & that is usually enough. Regards, Henry Shishido General Manager Ubure, the company I am dealing with is in the UK only. I am not fixated on soy - in fact I couldn't care less if it was paraffin, soy, palm or ear wax - as long as it was organic and I could get enough of it. Nat

by the way, i don't believe a word of it on that lumia website. They create their own certified organic soybeans for their own candle use? They can actually grow soybeans, process them and turn them into wax - but just enough for their own candles? They're the only company who do organic candles? If that were the case I'm sure their set up would be a bit more professional - and where on the site does it give the certification info?

Swan are getting their wax from www.accu-blend.com which, as I posted earlier, I'm in contact with. It's because of the stringent standards that we have over here in Europe (we're not even allowed to sell soap that hasn't been tested and certified for EACH recipe) that I'm trying to find out this wax data. If I cannot find certified organic wax, then it's simple - I won't make the candle and I advise the client that it's not possible. But they have asked me to research into organic wax, and that's what I'm doing. If there is no such thing, then i'll tell them so. It would be foolish of me to lie to them and say something is organic if it isn't - because when they submit the candle to the Soil Association for certification, the Soil Association will come to me for all the documentation pertaining to every single ingredient, from the wick, the wax and the essential oil so I cannot find suppliers who can provide me with that documentation - then I don't buy product from that supplier. It's as simple as that. And yes you are right, organic does NOT just pertain to food, it also includes clothing, textiles, wood products, bath and body items and hair care products.

I am actually agreeing with you Stella. I don't want a wax where the supplier merely "says" its organic when in fact their claims are worth less than the paper they are written on. The fact that I am trying to find organic wax, that is 100% documented by a reputable governing body shows that I am not just trying to make a fast buck. IF I sell an organic candle, I want it to BE an organic candle and I am certainly NOT leaving things uninvestigated - hence the whole point of me starting this thread. I did search before I posted, but apart from Swan, who supply Accu wax, which we now know is NOT as organic as they have led us to believe, there are no other posts on organic wax suppliers that I saw. Perhaps I missed it. In the UK, we have an organisation called the Soil Association. They are the leading authority on all things organic and they will not accept anything less than 100% accurate data on the origins of any ingredients - why is why I was looking for certified wax. The only way you can prove that a product is organic is by submitting it to the governing body of whatever country you happen to live in and they are the ones who will say if it's organic or not - not me, or you or even the wax suppliers. It seems Accu Wax are not as organic as they claim to be, so it's back to the drawing board. It also seems I've pissed Ubure off enough that won't share the info she found, so I will continue to look for organic wax. If anyone can contribute by giving the name of a manufacturer who actually CAN supply organic wax and can PROVE it then I'm all ears.

in CASE anyone is interested, here is the reply i got from accuwax: Dear Natasha, Our all natural Organic Container Candle Blend #44 is made with 100% certified organic raw materials. Unfortunately our facility/manufacturing process are not yet certified organic. We are opening an other facility on May 1st & will begin the certification process then on our organic blends. Regards, Henry Shishido General Manager I have emailed him and asked him exactly what this means. Does it mean that all the individual ingredients are organic but the END product, ie the WAX is not organic or what.

Then perhaps you are reading it incorrectly ubure. I am in no way being arrogant. At the beginning of this thread I specifically asked that we didn't get involved in arguments regarding what does and does not make an "organic" candle, yet it seems that people went right ahead and tried to "teach" me as if I was born yesterday. Look - I was not being rude to Stella, and I'm not being rude to you - If you read my reply again you will see that I was merely clarifying what "organic" meant and what would be acceptable to me as "organic". If you choose to read into it MORE than necessary, or choose to be offended by a post that was not mean to cause offence - then really that is a situation you need to deal with yourself. And seeing as I don't actually post here very often now, whether my business is successful or not is not broadcast around this forum, I do not brag or talk about my accounts etc - I think I have just ONCE posted a picture of a candle I did for a wholesale customer - so I don't know where you get off implying that I have an attitude because I feel I'm more successful than others? I can assure you, there are people on this forum who are doing MUCH better than I am. At the end of the day - opinions are like arseholes, everyone has one and you're welcome to have yours just as much as everyone else.

as I said, I didn't want to get into the ins and out of what is and isn't an organic candle, there is no need to applaude MY intentions - I am merely doing some research for wholesale account that could possibly be extremely HUGE for me. I asked if there was anyone out there that was claiming to produce a certified organic wax and so far I have just the one, which is accu wax. I have emailed them and asked to see their certification. IF their certification proves to be genuine, and by a reputable governing body such as the soil association or whatever the American equivelent is, then that is, as far as I'm concerned, good enough and as close to organic as any candle is going to get. I think you'll find that ANY product certified organic has to reach a minimum of 70% organic ingredients, whether it be food, cleaning products, body care products or whatever - and this allows for the fact that there ARE processes in product manufacture that can not be organic. It is physically impossible to have something 100% organic unless you were around at the time of the earth's creation and can trace every single activity that ever went on in the patch of earth that you are growing your organic produce in. Mass manufacture requires machinery, and the use of non-organic fuels etc, which is WHY the word ORGANIC means "70% organic" and not 100% organic. I'm not asking for someone to assert to me that "oh yea, our stuff is organic" I am asking for a product that IS ALREADY certified. If a product is certified as organic by a reputable governing body, then it doesn't matter what you, me or the pope thinks "organic" means - it's organic, and that's that. I know I need to use essential oils, and I have a supplier of 100% organic certifed essential oils - and yes, they cost an absolute fortune. I am also in the process of sourcing wick made from 100% organic cotton. So yes, you CAN produce an organic candle, as long as every individual element you add is CERTIFIED organic by a reputable governing body and understand that nothing is EVER 100% organic.

OK, I don't want this thread to turn ugly - so please refrain from the whole organic/soy debate if you can't actually answer my question! Over here in the UK we have an organisation called "The Soil Association" and every product endorsed by this organisation is certified organic. I have been asked to look into creating a candle that is organic, but to do this I would need to source CERTIFED organic wax. Are there any manufacturers who provide certified organic soy wax? I'm not looking for someone who just "says" their wax is organic just because it's soy, it has to have fully backed up documentation. Also - and this is a long shot - is there such a thing as an organic wick? or a wick made from organic cotton? Thanks Nat

Gorgeous! Did you make the boxes or manage to find them that size?

Does anyone know if there is a supplier out there who does duplication of Banana Republic candle scents? In particular their "Tea Leaves" scent. http://www.bananarepublic.com/browse/product.do?cid=25491&pid=441575 Thanks