Cheated on weight of oils??

[leisa2003]

Do the majority of you candlemakers, take the time to weigh your oils, after you receive them?

I have just recently visited my main supplier, and seen how they are weighing oils, with a piece of sand paper taped to the scale (must be a slipperage thing) . Anyways, and when I got home with my last order, I placed my oils on the scale, it didnt even weigh 8 oz. with the lid on it even. Was thinking ...( do I have a brain fart or what,) but aren't we paying for 8 oz. of product, even if we are weighing the

bottle...etc???

If I am wrong on this whole weight thing, someone fill me in, cause then I am paying for "different description" then what these suppliers are describing.

I wont list supplier name on here, been their before and seen what happens on here, when you list the supplier name with a negative exsperience.:tiptoe: I am just curious of this weight thing, since I seen how these oils are being weighed; and I have never weighed my oils before now. Just wondering if most of you take the time to do so.

Thanks for any insight!

[NattyCat]

as far as I am aware, you should be getting 8oz of oil - not including the bottle and cap. They should be putting the bottle on the scales, setting it back to zero and then adding the 8oz of oil. They should add the cap after they've added 8oz of oil. The cost of the product should allow for the cost of the bottle and cap, so they should NOT be included in the weight -and if they are you are being seriously ripped off.

I think you SHOULD let us know who is using these practices, as none of us want to pay for oil that we don't get!

[TxSioux]

I'm guessing you're buying from a supplier that you know reads this forum. 8oz of oil should never include the bottle. I'm not sure about an 8oz bottle, but most every 16oz bottle I've weighed comes in at 1.2oz & that would be a noticeable amount of missing fo. If you have a full bottle of oil that weighs less then 8oz including the bottle, I'd be questioning if the fragrance is being diluted w/ a heavy carrier oil. Do you use these fo's a lot, & how do they burn? Bottom line -- I think we all owe it to one another to warn of a questionable supplier. I don't have money to be throwing away & it makes me mad when I post a complaint & lots of people send a pm to say they had the same problem. Geez, that would have been nice to know before I got burned!

Susan.

[coconut]

It seems unlikely that they would let you visit their facility if they are trying to pull a fast one. First, I would calibrate your scale at home. This involves weighing an item of a known guaranteed weight and you may have to buy some little weights to do this. If you are positive your scale is correct and that the bottles are underweight, I would contact the supplier and give them a chance to address the problem. If they will not give satisfaction at this point, then it would be appropriate to stop doing business with them and post their name on this site if that is allowed. But first, you should always give a business a chance to address the problem. This is called "making you whole" and it is a proper business practice.

[leisa2003]

Thanks ladies!

I checked the weigh once again, using an empty 8 oz. bottle without cap, and tared that, I am not getting an 8 oz. of oil...its 6.7/8 oz. I did e-mail them to maybe check their scale. They don't know me by email.:tiptoe: I also checked a brand new bottle of tylenol I got from the supper market, w/ my scale and it weighs 4 7/8 oz. and its a 4 oz. bottle, so the 7/8 must be the bottle.

I buy my wax from them, so I dont want to ruin business with them, cause I save considerably to be able to pick-up.

Their are other suppliers I deal with, that I can just deal with them for my oils.

The reason I dont want to name this supplier is also because, you may have 3-4 ppl here appreciate knowing who the supplier is, and you'll get more then that who do business with this supplier, and they will tell you, they never had a problem with them, and they will literally bash you for naming a supplier that they use and swear by.

Maybe by me sending them an e-mail, they will check their scale, and if it was done intentionally, they will be more careful.

Thanks again, for your advice!

[Candlebuddy]

This happend to me a few years ago ... and I did contact the supplier to work things out ... long story short, I was not able to reason with the supplier, so I cut my loses and just didn't order again. Posting a name would only make things get ugly and most likely be deleted by the mods. I think you're handling this the right way.

[CareBear]

first callibrate your scale properly. 5 quarters will weigh one ounce, or better yet use callibration weights. Checking it agains a bottle of Tylenol is far from accurate - you don't even know what it actually weighs! And just as an aside - the weights of the empty bottles themselves can vary. But if your scale is operating correctly then you probably were shorted.

Next, contact the supplier. If they don't answer your email then call them. They should make good. If they don't, or if you don't like their response then don't do business with them.

It's unfortunate, but it does happen from time to time. I once got a short bottle from Peak and they replaced it, no problemo. With the oils having different densities/specific gravities errors are not suprising.

And if you can not get things resolved with the vendor THEN think about posting the name - at this point you don't really know how they will react. How would you feel if there was a whole thread slamming this company and then they responded properly - they would have been publicly bashed for no reason.

If you have a complaint the proper thing to do is give the vendor a chance to address it.

[leisa2003]

As I have mentioned previously, I am NOT posting any name. And yes, you are correct about checking weight on different bottles etc.... Just wanted to check to see if other items I had on hand weighed close to what was said on the bottle. (just checking my scale).

Even if they don't make right by it, under this circumstance, I am not posting any vendors name. Dont need to do that, and if others are curious, maybe they just need to check the weights on their products they receive, if afraid they may get shorted. Believe me, I will be checking things more. And by all means, it may have been just a error by mistake, nothing intentional, I hope.

[Sharon in KY]

I have two companies that do that every time I order. I have told them both and have had them send the exact amount missing. One company has very good prices and I will let them get by with it if it's not too much. The other has higher prices and I tell them but at least once they were out and I had to wait for more and then had to call to get it. I continue to order and hope with my bitching and them having to make it up they will finally get it right. I'm sure it is very hard to fill bottles to get exact weights that's why most fill a little over. I'll keep ordering cause it's better than testing a hundred new scents to find one as good.. IMHO

[8-GRAN-ONES]

I have never even thought of weighing my oils..

But I guess you can never be to careful.

I to think you have done the right thing about

not posting the vendors name.

I think the only time that should be done, is

when all else fails, to make the problem right..

or if it is a continuing problem..

That is just my humble opinion..

[beesweet]

You'd be surprised how often this happens from a multitude of suppliers. Some I suspect aren't accidents... We used one long-time, VERY well-known supplier for fundraiser scents and at first, could never figure out why we'd run out of FO and have to rush another order in...until we finally started checking weights on the bottles. It's no wonder they have such great prices.

If a supplier sells by weight, I expect 16 oz. for my money. Some oils are lighter and won't weigh 16 oz. even filled to the brim. (For all my other gripes at times with prices, I do have to give DS kudos for sending one of their scents in 2 8oz. bottles to give you the correct weight.) IMO FO's should be just like any other ingredient we buy...we base our costs on weights for everything else, so if FOs aren't based on weight, 9 times out of 10 we're shortchanging ourselves with pricing. Just my 2 cents...

[gloworm]

You ladies are very correct. You should get your full FO amount minus the bottle & cap weight. Every bottle we send out is weighed. It is very time consuming especially on those one ouncers but fair is fair. I can't imagine short changing by counting the bottle weight in.

Glo

[thecandlespastore]

I recently started noticing this as well. Actually, I can't say recently because I have always noticed but just brushed it aside, but lately it pisses me off. Happened to me 2 days ago in fact. I don't know until I go to make a batch of soap and suddenly my 4 oz bottle of FO only measures out 2.1 ounces into my dixie cup, leaving me an empty bottle. This seriously pissed me off, if I wanted only 2 oz of FO I would have bought a 2 oz bottle instead of paying twice the amount (but I guess then I would have only had 1 ounce.) Suppliers who do this, we are on to you, PLEASE STOP! You will only lose customers this way.

I think all suppliers should weigh their oils, period, and give you what you pay for, the oil, not the weight of the bottle included which is completely useless to us.

[thecandlespastore]

You'd be surprised how often this happens from a multitude of suppliers. Some I suspect aren't accidents... We used one long-time, VERY well-known supplier for fundraiser scents and at first, could never figure out why we'd run out of FO and have to rush another order in...until we finally started checking weights on the bottles. It's no wonder they have such great prices.

If a supplier sells by weight, I expect 16 oz. for my money. Some oils are lighter and won't weigh 16 oz. even filled to the brim. (For all my other gripes at times with prices, I do have to give DS kudos for sending one of their scents in 2 8oz. bottles to give you the correct weight.) IMO FO's should be just like any other ingredient we buy...we base our costs on weights for everything else, so if FOs aren't based on weight, 9 times out of 10 we're shortchanging ourselves with pricing. Just my 2 cents...

I love DS with her 2 8 oz bottles for the oils that cant fit into 16 oz bottles. At least we know we are getting what we pay for, by far one of my favorite suppliers.

[Christy Doc Holley]

I love DS with her 2 8 oz bottles for the oils that cant fit into 16 oz bottles. At least we know we are getting what we pay for, by far one of my favorite suppliers.

I :highfive: DS for doing this .If we are being charged for it I damn well want what I paid for . I can see it happening once in a while but if its on going that is out right stealing .

[beesweet]

I brushed it aside for a number of years as well, but with costs being what they are, no more. I can understand the volume thing if prices were adjusted accordingly, but when a bottle has quite a bit of space at the top and still doesn't weigh out, that makes me furious. If you think about it, for every 16 bottles of FO that's an oz. short, they are making an extra $14-16 free and clear. I've had some 2 oz. or more short, so I'm guessing that they are getting 3 lbs extra if they buy in 25 lb increments. Perhaps that's how they keep everything at the same price...

I'm a bit obsessive about checking weights and I've recently noticed shortages with oils, butters, and other soap ingredients as well.

[Darbla]

Hooo boy. I never thought about this, but I will definitely be weighing everything now!

[leisa2003]

Hooo boy. I never thought about this, but I will definitely be weighing everything now!

I agree with ya, I am surely checking my oils from now on also. A ounce here and their is definately money lost to me. Hope everyone is more careful from now on. We all should be sure to let the suppliers know when this happens, so they can make right by it and know that their customers do pay attention to what they are buying.

[Christy Doc Holley]

I remember years ago on the original TSR board the owner of that board can't think of his name right now:o . anyways it was a very well known supplier he had it out with because the oils were measuring off .i can't remember all the details but it got very nasty with him and the supplier .Honestly I believed him over the the supplier too . I don't think the supplier ever admiited any wrong doing either.

and really id 1 person stops ordering from a company they really don't care cause you have faithful people who will follow them no matter what as long as its not happening to them .

[byrd46740]

You all are far more understanding then I am about this whole weight thing. I am quite sure that I am not the only one who was taught in school that liquids are measured in fluid ounces!!! Nothing use to make me feel more robbed then to get my oil orders in and find them an inch or more down from the top!! Now there are suppliers out there that don't go by the weight thing - SOS being one right off the top of my head and I say Kudos to them!!! Well, at least they use to always fill the bottles, guess I haven't ordered from them in a couple of years tho. When I get in a 35 lb drum of oil and its a heavier oil, I may only get 28 16oz bottles out of it, but I would rather do that then ever send out a bottle that looks like the ones I have received from some of the big suppliers.

I do know that there was a supplier, I beleive they were located in Ohio and I think they were bought by ICS. They calculated the weight of the bottle in with the 16oz, but they were up front about it and it stated it right there for you to see. Didn't make it right, but at least they were honest about it.

Now dealing with manufacturers, I can tell you that the whole selling by weight starts there with them and if you think they sell the oils for dirt cheap like I use to think, that is wrong. They aren't cheap, but I can guarentee you that the supply houses are making a darn good profit too. Imagine how we would complain if gasoline ever became as expensive as fragrance oil. We would be paying about $130 a gallon That really puts things into perspective doesn't it LOL

[HeavenScentU]

I have to ask. If I receive a 3/4 full 8 oz. FO because it is a heavy oil am I still going to get 8-1 oz. out of it?? Does that make sense.

[leisa2003]

I have to ask. If I receive a 3/4 full 8 oz. FO because it is a heavy oil am I still going to get 8-1 oz. out of it?? Does that make sense.

No, of course your not going to get 8-1oz. out of it! But I want to ask, are you paying for 8 oz. of FO? Emagine charging our customers for different weights of our candles..."well this candle is parrafin and it weighs more then my soy candles, and my zinc waxxed wicks weighs more then the cd ones." HMMMM!!!! I guess we'd be telling our customers you have to pay extra for this candle cause we pay the same price for oils, but get less on this type of oil, cause its heavier.

I also know that different suppliers use different weight bottles also, so we could throw that into the air also.

[bren31]

I am confused i was under the impression if you buy 16oz bottle your getting 16 fluid ounces not 16 oz by weight? I know some scents are lighter then others, but when adding your scent to you weigh it or measure it in a liquid measuring cup? Currently i use a shot glass with measurements on it. Seems like every scent i have has a different dry weight to it. If i am suppose to dry weight everything this is going to be more confusing lol. Thanks for the interesting post.

[leisa2003]

I am confused i was under the impression if you buy 16oz bottle your getting 16 fluid ounces not 16 oz by weight? I know some scents are lighter then others, but when adding your scent to you weigh it or measure it in a liquid measuring cup? Currently i use a shot glass with measurements on it. Seems like every scent i have has a different dry weight to it. If i am suppose to dry weight everything this is going to be more confusing lol. Thanks for the interesting post.

Nope, we aren't getting 16 fluid oz. We are getting 16 oz. by weight. And it should be minus bottle. They put their empty bottle on the scale, tare it, and pour the oil in till it reads 16 oz. by the weight on their scale. Some I have found don't take off the weight of the bottle, even though they should. And some, as you can see from this thread, may try to short ya a bit, thinking we dont check. It all confuses me to Bren!! Seems like it all would be much easier if it were just in volume. But it all confuses me, theirs prolly a negative to the volume part also.

[CareBear]

I am quite sure that I am not the only one who was taught in school that liquids are measured in fluid ounces!!!

Selling by volume would NOT be helpful as our formulas are based on weight. I cannot imagine having to then back-calculate to see how much FO I need to order. While we call our formulas recipes, they are not your basic kitchen recipe. Always work in weights (and in France, for example, they even do food recipes in weight) - much more accurate.