Joannec Posted June 7, 2012 Share Posted June 7, 2012 Hi everyone,I have been making candles with j223 wax. I have attached a picture of my jar that I have been using. The top of the jar is 3.75 inches and the bottom is 4 inches. I have been trying to double wick this jar, I have tried zincs, cotton core, and ecos. So far I prefer the ecos as there is no soot and hardly any mushrooming, however when I first light the candle the throw is awesome after a couple of hours I can hardly smell it anymore. Can the candle stop throwing its scent? if so does this mean that the wicks are not right? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HorseScentS Posted June 7, 2012 Share Posted June 7, 2012 (edited) I had the same problem with the HT when I tried to double-wick the 4" wide, 16 oz Ball Elite jar with 4627: The HT was very strong at first, but it disappeared as the flames started drowning and got too small to heat the melt pool. Edited June 7, 2012 by HorsescentS Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joannec Posted June 7, 2012 Author Share Posted June 7, 2012 The wicks don't seem to be drowning yet. I made another jar as well with 2 x .5 eco's and the wicks on that do seem to die down abit when there is about an inch of wax left that's why I decided to do the Eco 1's. I can't understand why the hot throw is amazing when first lit though? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChandlerWicks Posted June 7, 2012 Share Posted June 7, 2012 CandleNose? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joannec Posted June 7, 2012 Author Share Posted June 7, 2012 Mmm not sure, don't think it is though as my husband and mum can't smell it as much now but again when I first lit it they said it was amazing Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joannec Posted June 7, 2012 Author Share Posted June 7, 2012 Ok update, have gone to check on candle and the flames have died down abit and also I can only smell the candle now when I am a couple of feet away. I just don't know what else to do, I really like these jars and would like to continue using them but I just can not get this right Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HorseScentS Posted June 7, 2012 Share Posted June 7, 2012 The wicks don't seem to be drowning yet. I made another jar as well with 2 x .5 eco's and the wicks on that do seem to die down abit when there is about an inch of wax left that's why I decided to do the Eco 1's. I can't understand why the hot throw is amazing when first lit though?In the pic the flames look pretty small, so maybe they were too small to heat the MP enough for an HT. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joannec Posted June 7, 2012 Author Share Posted June 7, 2012 Thanks for input, yes the flames have now gone quite small and I can hardly smell it. I just dont know what else I can do, don't think I can go upto Eco 2 as think that will make the jar too hot Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flicker Posted June 7, 2012 Share Posted June 7, 2012 Thanks for input, yes the flames have now gone quite small and I can hardly smell it. I just dont know what else I can do, don't think I can go upto Eco 2 as think that will make the jar too hotHow long are you curing your candles before your first burn and how many hours does it take to get a complete melt? Typically in a 4" jar people use two 51-32-18z wicks which are closer to a CD 6 or 8 in a 4" jar with 223. I think you are under wicking. Glass WILL be hot. But if your melt isn't hot enough, or deep enough your scent will not be good. Scent comes from melted wax and nothing more or less. I'd try two 6's personally. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joannec Posted June 7, 2012 Author Share Posted June 7, 2012 Hi, thanks for reply. I have been curing about 24 hours? I have tried wicking with zincs before, the biggest I used was 2 x 44-32 and that got to full melt in about an hour so I thought that that was overwicked? I have also tried 2 x 44-28 and again I got full melt really quickly? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flicker Posted June 7, 2012 Share Posted June 7, 2012 That could be some of it. Some scents will take two weeks to totally cure. Plus less than 24 hours and the wicking may be acting different anyway. I'd probably give them a few more days at least. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CandyinVA Posted June 7, 2012 Share Posted June 7, 2012 I use (1) 62 zinc wick and it burns fine for me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robertgibbens Posted June 7, 2012 Share Posted June 7, 2012 Paraffin wax candles do not need curing. If anyone actually looked at the photo they would have noticed that the melt pool is perfect. I don't believe its a wick problem. Id bet my money on your nose just getting used to the smell. Makes sense if others experience the same thing if they have noses too!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brenda (OH) Posted June 8, 2012 Share Posted June 8, 2012 I have the same "no throw" problem testing these jars, I have moved on to other jars even tho I love the look of them. 1 large wick allows too much gray for my liking on the jar at the top due to the shape. When using 2 wicks it is vital to wick for the bottom half of the jar due to air flow issues causing the wicks to piddle out. Therefore wicking up for the bottom half of the jar, 2 wicks are too hot for the beginning which I believe is burning off the fragrance oil causing the "no throw". Atleast that's what I have found no matter how long I cure. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flicker Posted June 8, 2012 Share Posted June 8, 2012 Paraffin wax candles do not need curing. If anyone actually looked at the photo they would have noticed that the melt pool is perfect. I don't believe its a wick problem. Id bet my money on your nose just getting used to the smell. Makes sense if others experience the same thing if they have noses too!!I am not sure where you got your information but ALL candles need to cure. Period. A very minimum of 24 hours to cure paraffin wax itself and the scent can take up to two weeks. I've done this for almost 20 years and worked inside a supply house for 12. Every expert in the industry will tell you the same. No candle needs no cure. The other thing is there was no mention of how long that candle had been burning. If you let a candle go long enough, most will melt and look right. As for candle nose, I agree with that. It happens! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rjdaines Posted June 8, 2012 Share Posted June 8, 2012 I'd love to know the scientific explanation of curing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joannec Posted June 8, 2012 Author Share Posted June 8, 2012 (edited) Thanks everyone for replies. The candle in pic had been burning for roughly 4 hours, after this time the flames did go quite small and there was hardly any throw at all. When the candle is 1st lit I can smell candle within 10 mins and for 1st couple of hours its great then it goes to having no throw. I dont think its candle nose as my husband also states that he can never smell it as good when its been burning a while.Perhaps I will try the 2 x 51z, that does seem big to me as I have made this jar previously with 2 x 44-32 z and I had to take them out as it reached full melt within half hour so I thought that that meant the wicks was too big x Edited June 8, 2012 by Joannec spelling Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robertgibbens Posted June 9, 2012 Share Posted June 9, 2012 Curing of paraffin candles is not necessary. I've not heard anyone argue that until now. Is trust the masses, not the single. I sell hundreds of paraffin candles per week. My info is my experience. By the way. 24 hrs is not curing. No one will sell a candle and burn it before that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EricofAZ Posted June 11, 2012 Share Posted June 11, 2012 (edited) I noticed the pool depth is pretty deep. Looks like half inch or more. So the HT tosses out a lot of FO and then after that, it slows down until the ROC lowers the wax and the wick starts to pick up more new fresh wax with new fresh FO. To me, that's what is happening and why the second burn is not so great. I like the ECO's and the HTP's for that wax but before I start changing brands, I'd lower the depth of the MP which means wicking down. The first burn won't be so strong, but the rest won't be so weak and the candle should be more consistent. One other thing to try to get the wick to burn more consistently is to saturate it in microcrystaline wax, all the way to the core. Raw wicks tend to burn like you are describing. Edited June 11, 2012 by EricofAZ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flicker Posted June 11, 2012 Share Posted June 11, 2012 Curing of paraffin candles is not necessary. I've not heard anyone argue that until now. Is trust the masses, not the single. I sell hundreds of paraffin candles per week. My info is my experience. By the way. 24 hrs is not curing. No one will sell a candle and burn it before that.Ok, well that is your belief. However, I think you may want to consult with someone with a bit more expertise on the subject. My information has come from both Honeywell's Astor Wax division when it was still intact, Dussek Campbell and of course IGI. But what would they know, they only manufactured candle waxes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joannec Posted June 11, 2012 Author Share Posted June 11, 2012 Hi,That jar was wicked with 2 Eco 1's, I have also done a jar with 2 x Eco 0.5. They both start out well but then go to no throw.The wick was raw wick, so would I be better off to buy wick that's already waxed? Would that make the burn any better?Many thanks Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chefmom Posted June 12, 2012 Share Posted June 12, 2012 You might want to try using a waxed wick. I have a post-it note in my "online-reading-scribble-notebook" that raw wick may absorb the fragrance oil faster and burn it off, leaving only wax behind to burn. Naturally I didn't write down where I read that, it's just a notation. I don't have any other info other than that as a list of reasons to always use a waxed wick. If I use waxed wick I just use as it, but if I am using raw wick I prime it in my hardest pillar wax first.Something to try!Also, I have found that the room size and ceiling height will carry scent away. You smell it here now, but in two hours you smell it upstairs and not in the room that the candle is burning in. This happened once or twice to me and my husband (Air-Flow-Man_Extraordinaire) said that the hot/cold air flow on THAT day could have affected the scent carry. I'm not sure of the science, but that same candle did scent better several days later. Go figure. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EricofAZ Posted June 12, 2012 Share Posted June 12, 2012 (edited) I thought I'd jump back in on the priming issue. This has been a topic in the past. Doesn't matter much if you use expensive micro wax or do what Chefmom says and just use a high temp regular wax. Both will get the job done. The key is how the priming is done.There are a lot of pre-primed wicks on the market. Most have a nice smooth coating on the outside and you can dig a needle in the center and see the core unprimed. www.wicksunlimited.com has a write up about that. They prime to the core (but you have to buy 50,000 minimum quantity). I found that priming to the core makes a huge difference. Yeah, maybe it helps the wick stand up better, but so does controlling the pool depth and twisting the wick. The big thing is that it is consistent. The pre-primed wicks from one vendor might burn slightly differently than the pre-primed wicks from another vendor and folks here have had fits when they switched vendors and had to go back to their testing process again.I never thought about raw wicks drawing up the FO. I suppose its a theory that kinda makes sense. If I stir the FO for a couple of minutes instead of dumping it in and pouring (like some folks here), then the FO is pretty well absorbed or bonded or whatever word you want to use. I've used faw wicks with no priming a lot and never really noticed FO precipitating into the wick, but the idea does seem to be worth thinking about and maybe some day I'll experiment. http://www.wicksunlimited.com/candle_waxes.php Edited June 12, 2012 by EricofAZ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joannec Posted June 12, 2012 Author Share Posted June 12, 2012 Hi, sorry for this silly question but.... How do you prime wicks to the core? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HorseScentS Posted June 12, 2012 Share Posted June 12, 2012 Peak's primes their wicks with higher melt-point wax than the other supplier's do. I use Peak's wicks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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