LuminousBoutique Posted February 15, 2011 Share Posted February 15, 2011 @LuminousBoutique - I used to use EVOO brands available at my local stores until I began to experience horrible oxidation (well beyond DOS) from brands like Crapetelli and Bertolli. The texture of the soap was not anything like a good castile should be. I hate paying OO prices for blends adulterated with canola or soy.yeah I dont trust those brands- restaurant suppliers have proven really helpful for me! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LuminousBoutique Posted February 15, 2011 Share Posted February 15, 2011 (edited) Stella, you really need to buy "Scientific Soapmaking" by Dunn. This is his method of using test batches in single oil and then multiple oil soaps. I ususally grab a bar after a week and then try another one from that batch in a month or so to see the difference in quality. I used to have a local supply of pomace and it was great; now I use evoo. Even if the bottle says 100% pure olive it may not be?Steveit should be, if it says 100% OO but you have to read the ingredients to be sure. There are some brands out there that sell "light olive oil" and its not all olive, but you wouldnt know unless you checked ingredients- i think thats where some people have issues sometimes.I know for a fact walmarts OO brand is 100% OO. Edited February 15, 2011 by LuminousBoutique Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TallTayl Posted February 15, 2011 Share Posted February 15, 2011 <snip>Even if the bottle says 100% pure olive it may not be? Nope. You'd be amazed at the amount of 'other' oil being used to adulterate OO. Canola and rape seed are common. Do a quick web search of Adulterated Olive Oil for a little background. Kirkland Brands (at Costco) is one of the brands that fellow soapers have found reliable. Domestic OO's tend to test as 'real' more reliably than imported. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TallTayl Posted February 15, 2011 Share Posted February 15, 2011 Sorry - many apologies to the OP for the hijack - but this seems to fit the direction of the thread.Testing Results of IMPORTED OLIVE OILS as read in a news article a year or so ago. The testing lab used for the article chose 3 bottles of each brand listed below and tested each for OO purity. Not sure who sponsored the test, but it gave pause to me to not trust labels 100%. I started paying attention when my CP was turning out 'differently' using store brands. This made perfect sense.Filippo Berio Extra Virgin Olive Oil: Two out of three samples failed.Bertolli Extra Virgin Olive Oil: Three of three samples failed.Pompeian Extra Virgin Olive Oil: Three of three samples failed.Colavita Extra Virgin Olive Oil: Two of three samples failed.Star Extra Virgin Olive Oil: One of three samples failed.Carapelli Extra Virgin Olive Oil: Three of three samples failed.Newman's Own Organics Extra Virgin Olive Oil: Two of three samples failed.Mezzetta Extra Virgin Olive Oil: Three of three samples failed.Mazola Extra Virgin Olive Oil: Three of three samples failed.Rachael Ray Extra Tasty Extra Virgin Olive Oil: Two of three samples failed.Kirkland Organic Extra Virgin Olive Oil: All samples passed.Great Value 100 percent Extra Virgin Olive Oil: One of three samples failed.Safeway Select Extra Virgin Olive Oil: Two of three samples failed.365 Everyday Value 100 percent Italian Extra Virgin Olive Oil: Two of three samples failed.DOMESTIC OLIVE OILS:Corto Olive Extra Virgin Olive Oil: All samples passed.California Olive Ranch Extra Virgin Olive Oil: All samples passed.McEvoy Ranch Organic Extra Virgin Olive Oil: All samples passed.Bariani Olive Oil Extra Virgin Olive Oil: One of two samples failed.Lucero (Ascolano) Extra Virgin Olive Oil: All samples passed. The link no longer works - perhaps the archives may turn up something. here is the original link.Read more: http://www.sanluisobispo.com/2010/07/15/12...d#ixzz0u4fdyRx7Now take this with a grain of salt if your brand always performs well. OO is big business. I feel for the people who use OO for dietary benefits and are being duped with canola or something NOT olive. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LuminousBoutique Posted February 15, 2011 Share Posted February 15, 2011 but what "purity" are they testing for? for virgin cold pressed purity? It doesnt specify, what you've posted. There are different grades, were they testing for a certain grade? I read this awhile ago too, maybe posted here? But I wasnt able to confirm any of it.Great value olive oil was tested in my chemistry class and passed with flying colors... this was 6 months ago. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TallTayl Posted February 15, 2011 Share Posted February 15, 2011 Purity of containing only OO - not being adulterated with other oils.Random sampling even in this test performed by the lab for this article was not as scientific as most would like. 3 bottles from a shelf is not a large enough sample size. Nor is one bottle. Like I said, take it with a grain of salt if your brand/bottle works for you. I had to learn the hard way not to trust labels. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soy327 Posted February 16, 2011 Share Posted February 16, 2011 About the 20% coconut: In the recipe he has 12% but he also has PKO at 15%. Coconut & PKO are quite similar in soaping qualities. Some people itch when their coconut goes above 10%. I'm one of them. I use 10% Coconut and 15% PKO is all my recipes. I also use tallow which helps with lather as well.Oh I didn't know that. I will have to read up on PKO. I'm not sure what the difference is between PKO and PO. I have alot of PO. I'm also using castor oil at 5% avacado oil at 10% shea butter 5% and OO at 35%. I've only made 4 batches so far CP.Hey Stella welcome to soaping isn't it a ball Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IwantItgreen Posted February 16, 2011 Share Posted February 16, 2011 Oh I didn't know that. I will have to read up on PKO. I'm not sure what the difference is between PKO and PO. I have alot of PO. I'm also using castor oil at 5% avacado oil at 10% shea butter 5% and OO at 35%. I've only made 4 batches so far CP.Hey Stella welcome to soaping isn't it a ball The only similarity between PO and PKO is that they both come from Palm :smiley2:The difference is that PKO is from the kernel and can be substituted for CO. PO is the vegetarian substitute for tallow or lard. PO and PKO cannot be used interchangeably. They have very different fatty acid profiles, thus soaping qualities. Hope this helps a bit! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soy327 Posted February 16, 2011 Share Posted February 16, 2011 So you are saying that PKO can be used like CO or added so thus less CO and is more gentler to the skin. Can I still use the PO too instead of lard or tallow? Common sense tells me I can use PO and PKO together right? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IwantItgreen Posted February 16, 2011 Share Posted February 16, 2011 Yes soy, you can use PKO with CO. I use 10% CO & 15% PKO in all my soap as the cleansing oils. The base of my soap is tallow/lard which you can substitute with PO. So yes, you may use PO and PKO together. I gotta encourage you to try lard/tallow tho. Makes GOOD soap!! Anyone who eats meat, should not have a "beef" about using tallow/lard in their soap! Pardon the pun Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soy327 Posted February 16, 2011 Share Posted February 16, 2011 Yes soy, you can use PKO with CO. I use 10% CO & 15% PKO in all my soap as the cleansing oils. The base of my soap is tallow/lard which you can substitute with PO. So yes, you may use PO and PKO together. I gotta encourage you to try lard/tallow tho. Makes GOOD soap!! Anyone who eats meat, should not have a "beef" about using tallow/lard in their soap! Pardon the pun You are crackin me up :laugh2:Do you mean the lard you buy in the grocery store in the box? I'm not opposed to that. But I was reading that thread about rendering tallow I don't think so. Were would I put the lard in my recipe? and how much? Cut the OO? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IwantItgreen Posted February 16, 2011 Share Posted February 16, 2011 You are crackin me up :laugh2:Do you mean the lard you buy in the grocery store in the box? I'm not opposed to that. But I was reading that thread about rendering tallow I don't think so. Were would I put the lard in my recipe? and how much? Cut the OO?Yes to the lard you buy in the grocery store and make pie crust with Tallow you really can't get at a grocery store so either you get it from the locker and render it yourself or you can order it from Columbus foods. Anyway, you would use lard in your soap in place of the PO. Leave the OO in! I use mostly tallow, sometimes tallow & lard, using from 20 - 40%. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soy327 Posted February 16, 2011 Share Posted February 16, 2011 O.K. thanks, I'll be trying it maybe this weekend. I'll run my stuff through soapcalc and do a recipe with the lard. Thanks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IwantItgreen Posted February 16, 2011 Share Posted February 16, 2011 O.K. thanks, I'll be trying it maybe this weekend. I'll run my stuff through soapcalc and do a recipe with the lard. Thanks.Here's a link to a thread about Lard vs. Palm Oil. http://www.craftserver.com/forums/showthread.php?t=88463HTH! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scented Posted February 16, 2011 Share Posted February 16, 2011 I'm curious about the Castile discussion. Would pomace be a best oil or are you describing an organic type of extra virgin oo? I've never made any type of 100% oil soap. Oh and Scented, you know if Top were to jump in what he would say about shortening? I like it in small doses for the soy oil. These are the oils that are on hand so that's what I stuck with but it would be nicer with a little palm or tallow. Thanks,SteveI don't care what he'd say, because I don't use it, but that's what this person has to use. I love the piggy and am staying with it till I can try some tallow, but am not in a rush for the tallow. My thought was the OP wants a bar that will last longer and harder oils are going to give more hardness to the mix, so I used what I used. I use lard at 10% in my normal recipe, but we're not discussing my recipe lol. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scented Posted February 16, 2011 Share Posted February 16, 2011 Were would I put the lard in my recipe? and how much? Cut the OO?Slap 10% into your recipe and put it in place of the shortening. At least that's where I'd put it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chuck_35550 Posted February 16, 2011 Share Posted February 16, 2011 Yup, that's what I'd do. My only beef (scuse the pun) is that lard is hydrogenated and it makes me wonder how much better the qualilty would be if you used a natural rendered lard??Steve Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stella1952 Posted February 17, 2011 Share Posted February 17, 2011 As a compleat noob to soapmaking, I am trusting the numbers from SoapCalc. I have printed out each of the three recipes I used so that later on down the line, I can make observations as the soap cures, etc.Soap Making is not unlike candle making. Too many variables all at once make it very difficult to figure out what's working/not working for you. You are so right. It's difficult to see all the possibilities and not wanna jump right on in the deep end! I HAVE resisted the impulse to procure any of the more exotic, expensive, totally cooler oils and butters right now and am sticking to grocery store oils until I get some idea of what the heck I am doing. So far I am very pleased, but I can see I am gonna have to sell a buncha sculptures, pots, glass and candles to support my newest addiction... Stella, you really need to buy "Scientific Soapmaking" by Dunn. Thanks for the recommendation, Steve. I'll put it on my list. As it is right now, I fall asleep at night with printouts from various soapmaking sites in hand, studying, studying, studying. I mixed it all up into a dream the other night where I had to make something harder by adding some salt to the formula... :rolleyes2:laugh2::laugh2:I was reading that thread about rendering tallow I don't think so.I read that and I figure it can't smell any worse than when I was making homemade dog cookies... Maybe I'll borrow a friend's crawfish cooker and try to render outside this spring... at least it won't heat up/stink up my house... Hey Stella welcome to soaping isn't it a ballThanks, soy327. Yep - I'm having great fun with it! Just wish I had more time to float and test my samples... I have at least a dozen different "properties of oils" printouts from various sites. It helps me a lot in trying to formulate a recipe that's balanced. I'm still trying to get control of the medium down - my first batch was totally strange since I'd never done it before, so I studied more and watched a thousand or so YouTube vids (including a couple about exploding soap in the microwave). The next two batches went really well until I added the FOs, and things really accelerated from there... They came out better even though I didn't have the consistency needed to make those cool swirlies and stuff. That's okay - I'm practicing and expect the next batches to be even better than the first three. I am planning to interrupt my wild soap dreams for a couple of weeks to follow TallTayl's suggestion about making some single oil batches... Damn I hate crawling before I run!!! If only I didn't have to stop to go to work... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IwantItgreen Posted February 17, 2011 Share Posted February 17, 2011 Stella, I know you and Top disagree on alot of things, but I found his posts on the fatty acid profiles of the oils to be helpful in formulating a soap recipe. Look more at the fatty acid profile than just the soap properties. :tiptoe: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stella1952 Posted February 17, 2011 Share Posted February 17, 2011 Thanks, Iwantitgreen. I look for good information anywhere I can find it. I figured that the fatty acid makeup of an oil is part of its properties, so I've been studying the individual fatty acids to understand the properties mo' better. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mitch23 Posted February 19, 2011 Author Share Posted February 19, 2011 Wow, I get busy with school for a week, and come back to this! Thanks everyone. I just got finished ordering bigger containers of Coconut, Olive, PKO, and actually got to get some Beef Tallow from Columbus Foods. Now I won't be so scared to try different recipes. I plan on trying several 1 pound batches, maybe not the one oil soaps, since most of what I have bought is hard oils. Side question... would a WalMart digi scale be close enough to do a 1# batch, or should I get one that is a better quality? From where? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soy327 Posted February 19, 2011 Share Posted February 19, 2011 Hi Mitch, My scale was kinda exspensive but I was told to get one that read LBS GRAMS and OZ to the .000. Did I explain that OK. It's an Escali. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mitch23 Posted February 19, 2011 Author Share Posted February 19, 2011 I understand you explanation. That's what I was wanting, one that did more accurate than .1 oz, but didn't know if it was really needed. Can I ask where you got it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soy327 Posted February 19, 2011 Share Posted February 19, 2011 (edited) I got it at our Ace Hardware store. Believe or not it was cheaper than staples. I think it was about $80.00 Edited February 19, 2011 by soy327 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IwantItgreen Posted February 19, 2011 Share Posted February 19, 2011 I understand you explanation. That's what I was wanting, one that did more accurate than .1 oz, but didn't know if it was really needed. Can I ask where you got it?I personally wouldn't buy a scale that only went to .1oz. Iwould at least get something to the .10 oz. Also make sure it has grams. I would have never guessed how much I have used the grams on my scale. Amazon has the Escali for $25 & free shipping, if you don't mind buying from them. You can also get them at most of the bigger candle suppliers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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