What do I need to know to sell stuff?

[Reg]

Our church is doing this fund raising type of thing, where you can sell your crafts and donate 10% of sales to the church needs. I have never sold any of my soap or B&B products. But was thinking to sell some at the fundraser. Are there any special rules for selling such things? Anything else I need to know?

[Faerywren]

Know your labeling rules per the FDA. I'm also a believer in liability insurance for anyone who's planning on selling.

[rebeccajo99]

Here is the labeling requirements for the FDA. http://www.fda.gov/Cosmetics/CosmeticLabelingLabelClaims/CosmeticLabelingManual/ucm126444.htm#clga

I also recommend setting up a LLC and keep everything seporate from your personal stuff. (own bank account and supplies for a couple of examples). That will also help protect your personal assets if somebody would sue.

Also, remember that you cannot make claims about your products. It makes it hard sometimes when people ask about your products and ingrediants used. (like goat milk is moisturizing or shea butter helps with dry skin). Having samples for people to try helps with that as they can try the product and see for themselves. (if somebody has suggestions on how we can get people to try samples of soaps in our booth, I'm all ears as well)

aside from the legal stuff, just test test and test your stuff to get a good product. Good products results in repeat customers. It takes time to test and to get repeat customers, but it is so worth it when you start seeing the same faces coming in to buy more.

[Reg]

Here is the labeling requirements for the FDA. http://www.fda.gov/Cosmetics/CosmeticLabelingLabelClaims/CosmeticLabelingManual/ucm126444.htm#clga

I also recommend setting up a LLC and keep everything seporate from your personal stuff. (own bank account and supplies for a couple of examples). That will also help protect your personal assets if somebody would sue.

Also, remember that you cannot make claims about your products. It makes it hard sometimes when people ask about your products and ingrediants used. (like goat milk is moisturizing or shea butter helps with dry skin). Having samples for people to try helps with that as they can try the product and see for themselves. (if somebody has suggestions on how we can get people to try samples of soaps in our booth, I'm all ears as well)

aside from the legal stuff, just test test and test your stuff to get a good product. Good products results in repeat customers. It takes time to test and to get repeat customers, but it is so worth it when you start seeing the same faces coming in to buy more.

Thanks for the link! It's very helpful. Do I really need to set up LLC for one time fund raser selling? I don't even have a "company" or "brand" name. The sale is in the beginning of September, and I don't know how long setting up a company takes. Should I just skip this sale?

[rebeccajo99]

Thanks for the link! It's very helpful. Do I really need to set up LLC for one time fund raser selling? I don't even have a "company" or "brand" name. The sale is in the beginning of September, and I don't know how long setting up a company takes. Should I just skip this sale?

No, you really don't need to set up an LLC for the one time fund raiser selling. However, I would still strongly suggest it. You never know in this one fundraiser if somebody will sue you for something. I really think people are out there just looking for ways to sue people... and I always say, better safe than sorry.

Setting up an LLC will be your cheapest way to get the first level of protection. However, even with an LLC, if you don't keep your personal and business stuff seporate, if somebody would sue, the judge can still rule your personal stuff taken. This is because it cannot be determined what is personal and what is business.

I don't remember how long it took for mine to get set up once I filed the paperwork. However, since you said you don't have a name picked out yet... you may be better off waiting until the next one so you pick a name you like, is catchy and won't be confused with another company. Look into your state and see how long it takes.

Just my opinion:)

[Candybee]

If you are only planning on doing this one time fundraiser for your church then I wouldn't worry about licensing and insurance. It makes no sense to do all that for a one time church sale.

But if you are considering selling your products as a business then it is definitely a different situation and you should get all your licensing and insurance squared away before you start. HTH

Edited August 18, 2010 by Candybee

[deb426]

If you are only planning on doing this one time fundraiser for your church then I wouldn't worry about licensing and insurance. It makes no sense to do all that for a one time church sale.

But if you are considering selling your products as a business then it is definitely a different situation and you should get all your licensing and insurance squared away before you start. HTH

I agree with Candybee. I am a paralegal. All of this talk of everyone suing their best friend because their candle didn't burn right is over-hyped. Been in the legal field for 20 years. The only candle related thing I have ever heard about in all of those years is because a renter burned a candle next to the curtains and the curtains caught on fire. The renter was in trouble, nobody cared about the candle maker. People need to get a grip. Go ahead and do your church sale and have fun.

[rebeccajo99]

I agree with Candybee. I am a paralegal. All of this talk of everyone suing their best friend because their candle didn't burn right is over-hyped. Been in the legal field for 20 years. The only candle related thing I have ever heard about in all of those years is because a renter burned a candle next to the curtains and the curtains caught on fire. The renter was in trouble, nobody cared about the candle maker. People need to get a grip. Go ahead and do your church sale and have fun.

I guess I'm just not as trust worthy of people I don't know . When I gave testers to friends and family, I didn't have anything set up because I trusted that they wouldn't come after me if something did happen. I made sure I had my LLC set up before giving/selling my first product to somebody I did not know (its only $50 to set up and its good for a year).

Yes, I would like to believe that selling at a church fundraiser you wouldn't have any problems, but you just never know. Guess that comes from having a family member get sued because he was at fault in a car accident and killed somebody. One week the family was telling him to not worry about it, it was the weathers fault and the next week they are serving him with papers. (and these people were members at the same church as my cousin)

I gave my opinion on how I feel and what I would do in your situation. You just need do what you feel comfortable after hearing everybodies opinion. Whatever you decide, do what deb says and have fun.

[safetysue]

REG, I don't know where you're from but I can tell setting up an LLC in Illinois is not $50 bucks - minimum $600 in fees and you do all the work yourself. It varies from state to state. If it were only $50.00 I would have set up an LLC.

[rebeccajo99]

REG, I don't know where you're from but I can tell setting up an LLC in Illinois is not $50 bucks - minimum $600 in fees and you do all the work yourself. It varies from state to state. If it were only $50.00 I would have set up an LLC.

ouch. I'm sorry that yours cost so much. Does it have to be renewed each year for the same price?

I knew it varied from state to state, didn't realize it varied that much from state.

REG, where do you live?

[Reg]

ouch. I'm sorry that yours cost so much. Does it have to be renewed each year for the same price?

I knew it varied from state to state, didn't realize it varied that much from state.

REG, where do you live?

I am in MN

[rebeccajo99]

http://www.sos.state.mn.us/index.aspx?page=1088

Looks like its $160 for your state

Sorry, it was an easy decision for me with it only being $50. With it being so much higher, makes it a little harder.

[scentlady]

An LLC is expensive in NY too so I can't really afford it, but I do carry insurance. But I don't know if I would get ins for a one time event.

[deb426]

Interestingly, what Rebeccajo said is true also. You are FAR, FAR, FAR more likely to get sued for causing a car accident on the way to a craft show than for anything you sell at the craft show. Completely different laws apply to auto accidents. You are behind the wheel and the accident was your fault and you hurt someone. Pretty simple. Product liability law is much more complicated and expensive to pursue than auto accident law.

[scifichik]

REG, I don't know where you're from but I can tell setting up an LLC in Illinois is not $50 bucks - minimum $600 in fees and you do all the work yourself. It varies from state to state. If it were only $50.00 I would have set up an LLC.

Slide across the stateline, my friend. In Missouri, it is $50. You can do it all online yourself. I did it.

[Wessex]

Even if you get an LLC in another state (which you would still need an address in that state), you would have to register as a foreign entity to do business in your state. And that would most likely cost you the same as setting up in that state (at least that is the regs. in VA, I assume it would be the same in most states to keep people from getting cheaper deals in other states.) Sorry.

Cheers,

Steve

[Reg]

Obviously I won't be setting up LLC for this fund raiser. So I was thinking to sell some soap, lotion bars, and bath salts. Since they don't have water, I figured these would be the safest procucts to sell?

[rebeccajo99]

yeah, I probably would do the same if I was in your boat. Let us know how it goes:)

Oh, just thought of something. You most likely still have to get a sales tax licanse. Since I was wrong about the pricing on LLC, I'm hesitant to say this as well, but it didn't cost anything for me to get my sales tax licanse. I'm not sure how that works with this being a fund raiser. You will probably be fine if you don't have it yet before the show, as long as you get it and file whenever sales taxes are due. I'm sure MN is just like MI and they want their money

I find that it is easiest to have those carbonless 2 part forms (can get them at most office supply stores). I write down what they baught and totals (sales tax, sub and grand totals), give the customer their copy and i have a copy for myself. Easy way to track what sold to deduct from my inventory, sales and collected sales tax spreadsheets when I get home. Getting those self inking stamps are nice with your business name and phone number to put on top of the customers recipt, but before my stamp came, I just printed off labels and stuck them on top. I think my pack of 500 was only $8.

Some nice tips (there is also a sticky on top of the I believe the business section that has a lot more good ones)

1. have pleny of change (especially 1's and 5's)

2. elevate your product so it isn't all flat on the table. I use the boxes I carry my product in as shelves and cover with cordinating fabric.

3. Having a cloth go to the floor is nice to hide extra boxes and inventory (window curtans or table cloths taped to the table with another table cloth over top is an easy way to start out if you don't have your own tables each time. That way your not having all these different sized "custom made" large clothes) Since your only doing this 1 aright now, might be easy to buy just one large cloth that goes to the floor.

4. don't short change yourself and price your produts too low that you don't make much on them. research your market and calculate your costs X3 or 4. I average about 3.5 times for my stuff (some a little higher, some a little lower).

5. Offer a discount for buying multiples. Like 1 for $5 or 2 for $8. People like getting discounts

Those are my top 5 tips I like to give Have fun.

[Meridith]

Paralegal here too for many, many years but I would never tell someone to not worry about insurance when selling. However, having said that, and never having personally seen a lawsuit, does not mean a lawsuit would not happen or could not happen. Even if selling your stuff at one show, even if its at a church show IMO you should have insurance. Selling is selling. But don't think just becuase it is one show or one at a church, or lawsuits are rare that you are safe. Better safe than sorry. It's worth the peace of mind. Its the responsible thing to do.

I bet McDonalds never thought it would get sued because its coffee is hot and can burn you, but they did and the complainant was successful! JMO

[rebeccajo99]

Paralegal here too for many, many years but I would never tell someone to not worry about insurance when selling. However, having said that, and never having personally seen a lawsuit, does not mean a lawsuit would not happen or could not happen. Even if selling your stuff at one show, even if its at a church show IMO you should have insurance. Selling is selling. But don't think just becuase it is one show or one at a church, or lawsuits are rare that you are safe. Better safe than sorry. It's worth the peace of mind. Its the responsible thing to do.

I bet McDonalds never thought it would get sued because its coffee is hot and can burn you, but they did and the complainant was successful! JMO

That is true as well Meridith. Just wondering a paralegal's opinion on if you had to choose only 1 type of insurance to start (general or product) what would you choose?

[Candybee]

McDonalds is a huge corporation with lots of money. The women who sued Mickey D's knew that.

[deb426]

That McDonalds suit is way overhyped as well. I feel pretty comfortable with answering the question the way I did. Product liability suits are all about the deep pockets. They are way to expensive to litigate without those pockets and no one is interested in the little guy making candles and lotion bars in her basement.

Plus, one of the reasons McDonalds did get sued for the hot coffee was because the coffee was not at a controlled temperature. It was hot beyond hot and the woman was severely burned. The true details of that lawsuit are very interesting.

Edited August 19, 2010 by deb426

[ChrisR]

That McDonalds suit is way overhyped as well. I feel pretty comfortable with answering the question the way I did. Product liability suits are all about the deep pockets. They are way to expensive to litigate without those pockets and no one is interested in the little guy making candles and lotion bars in her basement.

You are kidding aren't you. The 'little guy' cooking whatever in their basement most definately could and would be sued if that little lotion bar, or lotion, or whatever caused a severe allergic reaction, or caused someone to get a terrible infection because they took Joe Blow's advice that using a perservative wasn't necessary when they added Vitamin and their product turned out being full of bacteria or fungus. Or that jar candle exploded because it was over wicked, or even if there was a flaw in the glass.

Product Liability insurance is not that expensive to cover your ass 'just in case'!! I had my insurance in place before I handed my first test candle out to anyone. Anyone playing russian roulette with the chance that it could never happen to them is extremely foolish. Plus a Paralegal is not a lawyer and shouldn't be giving any type of legal advice, especially when it is also very foolish!!

[deb426]

Oh, calm down. I showed each of my responses to the attorneys in my office before posting. Our firm only does product liability, personal injury and insurance law. I agree that one should protect oneself. However, I also think that people should know the real risks involved so that decisions can be made accordingly. If someone called our office and said they bought a lotion bar that caused an allergic reaction, they wouldn't even get past the receptionist. I didn't say that the little guy couldn't or wouldn't get sued. I just pointed out that suits like that aren't as rampant as some would have you believe.

Edited August 20, 2010 by deb426

[Reg]

yeah, I probably would do the same if I was in your boat. Let us know how it goes:)

Oh, just thought of something. You most likely still have to get a sales tax licanse. Since I was wrong about the pricing on LLC, I'm hesitant to say this as well, but it didn't cost anything for me to get my sales tax licanse. I'm not sure how that works with this being a fund raiser. You will probably be fine if you don't have it yet before the show, as long as you get it and file whenever sales taxes are due. I'm sure MN is just like MI and they want their money

I find that it is easiest to have those carbonless 2 part forms (can get them at most office supply stores). I write down what they baught and totals (sales tax, sub and grand totals), give the customer their copy and i have a copy for myself. Easy way to track what sold to deduct from my inventory, sales and collected sales tax spreadsheets when I get home. Getting those self inking stamps are nice with your business name and phone number to put on top of the customers recipt, but before my stamp came, I just printed off labels and stuck them on top. I think my pack of 500 was only $8.

Some nice tips (there is also a sticky on top of the I believe the business section that has a lot more good ones)

1. have pleny of change (especially 1's and 5's)

2. elevate your product so it isn't all flat on the table. I use the boxes I carry my product in as shelves and cover with cordinating fabric.

3. Having a cloth go to the floor is nice to hide extra boxes and inventory (window curtans or table cloths taped to the table with another table cloth over top is an easy way to start out if you don't have your own tables each time. That way your not having all these different sized "custom made" large clothes) Since your only doing this 1 aright now, might be easy to buy just one large cloth that goes to the floor.

4. don't short change yourself and price your produts too low that you don't make much on them. research your market and calculate your costs X3 or 4. I average about 3.5 times for my stuff (some a little higher, some a little lower).

5. Offer a discount for buying multiples. Like 1 for $5 or 2 for $8. People like getting discounts

Those are my top 5 tips I like to give Have fun.

Thanks for the tips!