Clear Black

On 4/14/2018 at 11:57 AM, JoeyG said:

 

My experience has been that it depends on who the wholesale customer is. Walmart may be happy only bumping the price by 5%, while C-Stores tend to want in the 30%-40% range return on their investment. Have you tested price points for your candles yet? You're thinking they'll sell for roughly $20, but what if they only sell for $8? Have you tried selling them for more? Most of these wholesale accounts are going to want to know, not think, how much they'll retail for. But there are exceptions and it also depends on what your goal is.

 

Are you wanting a bunch of wholesale accounts, or trying to get one or two major accounts and manufacture solely for them? If it's the latter, there are things you can do to improve your chances. Negotiate deals with regional and national distributors to try and piggy-back off their distribution routes to try and get your product introduced into their stores. You can also do private label spec candles. Many companies call on their clients and like to leave little gifts behind for them. Candles make great gifts. We did this with one of the companies who actually supplied product to us. Their product had 10 different flavors, so we made candles with scents that mirrored their flavors. If you give it some thought you may realize that you already know companies that you can tailor make your candles for.

 

My perspective for selling products is always this. What makes mine better... or what problem does it solve for the buyer? If I can't answer either of those questions satisfactorily, then I don't sell that product.

Thanks for your reply JG. To answer your question, they have been selling great at trade shows at or around $20+ retail. And ive never had a complaint about the price point. Mostly just some modest compliments on the packaging.  I feel they could retail for a few dollars more, but in a retail store maybe. The demographic at the local trade shows arent willing to go much higher than $20 retail so I keep it around or near there depending on the current location I am selling at.  For wholesale, I have actually gotten my price per container down from $7 per to $6 per by switching label companies. I can drive that further towards $5 per container once I start getting more items by the pallet like my FO for example.  Im mostly just a one person show in my shop, so my main goal isnt national accounts, but a few local retail stores that cater to candles and handmade gifts. There is big business around these parts during tourism season, so Id like to get just a few wholesale accounts for the summer. I still work a 9-5 so anything more than that is not feasable due to time constraints.  I think if I approach those wholesale accounts looking for $10-$11 per, they can retail them for $20-$22 per. They already carry 5 other brands of candles that retail between $20-$25 per so I feel mine fit in with what the other brands are doing. Who knows, they may tell me they arent interested, they may like what they see. I will know in about a month when Im ready to approach them

13 hours ago, rhoops said:

Are you using these folks Clear?

I am not yet rhoops, but plan to initiate the process by the end of April. Let me know if you decide to go with them ya?

54 minutes ago, Sebleo said:

I wanted to post this link for llc fees by state. It is current for 2018 and some states have reduced their fees including some that have been mentioned here.

 

https://www.llcuniversity.com/llc-annual-fees-by-state/

RIP any of you in Mass  

This whole web forum is essentially one big mentor. I know its not physical in the room teaching you things, but the wealth of knowledge learned over the years by our forum host and guests is vast to say the least. I suggest you start reading through EVERYTHING here, choose a wax, a container and then start practicing. As you go ask questions here about how to do this or that and eventually you will get into the swing of things. Chandlery isnt easy, you will not learn it overnight but there are many here who will help you along the way.

Cheers mate and good luck.

On 3/21/2018 at 3:44 PM, Candybee said:

Trade shows are not the same as a juried craft show. Trade shows are for businesses that do wholesale and have a track record of 5 yrs or more of wholesale experience. Another wholesale type show is the cash and carry shows. For these shows you need a truckload of product and be ready to sell up to hundreds or thousands of the same product. People I know who do these shows tend to specialize in one product. Like say they do wax melts but make them in only 4 scents. Then they take thousands of these to the cash and carry shows and sell them by the hundreds or thousands at a time. Many who do these shows have several wholesale customers who buy from them every year.

 

I thought about doing the shows at one time but honestly I don't want to reproduce at such a high volume like a factory. That's just not for me.

This show is more like the first one you described. Its basically buyers looking to purchase your product by the case. This particular show doesnt require as many as 5 years wholesale experience though. I think the price for a 10x10 booth was around $1200 for the weekend. Im not quite ready to step into wholesale yet, I was more interested in just poking around and seeing whats there  

On 3/18/2018 at 10:34 AM, TallTayl said:

Your state tax ID is all you need. 

Good to know! Next year I am definitely sneaking inside  

3 hours ago, kfintoni said:

I am in the process of buying a house in Orono right now. Just drove up there twice this week right through Portland. @LittleMissSunshine  Where are you located? It is a nice drive up North once I get past Portland there is barely any traffic.

 

Karen in MA

Maine is starting to be a trend around here  

10 hours ago, Trappeur said:

Clear Black if you buy any of your supplies wholesale, you have a resale tax number, don't you?   That's all you need to get into the show.  They also would need probably your business card and some sales invoices of someone you buy from to show proof.

 

Trappeur

I dont think I have ever bought anything that would qualify me as a wholesale buyer. I just buy raw ingredients at wholesale and pallet rate pricing so if that qualifies me it would be news to me lol!

I think for next years show I may try and get a resale tax number somehow just so I can get in there and poke around. 

8 hours ago, Trappeur said:

Hmmmm...I'm going to refigure pricing again Clear Black...Maybe I made a mistake....Wouldn't be the first time.  Thanks!

 

Trappeur

Anytime!  

4 hours ago, birdcharm said:

You mean the cars are driving past your house?  Hurry!!  ... get out there ... set up some tables, put up a sign "Get Your Candles Here!" 

 No, just a bit further away than my actual street that would be great wouldnt it? 

@Sarah S I wish I could get inside! But its a wholesale trade show, so unless you are a seller or a wholesale buyer you cannot get in. It is closed to the general public sadly

Trap, at wholesale or pallet rate pricing at Candle Science 464 is $1.06/lb and 6006 is $1.50/lb so for $.44/lb more I think you could re-work your pricing to make it work?

2 hours ago, Trappeur said:

What wick style are you using in 6006 Clear Black?

 

Wow it's about double 464 in price...For me selling wholesale, I could never up my prices to the shops....

 

You know I hate to put this out there after so much discussion is going on about all these waxes and the problems that everyone is having and so many switching to other waxes but I have upped my percentage of oils to 1.2 or 1.3 oz per pound of wax and I am having just wonderful luck (knock on wood) with awesome throws.....I'm absorbing this extra cost of goods for right now as I can't possibly change my wholesale pricing...well, not right now.

 

Trappeur

With the 6006 im testing woodwicks Trap. If I need to go to a traditional wick I will, but so far the wood ones are working. My problems with woodwicks tend to be in the bottom portion of the candle where the heat gets higher and the woodwicks throw this black gunk into the wax from the wick. No idea what it is but since the first day I tried wooden wicks its done this. Im trying a thicker gauge wood this time around, maybe it will behave better who knows.

This is why you see so many soy candles that are natural in color or white. Many dont dye soy wax because it makes the frosting more noticeable. I prefer the natural color of wax whether it be paraffin or soy so I dont care. Ive sold many soy candles at markets and not once did anyone make a stink about them not being dyed candles. I do think however, that dyed candles sell better or easier. People tend to gravitate towards color, but when it comes down to it wont fuss about an un-colored candle.

Just putting this up there for anyone interested in looking.  The New England Made show is happening today and tomorrow here in Portland, Maine. Its literally less than 1/2 mile from my house. The sattelite parking lot for exhibitors is further away than where I live  It is New Englands largest trade show and its sister show in the fall is down in Mass. There are a lot of B&B exhibitors as well as candles. Tons of jewlery and most of all nautical themed made products.  Its a really nice show and one day I hope to get a spot in it. Maybe after I start wholesale if I ever do.

Link to site: https://www.nemadeshows.com/

You can also pay a small fee in addition to booth spaces and get into the buyers book. Here is the digital preview of it: 

https://www.flipsnack.com/9E56F998B7A/new-england-made-buyer-preview-spring-2018.html

Fall 2017's digital Look Book preview:

https://www.flipsnack.com/9E56F998B7A/new-england-made-buyer-preview-fall-2017.html

16 hours ago, LittleMissSunshine said:

I have been having this thought a lot lately, and this thread only makes me feel it even stronger.....if soy is so bad/frustrating/poor quality/etc. then is 6006/parasoy even worth it? Even with a little bit of soy? Wouldn't pure paraffin just be better? What reasons would you have for doing parasoy at all over just pure paraffin? 

And just to add to that, there may well be a 100% paraffin wax that is better, it just seems that all the paraffin waxes I test seem to soot too much for my tastes, even with proper wicking. I havnt tried them all mind you, but the ones I have tried I ended up making blends of soy anyways. So I figured it would be easier to just use a pre-blended parasoy this way I can use one melter and not have to keep two melters going at once.

16 hours ago, LittleMissSunshine said:

I have been having this thought a lot lately, and this thread only makes me feel it even stronger.....if soy is so bad/frustrating/poor quality/etc. then is 6006/parasoy even worth it? Even with a little bit of soy? Wouldn't pure paraffin just be better? What reasons would you have for doing parasoy at all over just pure paraffin? 

I have only been testing 6006 for about a week now so take whatever I say next as just that. But immediatly I notice my whole house filling up again with scent. Not just the room im burning in, but upstairs too. And I am only curing for a day. A DAY! 24 hours and im burning. It honestly doesnt matter what I do, it seems I cant mess up the pour with this wax. I do have slight, and I mean SLIGHT dips near the wick. But they arent top to bottom like they were with soy.  Im almost tempted to start doing a two pour style to get a nice even top. But the scent throw...my god. I use 7% FO usually, and it seems like a real nice sweet spot so far.

Biggest issue is wicking. What I was using in the same jar for my 444 wax, is no where the same for this 6006. So im having to swap wicks out and gradually wick up each test.  The way this stuff burns is more downwards than traditional side to side melt pool. Meaning, my mp is deeper than normal and im not getting that touching the sides melt pool I want yet. Of course, im still in the top 1/3 of the jar so time will tell I guess

Take this how you will, but so far after a week im dumbfounded as to why I let myself struggle with soy for so long. Kudos to others who make it work for them really, hats of to you folks. I just think Im done.

1 hour ago, LittleMissSunshine said:

Are you from Maine too?  Shipping is the real killer for us Mainers....without shipping it would be more like $1.50 a jar. I've been really struggling with trying to figure out my target audience, but I really decided to go with what I enjoy! So my candles and other products (soap, B&B) are going to be fantasy/nerd themed, so more of a fun market. Not necessarily high-end. Do you have any recommendations for jar distributors with decent shipping rates to Maine? I could be persuaded to change my jar if I still thought it looked nice.  I want my candles to be affordable while still making a profit haha. 

Yes, just outside of Portland!

And I would suggest looking at Fillmore firstly. Start there and see if there is anything you like then move on to anywhere really. Being this far removed from the rest of the USA we really tend to pay the higher end of shipping rates.  I actually mostly do tins, so I avoid paying for glass shipping as much as possible. I as well couldnt justify the added cost to get it out here

Trouble is, up here in Maine we are not near any suppliers of containers. So we have to pay shipping usually to this end of the country sadly. And yes, the more you spend the less your cost per container will be. But until you start buying at pallet rates you will just need to realize that your costs will be higher. Same will go for the other ingredients in the candle as well. More wax you buy, the cheaper per pound it is. Etc etc

Im my opinion, $2.10 is a bit high for a jar. But, it also depends on what kind of candle you will be making and your target customer. You could target the more "luxury" themed candles thus rendering your $2 per jar moot.  But if you are selling to a craft fair type demographic and trying to keep your retail prices under $20 then ya, $2 per jar is a bit high. So I would first figure out what type of candle you plan on selling and go from there. Who will your target audience be? And then start building your candle around this. I know TT has some input on this as I recall her having a customer base that her candles cater too. Me? I do not have this and will take any customer I can at this point lol

I use green or blue painters tape

I have to say I agree with TT on this. Ive been using 444 for 3 years now and as of last week will no longer buy this wax. I have sinced started testing 6006. Ive had it with Soy, something is just wrong with it.

With initial testing of the 6006, it does soot if your wicks arent trimmed when they need to be. If You keep up on your trimming, I have zero issues with soot, perfect creamy wax, and excellent throw. Why do I want the headache of soy again?

On 3/12/2018 at 3:02 PM, Crafty1_AJ said:

I like a week's cure time to be safe.  But I must confess:  I have started test burns in as little as 3-4 days.  Not always a patient person. 

This! I am soooo impatient and sometimes make a second tester just so I have something to burn. 

19 hours ago, Trappeur said:

Oh cool!  Well, I'm going up for a trip I think its either going to be May or June, when ever my sister goes up from Texax as she bought a 2'nd home for vacations in Parsonsfield.  I'll let you know and we can still meet b/4 I get moved up there.  I'm right now looking for property with some acreage and will be on that mission in May/June.  How exciting!

 

Trappeur

Very exciting! I cannot imagine living anywhere else but Maine. No offense to you non-Mainers out there of course  

21 hours ago, Candybee said:

Another issue is they could turn this around on you and claim you copied them. I have seen it done before even thou the original artwork was designed years ago compared to the copykat's work. They still claimed it was theirs and took it to court. It was really hard on the owner of the original artwork to prove it was theirs. Its not as easy as you think. These people went through hell and back trying to protect their own branding and logo they worked hard on and used for years.

 

This is another reason you may want to give some more thought to copyrighting your logo so you won't get sued for using your own work.

Or contact the original team that did the graphics design and fill them in on the situation. They may have contingencies in place already for this exact problem. Even if they dont, they could be a source of confirmation that the original artwork was consigned by you and not the imposters. 

14 hours ago, Trappeur said:

Hey Clear Black!

 

Funny you posted this as I just noticed yesterday a post you did saying you were from Maine and I was going to tell you the same thing!.....Yep, we will definitely get together!  Sounds like a plan....I miss my lobster!

You got it!

Where in Maine are you?  I'm going back to Sanford or Parsonsfield....

 

Trappeur

Just outside of Portland in Westbrook. So about 40min drive to Sanford, not even on a good day.