Pristina Posted July 6, 2011 Share Posted July 6, 2011 Hi there!!For those of you who flip your palm candles to force the airbubbles to the bottom of the jar: How do you keep the wicks tight and straight? I am finding that they wind up leaning to the side a bit. So, when the candle is about half way burned down, the wicks are close to the side of the jar. Once the wax gets to about 2/3 of the way down, the wicks straighten back out.What do you do to avoid this?Also, I'm curious to see what Stella thinks of the flipping method TIA~Christina Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pcbrook Posted July 6, 2011 Share Posted July 6, 2011 Well I am not sure what you are doing wrong but I have not noticed this happening when I flip the jars. Do you keep the wick pulled tight while the top is hardening? If the wick is not kept tight from the get go I think that would be the problem. Once the top hardens the wick does not move. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stella1952 Posted July 7, 2011 Share Posted July 7, 2011 Pristina, I have not tried flipping the candles. In theory, it should allow the air bubbles that are trapped in the wax to rise and relocate to the upended bottom of the container where they shouldn't cause much problem. So long as the center of the candle is still liquid enough for the air bubbles to rise, this should work okay... I have not poured any container palm wax candles in a while, but when I do, I will certainly give this method a whirl just for grins and I'll check the interior to see how well it works. I do have a bit of a problem with recommending that people (especially new folks) flip candles upside down when the liquid centers are between 170-195°... I'm not into leaking hot wax messes or burns and I can't imagine mitigating for potential leakage when pouring a few dozen candles...I like stirring the candle a few times as it cools to break up any air traps that are forming so that the voids fill with liquid wax (commonly referred to as "wrecking" - not my term, BTW). A quick remelt of the top with a heatgun smooths out any cosmetic disturbances in the surface. I find it easy to just cluster 'em all up, stir 2-3 times as they cool, then hit 'em all with a heatgun, but who knows... if the Topsy-Turvey method works out okay, maybe I'll like that better... Right now, I like knowing that the air traps have been removed, not simply relocated.As far as your wicks, I have the same question as Patty: how did you secure your wick at the top and to the bottom of the container? If the wick is held taut while the top hardens, that baby ain't goin' anywhere unless it comes loose from the bottom. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wessex Posted July 7, 2011 Share Posted July 7, 2011 (edited) I've been flipping my candles for a while, and find it works well. My wicks are secured at the top with the popsickle stick method and I have no problems with wicks being offcenter. There have been 2 incidents of flipping beanpot jars too early, and it has made a mess, LOL. That was when I was in way too much of a hurry...Cheers,Steve Edited July 7, 2011 by Wessex Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Candybee Posted July 7, 2011 Share Posted July 7, 2011 I've been flipping my palm wax jars for about a year now. I do several dozen at a time. It works great. Every jar I have tested burned better doing the flip than the time consuming and messy method of relieving air pockets by poking around in the candle. But you do need to experiment finding the right time to flip them. I secure my candles at the top with wick centering tools. I get mine at Peaks and they have a notch to hold the wick tight and centered.For my 9 oz jars I wait about 45 minutes from the time I pour to the time I flip them over. You wait til you see the top crust over but the wax is still sloshing around under the top crust. Just takes some practice to get the timing right. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pristina Posted July 8, 2011 Author Share Posted July 8, 2011 I secure my wix with 2 pencils that are rubber banded together. Maybe the wicks just aren't tight enough...hmmm. The wick centering tools seem to be soooo expensive. I make big batches, usually 32 candles, 2 scents, at one time, so it would be pricey to buy that many centering tools. When flipping...I wait 35 minutes for my 16oz candles, libbey interlude jars- 4"diameter at the top.I haven't had any air pocket problems when the candle burns down ever since i've been flipping them. Just the wick centering problem at this point. I actually see the air bubbles move to the bottom when i flip the candle......those rascals!! lolI would rather continue with the flipping method since it sure makes the production line run much smoother Thanks for your input everyone Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pristina Posted July 8, 2011 Author Share Posted July 8, 2011 I get mine at Peaks and they have a notch to hold the wick tight and centered..I spoke too soon Candybee. I just went to Peaks site and saw their centering tools and they are not expensive at all. I had another manufacturer's product in mind. D'oh! Sorry about that. I am curious how their tool keeps your wicks tight though. In the picture from their website, it looks as if the wick is just sitting there and not pulled tightly. How does it keep them tight? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Candybee Posted July 8, 2011 Share Posted July 8, 2011 Thats okay. It is a bit confusing. There is the actual wick centering tool that you put the wick in and it plants it right in the center of the jar, and then there are the top of the jar wick centering tools that hold the wick in place. Those are the ones I was referring too. They are cheap and easy to use and work great. I like Peaks cause they have that notch on them to hold the wick in place. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stella1952 Posted July 9, 2011 Share Posted July 9, 2011 The bow ties I use on the tops of the containers have a slot in which the wick fits quite snugly. Occasionally, one will let go, but mostly, once fitted in, that baby is going nowhere until I release it. The flat braid wicks that I use are wider than they are thick (hope that makes sense!). I pull the wick into the slot with the wide part and it stays very well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pristina Posted July 9, 2011 Author Share Posted July 9, 2011 I called Peak yesterday and found out that there Large centering tools are not big enough for my 4" diameter jars Pooey! Does anyone know of anyone that carries them big enough for a 4" diameter jar? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CandleAddict_RN Posted July 9, 2011 Share Posted July 9, 2011 I have only made a few glasglow palm wax containers. I read that they need to cool VERY slowly so I had either cooled them under a box or in the oven that had previously been warmed. So my question is, do you still cool them in that manner even when flipping them? And how long do you leave them upside down? Fro the rest of the cooling process? or just a few minutes? The 2nd time I made a couple I did flip them and on my 12oz status jar it almost looks like there is a 1/8 to 1/4 inch gap between the bottom of the jar and the hardened wax. It even looks like it pulled the wick tab with the stickum away from the bottom. They already looked pretty hard when I flipped it so I don't know how that happened. It was quite weird! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wessex Posted July 9, 2011 Share Posted July 9, 2011 I learned a while back that the cooling under a box thing makes no difference for my candles. As long as I pour into warmed containers and pour above 175 degrees the candles look the same. But there is usually alot of candles together, so they make a "warm zone" around themselves. As far as how long to leave flipped, I leave them flipped usually overnight depending on production needs.Cheers,Steve Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stella1952 Posted July 9, 2011 Share Posted July 9, 2011 (edited) It even looks like it pulled the wick tab with the stickum away from the bottom.The high heat at which palm wax is poured often causes stickums to separate from the glass. Palm wax needs to cool slowly, but I don't know about VERY slowly... There is such a thing as too slowly and it will affect the pattern of the candle. Edited July 9, 2011 by Stella1952 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Candybee Posted July 9, 2011 Share Posted July 9, 2011 I don't use a box either. I place my jars on a cooling rack so air flows around the jars so they cool evenly. The room temp and jar temps are also important to me when pouring palm candles. I quickly heat the jars with my heat gun just before pouring and make sure my room temp is around 69 - 72 degrees or more in the winter/fall pouring months. Don't worry about the temp in the summer as its always 74-76 in my pouring room. Palm tends to behave better for me when I pour in warmer temps. I find I get better full crystal pattersn top to bottom when pouring in warmer temps as opposed to pouring in cool jars with cool room air temps.Like Steve I make several candles at a time so I think some heat comes off the surrounding candles in a cocooning effect but I am also careful to leave space in between jars for good air flow.From my experience I know if the room temp, wax pouring temp, and jar temp is right, and the jars have good air flow between them they will cool just fine. I also heat and pour very hot. I heat to 195-205 and add my FO and dye and pour at 195-200. To keep my wax temp stable while adding fragrance and dye I keep my pour pots on an electric hot plate.Once I flip them I let them cool completely before putting on their lids and labeling. This pretty much means when the jar is cool to the touch. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CandleAddict_RN Posted July 9, 2011 Share Posted July 9, 2011 Thanks for your great info! That will really help with my next play day I do heat the palm to about 195-200, add dye & FO & pour into warm jars. I don't think that the jar that the tab pulled away was clean enough on the bottom for the stickum to stick properly and also had a tad of permatex stuck from a prior test burn. Still trying to figure out how to do the whole permatex thing. If I adhere my wicks with permatex it seems to take a while to dry and then the wicks get soft and don't stay taut when I prewarm my jars in the oven:confused: ........Sorry Pristine........ Didn't mean to highjack your thread. But thought it was along the same line Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stella1952 Posted July 10, 2011 Share Posted July 10, 2011 Still trying to figure out how to do the whole permatex thingIt's not hard. Put a dot of it over the hole on the underside of the wick tab, and affix it to the bottom of the container. It should set up in an hour - cure overnight for maximum strength and adhesion (the instructions on the tube make this pretty clear). I use the barrel of a Bic pen (with the guts removed of course), insert the wick assembly, dot the glue on the tab, push the tab onto the bottom of the container, carefully withdraw the bic pen barrel and set the container aside so the sealer can dry. It's not necessary to warm the jars to a temp that would be uncomfortable for you to handle. The wick wax shouldn't melt at that low of a temperature. If the wicks are taut before you warm the jars, they will remain so after. HTH Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sharon in KY Posted July 10, 2011 Share Posted July 10, 2011 The 2 pencils and rubber band might keep them straight but it will not keep them from drawing back into the wax. Try using a cloths pin to keep them taunt/tight. I'm having trouble with my wax getting frosty again. Damn, Damn, Damn, shit, I hate:angry2: this crap, I'm sick of wax and candles. I'm quitting this frigging soy shit damn...damn...dammmmmmmn:mad::mad::mad::mad::mad::mad::mad::mad::mad: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
deb426 Posted July 10, 2011 Share Posted July 10, 2011 Sharon, LOL. That's funny:) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stella1952 Posted July 11, 2011 Share Posted July 11, 2011 I'm having trouble with my wax getting frosty againI have problems, too, during times of high humidity. I usually cook 'em longer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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