votives

[Ruffsta]

when my daughter makes votives, the center always caves in like these:

is there a reason as to why ours to do not come out flat like these:

also, how can i get the outside of our candles nice and smooth like this:

all of ours come out with lots of tiny air bubbles all on the outside.. is there a certain additive or something? we are using 3 of these:

[OverSoyed]

Depending on the wax that you use, there may be shrinkage... a simple repour to top them off will solve the problem. Also invest in a heatgun or hot air hair dryer to smooth out your tops.

HTH

Tristan

[nursenancy]

You would need to do a repour on those votives. In other words, top them off with more wax after they cool.

When you are looking at all the different waxes that are available, you will see single pour waxes, and those are designed to help eliminate that problem. Air bubbles - You might try pouring the wax hotter. What temp are you pouring at?

I have never worked with paraffin though..always soy. So someone else may have some better input.

HTH

Nancy

[NewOrleansLady]

The cooler you pour your wax the less sink holes you'll have. I've found if you do need to do a 2nd pour I have less problems if right before I pour the reheated wax I hit the molded wax with my heat gun....seem to have better results of the two waxes adhering to each other.

Since I changed from paraffin to 50/50 wax I never have the "bubbles on the sides" problem. They are smooth on sides and top. I never did figure out why they occured cause it would happen with some and not others in the same batch. Drove me nuts but the 5050 solved that problem.

[Ruffsta]

we've used the following waxes just to get the feel of making candles:

yaley 1 lb premium wax

1lb gulf wax

we are waiting until this friday to order 10lbs of soy... we also need to get a new thermometer (as mentioned in another thread lol).

how we have done it in both attempts was the wax reached 175 and then we added the color chips then a few minutes later added the fo and then poured into the votive molds and tins. i know that is not the correct way, but we are new to it.. so all advice is welcomed

[nursenancy]

You probably already know this, but when you order your wax, just make sure you have a pillar blend, like EcoSoya PB for your votives. Otherwise you won't be able to unmold the candles. If you're doing tins, you're going to want a container blend. Once you get a specific wax, we can help you more. what kind of tins are you doing?

I've had good luck with lx20 wicks in my soy votives. I think that is a bigger size than most other people use for votives, but it works for me. Tins - I've had good luck with the eco series in 8oz travel tins. Just started doing them, but with most of my FO's so far, an eco 12 works well. They burn clean but don't get too hot to handle - that's the thing with tins. They can get really hot if overwicked. In my soy containers, I use cd wicks. This is all stuff that I've learned here on the board doing hours of searching and endless days of testing.

If I could offer 1 piece of advice - I would absolutely buy a wick sampler when you order your wax. If you go with the Yaley? wicks that you have now, and switch over, you're gonng to have to test all over again. You'll be almost back to square one. I know this has been mentioned before in one of your threads, but I think it bears repeating.

[Ruffsta]

thank you...

oh and speaking of fo's - we use 1oz per 1lb of wax (we only have done 1lb batches in both attempts).. but the wax smells great in the pot, but after the candles have cooled and all.. the candle smells ok i guess, but hardly any scent when burning..

i dunno if it's us or the types of wax we have played around with or what... when we go to the stores.. the candles are really strong scented (more than ours by far... and they smell awesome when burning)... should be adding more fo to our 1lb batches?

[ladysj]

The problem as far as hot throw could be your fo. I make votives with paraffin. I don't fill them all the way full. I poke a few relief holes around the wick and then do my second pour full to the top. Never had a problem with the shrinkage. HTH

[Ruffsta]

i tried to do relief holes had then a re-pour.. but the thing hat happened there was the center was like clear or should i say lighter in color.. so i haven't done the relief part since.. lol

what i was really expecting was a 1 pour deal...

also, should i be adding the fo before or after the color chips? i have seen videos and read both ways.. so we don't don't know which way is proper.

liquid dye vs color chips... what are the pro's and cons thatall of you have experienced?

[Starr]

Everyone's right, shrinkage happens. That's what you're experiencing and it's pretty easy to do the second pour.

You may have a wax that just isn't great for hot throw, it could be that wax can handle more then 1oz per pound, you should check when you get your soy to see how much FO it can take. If you want a really strong scent, go for the top end or even the max of whatever that amount is.

As for FO before or after dye. I usually do it after as a dye chip is cheaper then an oz of FO if something goes wrong.

Chips vs. Liquid: It depends on what you're doing. I like the chips a lot myself, they're easy to use and come in great fun colors, I've used liquid and even still have some, I prefer the chips, but it's about your comfort too.

[nursenancy]

I do dye first, then fo. I think that's how most others do, too. After I mix my dye in, I put a small amount in a plastic medicine cup (don't ask me where I get those, LOL) to see what color I have. If I like the color I have for a particular FO, I write the formula on the FO bottle with a sharpie pen. That way, I always have it right there.

I have used chips, blocks and liquid, but keep going back to liquid because I can get a better range of colors with liquid. I also find them to be more cost effective. That's just my preference. I do like the convenience of chips, but find that I have to use too many in large batches. I actually think that for you, if you're making small batches at first, chips might be a good choice. They're neat and easy to control and you can get small amounts of them pretty cheap. Dyes - I think you can kind of play around with once you get your wax/wick/fo formula

As far as your cold and hot throw, I would say that's probably the quality of the product contained in the kit. Probably not the best. Once you start using the FO's that you can get from the suppliers, you'll never go back, IMHO. When you get to FO's, My suggestion would be to buy samples. FOs can get REALLY expensive and addictive and samples will save you money in the long run. The classies are a great place to pick up FO' samples too

Boy I'm kind of long winded tonight - I don't usually type this much

[Ruffsta]

thank you everyone

Boy I'm kind of long winded tonight - I don't usually type this much

lol

yeah we do the fo after the color chips as well. the block of color we have been using - we have to break up and on our last batch she didn't let the chip fully melt (as we were pouring), so the reason i was asking about liquid dyes. i might try a bottle out... :smiley2:

[ladysj]

LOL Nursenancy I do have to agree with you on alot of what you said. The thing that most new candle makers don't realize is the time and expense it takes to make a good candle.

I personally use the Hobby Lobby plain paraffin with their 40% off coupon for my pillars & votives. With this wax you can make rustics or mottles which I like the flexibilty of it. Yes they require re-pours and I do put additives to keep the mottling from appearing if I don't want mottled. But I have had good results with it both hot and cold.

I did make the mistake of purchasing a 100% soy pillar wax at a great deal that turned out not to be such a great deal. So I mix this with the paraffin and get a great burning candle as well.

I always used dye chips until I purchased a couple of bottles of liquid dye and they are so much better and takes less especially if I'm wanting a true black or brown color.

I'm rattling too it seems. All I can say is it's a trial and error thing and plan on spending quite a few $$$ even if you are just making them for yourself. I hope you don't plan on trying to sell any time soon. LOL

As far as 100% soy for votives I don't like it because they always feel greasy to me. I couldn't get all of the greasy feel wiped off.

[nursenancy]

If I'm using blocks, I shave off little bits at a time with my trusty swiss army knife. I think some people use a small grater, too. This allows it to melt easier.

I never got an oily feel from my soy votives. I use Ecosoya PB. Votives are by far my best seller.

If I had all the dough I've spent on supplies over the years I could probably take a month long vacay in Europe. I'm not exaggerating, either, It's in the thousands

[Scented]

I do dye first, then fo.

I don't. Sometimes a fragrance oil is hard to incorporate in the wax and that's easier to see when the wax isn't colored. I add FO first and make sure it incorporates and then dye. Don't want to ever pull a wick pin again and have a red slush come out.

[nursenancy]

Sometimes a fragrance oil is hard to incorporate in the wax

Hmm.. I never had that problem.. that I know of :rolleyes2 . Is that in soy?

I just always did dye, then FO because I like to choose the scent based on whatever color I have. That became my habit, and I just never changed.

[chuck_35550]

Personally, I like Astorlite V for votives. A really great one pour wax that colors vividly and rarely has issues. You really want to get away from Yaley or any other similar craft stuff and start buying some really good wax and fos. I like the zinc wicks for paraffin but you might want to try LX wicks for soy. Try hitting your molds on the side with a spoon to loosen air bubbles and try not to stir up your wax and incorporate air bubbles as you mix. The Astorlite V comes in pellet form and I usually measure out what I want into an old Mr. Coffee carafe and melt on a griddle or hot plate. Buy one of those thermometers with the long probe for your oven and stick that sucker down in the wax and set your stir time for 2 minutes for color then 2 minutes for fo and then pour and cool slowly in a cardboard box. The wax pops out with a tap and then you plug in your wicks and cover the bottom with a warning label and then package in little plastic craft bags from wally world and stick a label on it and you're good to go.

[Judy, USMC]

The paraffin you are using will shrink. You will have to double pour to get the smooth tops with that wax.

Like Scented, I add the FO first to make sure it incorporates. And I use liquid dyes because some of the solid ones left little dots of color because it did not completely dissolve - red was worst.

Stir - do not whip. The less air you incorporate when you stir the less air bubbles you will see.

With paraffin you should pre-heat your votive cups. One method is to put them in the toaster oven set on low for a minute - remove with tongs - and pour into immediately.

The hotter the wax when you pour the more it will shrink. The cooler the wax the more air bubbles you will see.

Now you have done the basics, have your pour pot and some votive cups. I'm still recommending you find a supplier that offers Tech Support or a Forum you can join ... especially since it looks like you are going to be going from paraffin to soy. Soy has its own set of guidelines - again depending on the wax you decide to use.

Having a source mentor is the easiest/most cost effective way when first starting out.

[Scented]

With paraffin you should pre-heat your votive cups. One method is to put them in the toaster oven set on low for a minute - remove with tongs - and pour into immediately.

I don't do that either and my votives come out fine ... even using paraffin. My votives sit at room temp.

[Judy, USMC]

I don't do that either and my votives come out fine ... even using paraffin. My votives sit at room temp.

She's using Yaley &/or Gulf wax - not exactly what we are using. Problem is she's up in the northeast and we don't know what her home temp is at. I had the same problem with when I was up in Chicago last year. Had a cool house and poured some 4786 at a little cooler temp into room temp cups - bubble city even pouring slow.

I don't pre-heat in the sunny south. Just trying to take out one of the variables for her.

[ChrisR]

I gotta agree with Scented, I don't do that either and have no problems. I also live in the northeast, make candles in my basement where the temperature in the winter is around 60 and still have no problems with bubbles of any kind!!

[Ruffsta]

She's using Yaley &/or Gulf wax - not exactly what we are using. Problem is she's up in the northeast and we don't know what her home temp is at. I had the same problem with when I was up in Chicago last year. Had a cool house and poured some 4786 at a little cooler temp into room temp cups - bubble city even pouring slow.

I don't pre-heat in the sunny south. Just trying to take out one of the variables for her.

well we used the 1lb of Yaley premium because that's what came with the kit. and we used 1lb of gulf wax (saw it in the store while shopping - so i figured we would try that out.. (it was cheap.. so i got what i paid for LOL)

but yeah, as i mentioned - we are waiting until this Friday to order some soy.. was thinking getting it from either Lone Star or Candles And Supplies or somewhere that has it the cheapest.

the temp in and outside my house are in the 60's or more now as we are warming up for summer.

i THINK, the main issues we are having are:

1.) cheap wax

2.) not knowing the calculations for fo % (i saw the thread recently)

3.) we set the stove on high and melted the wax.. it reached temp way too soon.. added the chips and the fo

we should have actually set the stove to like a low or low-medium heat (as we have seen on videos)..

would i be correct in assuming these?

[Starr]

I'll say this, I know I've had to turn the air on twice in PA over the last month, other then that, it's been cool to comfortable. Chances are good it's a touch cooler in MA then it is here in PA.

I wish I had thought to pop my votive cups in the convection oven this winter... those airbubbles drove me stark-raving mad!!!!

[NewOrleansLady]

I used to preheat my votive molds with my heat gun immediately before I poured and I'd get the bubbles using IGI 4794. Once I changed to 5050 the bubbles stopped. I think all waxes are males and put on this earth to just drive us nuts!!!!!

[Jane42]

We do preheat our votive molds, since it is cool where we are and we tend to get "jump lines" if we don't. Also, if it hasn't already been mentioned, make sure you are on a level surface when doing the second pour on votives. Otherwise, the wax will start spilling off of one side before the other side has been covered. I HATE doing second pours! lol

We have also found that adding the FO after the color can completely change some of our colors due to the color of the FO. We have a terrible time with our Cinnamon Sticks coloring....it looks great until we add the FO, then it turns a deep purple! So, when testing a new color, we add FO first, then liquid dye.

We live in Western NY, so we usually order our wax from Candles and Supplies in PA or Candlescience.