sassysoapsnsuch Posted November 10, 2007 Share Posted November 10, 2007 PS IF you sell on eBay and you want to bring people to you online shoppe you can only put your link on your about me page. In your auction simply refer folks to you ABOUT ME page to find out where you are on the web, Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tereasa Posted November 10, 2007 Share Posted November 10, 2007 I honestly don't understand the obsession with this person selling her tarts so cheaply. I mean, to the point of going and researching where and how much she gets of supplies? Sheesh... Perhaps it is just a hobby for her, and she just wants to make enough to buy another sample of FO. Perhaps it's none of our business what she does to make money. I know there are people around who don't look for the cheapest of everything. I am one of those people. Call me a snob, but I don't buy generic vegetables. I like Green Giant. I don't buy 100 tarts for a dollar because something tells me that I'd get what I paid for. All it takes is a bit of common sense to figure that out. Nothing is free. I suggest choosing your market wisely and not playing to a lessor quality competitor. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Violetsexoticcandles Posted November 10, 2007 Author Share Posted November 10, 2007 I honestly don't understand the obsession with this person selling her tarts so cheaply. I mean, to the point of going and researching where and how much she gets of supplies? Sheesh... Perhaps it is just a hobby for her, and she just wants to make enough to buy another sample of FO. Perhaps it's none of our business what she does to make money. I know there are people around who don't look for the cheapest of everything. I am one of those people. Call me a snob, but I don't buy generic vegetables. I like Green Giant. I don't buy 100 tarts for a dollar because something tells me that I'd get what I paid for. All it takes is a bit of common sense to figure that out. Nothing is free. I suggest choosing your market wisely and not playing to a lessor quality competitor.Tereasa,It's not really an 'obsession,' as you call it, but a chandler wondering how in the world any other candle maker can sell for less than cost. This one person is just an example of what I've come across since starting to sell on Ebay. Call it price-gouging, if you will... still... how do they make any profit? And maybe most people aren't, as you say you are, 'snobs;' people on ebay seem to look for the lowest price and bid. Some learn their lesson and then look elsewhere or stop buying... but still. As far as my researching, I've been encouraged to research on CT, so why not on Ebay? I started out selling there... perhaps one of my biggest mistakes, but hey...I have spent quite some of my time researching, in general- I earned my BA in English with a minor in Medieval Renaissance Studies, and went on to grad school to earn an MS in Education Administration.... I do my research before any sort of project I embark upon, often spending months doing so... That is simply my nature. I have a knack for it. I love doing it. I currently work as a research assistant.Alas, I digress.If it's just a hobby, well, she's been selling for about a year and has a feedback of over 500- more than my feedback and I've been on Ebay since 2001 (I have not always sold candles, either, mind you). Her ID is TCTarts or something like that. That being said, it seems nearly her entire reason, or purpse, for that matter, is selling tarts. All well and good, if one is simply selling tarts, but it still begs the question: how does she make a profit, or even cover costs? Perhaps you are right in saying she simply wants to buy another FO and that is why. But from what I can gather, in my own experience, she is not profiting. How can someone profit selling for that little? We all know how much it costs to play with wax, FO's and dyes, experimenting for months on end, just to make a quality candle or tart. Maybe it is a 'hobby,' as I've suggested before. But I doubt it, simply because she states that it is her 'business' on her listings... ahem..........I'm not playing to a lessor competitor. The reason I won't sell tarts (or is it more PC to say "melts?") and votives on Ebay is because there are those who sell for ridiculously low prices and I would not really make a profit, in fact, I would take a loss once fees from Ebay as well as Paypal are considered into the picture. Even selling jars on Ebay is hit and miss. I have quite a few customers who will look for my listings and bid, but there are ebay sellers who look at others' listings and considerably 'undercut' mine and others' prices, so we look like we're 'overcharging,' when in actuality, we're not asking for more than it costs to make our candles and make a bit of profit. I was just curious to see if her tarts are up to my standards, as a chandler. Like I've said, I've purchased other candles, including an Ebay seller's candle, to see what they've offered. I used to be a die-hard Yankee fan and used to like Partylite... I've MORE than sampled their products! I've emailed my fellow chandlers on Ebay, asking them if they really make much on their sales. Some have come back and said, yes, they do, to a certain extent. Others have been in the same boat as me- continue to list and pay Ebay, or strike out on their own? That is the question. I did not email this particular seller, that is true. It's not the individuals who are selling for less, necessarily, that bothers me- It is the hype they often adopt to sell. For example:1. hundreds of scents available, but been at this for a year or less (how does one test that many scents in such a short time? I've only been able to test maybe 100 in 2 years?)2. triple scented Added to the fact that they repeatedly undercut a HUGE amount of sellers and make it impossible for those who simply cannot offer quality products for that price.I have seen so much crap on Ebay in Candlemaking, as well, such as people willing to 'sell' their methods to the highest bidder... or those willing to list their suppliers to the highest bidder... tell them their greatest secrets, for a cost... If anything, I'm discounting Ebay and its capitalistic, money-hungry nature, which does not think twice about the individual, the small business owner who is trying to make something of her or himself, than any one individual seller.And by the way, I love Green Giant Corn nibblets. If possible, I will eat no other canned corn. But there are those who are 'starving' and will eat any sort of canned corn, thus, discounting the Green Giants out there. I hate creamed corn, by the way... any brand will not buy my loyalty.But then again, any french cut green beans will do, for me, which, in turn, can be likened to candles, for certain people. As long as they are french cut (or soy candles), who cares, at first? I had a customer approach me last year, stating she loves Yankee candles, but a friend told her she MUST start buying soy. Where does she start? How does she become 'educated?' From a consumer point of view, perhaps any soy will do... And if a person like this falls in the hands of those who do not produce quality, it hurts us all.One can only find out by opening the can and heating those beans up and eating them... then, if they dislike the taste, quality, etcetera, maybe one consumer then decides: "Hey, maybe Yankee, Mia Bella, Partylite, were the best after all. So what if they were homemade? I was not happy with my homemade product. I'm going back (or forward) to a mass-produced product."We crafters are a dime a dozen (pardon the cliche). We must work together to offer a product that we can all be proud of, and that's why we're here, that's why we remain and that's why we care, correct?That's all I'm saying. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Violetsexoticcandles Posted November 10, 2007 Author Share Posted November 10, 2007 I honestly don't understand the obsession with this person selling her tarts so cheaply. I mean, to the point of going and researching where and how much she gets of supplies? Sheesh... Perhaps it is just a hobby for her, and she just wants to make enough to buy another sample of FO. Perhaps it's none of our business what she does to make money. I know there are people around who don't look for the cheapest of everything. I am one of those people. Call me a snob, but I don't buy generic vegetables. I like Green Giant. I don't buy 100 tarts for a dollar because something tells me that I'd get what I paid for. All it takes is a bit of common sense to figure that out. Nothing is free. I suggest choosing your market wisely and not playing to a lessor quality competitor.And to make an obvious point, Green Giant veggies and others are canned, and as such, preserved by sodium and other chemicals. So, let's say they are at the bottom of the foodchain and compare them to dollar store candles.Canned foods are considerably less quality than frozen, dietary-wise (so much sodium and preservatives!). So let's say that frozen veggies are comparable to, hmm... walmart or other such marketed candles.Frozen veggies contain much less sodium and are preserved just as well, even if shelf-life is limited due to the hazards of freezer-burn.A step up from frozen are fresh veggies- yet these must be consumed immediately... These can be likened to the mass produced candles out there such as Yankee, Mia, Partylite, etc...Then you have ones that are 'organically grown...' same freshness issue there, yet, they do not have the harmful 'pesticides' some have been frightened by and some are happy that they are quality, 'home grown,' or 'homemade' products. I would rather buy carrot juice from a well-reputed local farm than from some mass-producing company who only intends on making a profit and watering down my juice! If I cannot produce carrot juice for myself, that is... (which I have done).So veggies home-grown on a farm, can be likened to homemade products, particularly handpoured candles, in my opinion. These are products the producer has put their time into perfecting, as well as money and research.Your common sense may not be others' common sense. I consider the BEST veggies to be FRESH as well as organic.The least we, as producers, can do is offer the best product possible for our consumers.And now I am done. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tereasa Posted November 10, 2007 Share Posted November 10, 2007 What a lovely dissertation!I suppose I could post my post-secondary education resume as well, but suffice to say it trumps yours.My whole point is that I go to Ebay, when I go to Ebay, expecting or hoping for a bargain. I wouldn't market my candles as a bargain, were I to market them. Therefore, I would not even worry about other chandlers selling on Ebay. As I said, choose your market wisely. I think that perhaps your financial situation is putting undue strain upon your candle business. This is just my opinion, but from all of your posts about your personal situation I gather that you are relying upon selling candles to make money. I understand that it's stressful to be under the gun, and frantic for sales. I just stand by my opinion that there are better answers to the problem than Ebay. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mizbizzyb Posted November 10, 2007 Share Posted November 10, 2007 How about some candlemakers buying wax by the pallet and not having to pay shipping costs.....also having suppliers near by for pick up - buying in bulk......I guess I can see it being possible selling that cheap depending on your costs. Just me.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Violetsexoticcandles Posted November 10, 2007 Author Share Posted November 10, 2007 What a lovely dissertation!I suppose I could post my post-secondary education resume as well, but suffice to say it trumps yours.My whole point is that I go to Ebay, when I go to Ebay, expecting or hoping for a bargain. I wouldn't market my candles as a bargain, were I to market them. Therefore, I would not even worry about other chandlers selling on Ebay. As I said, choose your market wisely. I think that perhaps your financial situation is putting undue strain upon your candle business. This is just my opinion, but from all of your posts about your personal situation I gather that you are relying upon selling candles to make money. I understand that it's stressful to be under the gun, and frantic for sales. I just stand by my opinion that there are better answers to the problem than Ebay.Okay, that's fine- your personal take on why some people go to Ebay. It's not my financial situation putting strain on the business... Yes, I was having problems for a while, but I since switched jobs... The issue here is that it is hard enough getting out there, both online as well as locally. I've said my piece.Thanks to all who responded. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DyadMoons Posted November 10, 2007 Share Posted November 10, 2007 I am not sure why they do it but I can tell you why we do. We have sold on eBay for several years. One of our strategies when trying to drum up interest is to use a percentage of the items as loss leaders. You could say we simply treat the cost like it is a marketing plan. By doing this it generates word of mouth, feedback we can use on future listings, new customers, residual sales, free advertising for our website, and market testing to help set price points and so on.I doubt they are profiting much if any. The cost to even take payment using paypal would eat up 30% of the $1.00, not to mention the eBay fees. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Violetsexoticcandles Posted November 10, 2007 Author Share Posted November 10, 2007 I am not sure why they do it but I can tell you why we do. We have sold on eBay for several years. One of our strategies when trying to drum up interest is to use a percentage of the items as loss leaders. You could say we simply treat the cost like it is a marketing plan. By doing this it generates word of mouth, feedback we can use on future listings, new customers, residual sales, free advertising for our website, and market testing to help set price points and so on.I doubt they are profiting much if any. The cost to even take payment using paypal would eat up 30% of the $1.00, not to mention the eBay fees.I agree with the fee part (I think paypal charges 10%, though), which is why it stumps me.... but your explanation does make a lot of sense. I used to make and sell mini tarts, myself, but stopped because they were such a pain in the butt to make and I didn't feel it was worthwhile. But, that being said, I may just start making them only for Xmas, if I can find the time. There's no way I'd sell that cheaply, though. I used to sell them for $5 for 50, starting bid. That way I at least recouped my costs. I know they can be a good marketing tool, especially given people are buying candles without smelling them first. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DyadMoons Posted November 10, 2007 Share Posted November 10, 2007 We have a PayPal Business account. We are charged $0.30 per transaction plus 2.9% of the total amount of the payment. It would cost us $0.33 to just take the payment...lol. The ebay fees would be $0.20 cents to insert the auction at a starting bid of $0.99. If the listing started at $1.00 that jumps to $.040 cents. Then there is the 5.25% final value fee. This is why I think it is being used as a loss leader.I have not purchased any of the tarts but I would imaging that they are probably made using a candy mold. I find making them using a candy mold time consuming and a pain. The only way I have found to fill such a small cavity is by using a dropper...yuck!I am not sure what you sell on eBay but we sell a variety of things. Last year we started creating a new store off of eBay to help offset the ever increasing fees. You might want to check out eCrater if you need additional sales channels. It is complete free and very easy to use. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Violetsexoticcandles Posted November 10, 2007 Author Share Posted November 10, 2007 We have a PayPal Business account. We are charged $0.30 per transaction plus 2.9% of the total amount of the payment. It would cost us $0.33 to just take the payment...lol. The ebay fees would be $0.20 cents to insert the auction at a starting bid of $0.99. If the listing started at $1.00 that jumps to $.040 cents. Then there is the 5.25% final value fee. This is why I think it is being used as a loss leader.I have not purchased any of the tarts but I would imaging that they are probably made using a candy mold. I find making them using a candy mold time consuming and a pain. The only way I have found to fill such a small cavity is by using a dropper...yuck!I am not sure what you sell on eBay but we sell a variety of things. Last year we started creating a new store off of eBay to help offset the ever increasing fees. You might want to check out eCrater if you need additional sales channels. It is complete free and very easy to use.Yah, probably candy molds- that's what I used and why I hated making them... can we say wax all over the place? LOL. My hands aren't always THAT steady.Thanks for the tip on eCrater. Never heard of it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DyadMoons Posted November 10, 2007 Share Posted November 10, 2007 Yah, probably candy molds- that's what I used and why I hated making them... can we say wax all over the place? LOL. My hands aren't always THAT steady.Thanks for the tip on eCrater. Never heard of it.Yes! Which is exactly why I started using a dropper....lol. I would rather make them using a standard tart mould or clam shells.Your welcome! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kelly Posted November 10, 2007 Share Posted November 10, 2007 I sell on eBay as well, and while I am currently making a profit, I haven't sold a single candle and only 1 clamshell wax melt. I price my things normally so of course people aren't going to buy my quality candles when they can get a candle that looks worse, smells worse, burns worse but only cost them a buck or two!But when I research eBay I often wondered that too, how could they be selling their tarts for so cheap (and candles). And if you go into the advanced search you can search completed listings by a certain seller and calculate it out, most are not making a profit from their eBay sales but that doesn't mean they aren't getting a huge profit from repeat customers off of eBay. You can only do so much research at eBay. *shrug* Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Violetsexoticcandles Posted November 10, 2007 Author Share Posted November 10, 2007 but that doesn't mean they aren't getting a huge profit from repeat customers off of eBay. You can only do so much research at eBay. *shrug*Very true! I have a lot of repeats from Ebay, but they seem to want the same thing- cheap candles. Usually, they buy when I put a sale up or offer free shipping. I opened my store on eCrater today. Hopin for some sales on it! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kelly Posted November 10, 2007 Share Posted November 10, 2007 I've only sold one thing at eCrater in the past 3 months. Doesn't seem to great but if you promote it to your currect customers and offer some kind of discount on their order if they refer people you could probably build up from there. But then again I only have my incense up at eCrater because I hate listing everything!Good luck though! eCrater is nice because you get to keep your profit (well except for PayPal fees!) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Violetsexoticcandles Posted November 10, 2007 Author Share Posted November 10, 2007 I've only sold one thing at eCrater in the past 3 months. Doesn't seem to great but if you promote it to your currect customers and offer some kind of discount on their order if they refer people you could probably build up from there. But then again I only have my incense up at eCrater because I hate listing everything!Good luck though! eCrater is nice because you get to keep your profit (well except for PayPal fees!)Thanks! I sent an email to my current customers and hopefully they'll plug it for me I have a website but having issues w/it my server. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TxGirl Posted December 18, 2007 Share Posted December 18, 2007 I'm bringing this thread back up. Didn't see it before. I have done very well on ebay myself. It is not necessary to sell 100 tarts for 1 buck to get your name out there. I can't comprehend why anyone would want to do that either. I, on the other hand, sell a high quality product cutting no corners whatsoever. My tarts are sold in packs of 2 for a buck. And being that they are made to my high standards people buy them and leave me feedback that states they are outstanding, bigger than expected, could smell them before they even opened the box, etc. Then guess what! They come back and buy boxes full of tarts the next time and still pay $1.00 per 2 tarts! They think that since the tarts are only a buck for 2, they are still getting a great deal and buy in bulk! Then comes big profit. I had someone write me last night wanting a shipping quote for a very lage quanitity of tarts. They want however many the box will hold. They did not ask for me to cut the price either, as long as the shipping cost was the actual shipping cost. You know how many of my little packs of tarts can fit in that flat rate box? About 60 or 70! That is 60 x 2 tarts per pack @ 1.00 a pack, that is $60.00 for 120 tarts! Now you see where I am going with this! :-) Heck it only cost me a few dollars to make them since I bought my supplies in bulk. That is a very nice profit! How the heck they sell them for 100 for a 1.00 is beyond me. So anyway, I make roughly 20.00+ give or take a little per pound on tarts. Yes, at first when I started I had to take a huge loss, but the loss only lasted about 6 weeks then it's been steadily building ever since. The key is to offer quality products using popular fragrances, at reasonable prices. Even if it means selling small portions. It's a win win situation. I've slowly been able to raise the prices of my jar candles to a reasonable profitable price too. However, the money is in the tarts and votives on ebay. Instead of making a killing on 1 large candle. I am making a killing on selling many small high quality items. 2 votives for 2 bucks, 2 tarts for a buck, etc. To be honest I hate giving away my strategies on here because this may create competion, but at the same time I don't want everyone here to think that all ebay sellers are cutting corners or going nuts giving stuff away for free! By the way, I do buy my wax, oils, etc. in bulk. I look for sales too. That way I can still get the high end products to make my stuff with. Lets face it if the quality isn't there, you will not get repeat business and that defeats the purpose completely!My point is - with enough patients and a good strategy you can make ebay work for you. You have to be willing to lose some money at first though. Then after a little while it starts paying off and making it worth your while. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soapmom25 Posted December 18, 2007 Share Posted December 18, 2007 My tarts are sold in packs of 2 for a buck. I don't make or sell candles and/or tarts, but just this pricing in general has me wondering how you profit from this? When taking the Ebay & Pay Pal fees into account, how much can you possibly make on a dollar?The exception would be if you're just saying the tarts cost 2/$1.00, but then you sell them in "lots" so that you can make a profit after fees ~ that I could understand Your example of a customer buying in bulk definitely makes sense as being profitable (only paying the shipping once and only paying the fees once, although the Ebay fee would be higher!), I'm just wondering about the 2/$1.00 or even 2/$2.00 votives. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TxGirl Posted December 18, 2007 Share Posted December 18, 2007 Yes, most of them do buy in bulk. They will order 1 or 2 to try, and as I stated they re high quality so they are impressed enough to come back. I have one lady that keeps a running "tab" if you will, then when she is ready to close the order she writes me and says send the invoice. Most all of my tarts are being sold in quantity. I still list them in packs of 2, but the costomer goes through my store and racks up a big order. I do send out the single order package here there a few times week, but the majority of my business is in bulk quantity. In fact some don't even try them out in small orders first. Many of them order big right from the beginning. Such as the one that I just replied to last night. He/she has written me 3 times inquiring in the past 24 hours so I feel certain that deal will go through before the day is over. Like I said, you do have to lose some money at first, but it pays off with a little patience. I am quite amazed myself, but I was determined to make this work and so far it's working very well! I didn't think this was going to work, but it has! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TxGirl Posted December 18, 2007 Share Posted December 18, 2007 PS. A store listing is only .5 cents and you can list however many you need to on that one listing. Such as for example I have 12 packs of Black Cherry tarts available. Well I can list those 12 items separately into just 1 listing for only .5 cents. Then I'll list just 1 out in the public auction listings for .20 cents. All it takes is 1 public auction listing to draw attention to the store. When they get there and browse since everything is 2/1.00 they go trhough and buy in bulk. Its hard to explain in typed words what I mean. I hope this makes sense. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TxGirl Posted December 18, 2007 Share Posted December 18, 2007 One more thing. Another key thing to consider is to be unique. Don't make your item like everyone else does. Change it up come up with new ideas. People get tired of the same thing. If your items are different or unique that will draw attention also. My tarts are not shaped like everyone elses. They are shaped different and probably even a little bigger. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coco Posted December 18, 2007 Share Posted December 18, 2007 If they are charging $9.95 for shipping and sending in an envelope, it seems they are making around $7.00 in profit from the shipping alone. I bet "the box" is a free USPS box... there's another $2.00. Still, not making anywhere near where they should be for 100 tarts though my guess is they are "cutting" the wax with cheap paraffin, using bare minimum fragrance and are obviously tiny tarts. I still don't get it, though I think the same about alot of cheap things I see on Ebay.. I wouldn't even waste my time to make that kind of money. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TxGirl Posted December 18, 2007 Share Posted December 18, 2007 Yep, I agree. I don't over charge my people. I charge 2.00 for 1 tart order, then .x cents per tart order thereafter. Then if they want a whole box full I check the prices for parcel post and priority. I don't do hidden fees or over inflated shipping. My whole point to all of my posting in this thread is that there really are a small handful of us on ebay that are not cheating anyone and are doing quality work. It's those few bad ones that give the good ones a bad name though, I am sure. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coco Posted December 18, 2007 Share Posted December 18, 2007 I don't think the point in this post was that anyone was cheating anyone but rather how these people can afford to sell for so cheap. Though I will say that I never buy anything from the folks who have a low buyout but inflated shipping. This is one of my biggest pet peeves! I about lose my mind when I see something that costs $5 and the shipping is $25.. WTH?! I sold on Ebay for 9 years, I have a pretty good idea how much things cost to ship. I would rather pay more for the item and actual cost for shipping. The whole attempt at the jedi mind trick just doesn't work for me Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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