doris Posted January 23, 2007 Share Posted January 23, 2007 I've done a lot of reading here the last month or so, and I've been wondering what it is that makes candles so dangerous? I understand about the open flame, and cats knocking the candle over, and jars breaking etc.; but what would make a candle turn into a torch? I have burned a lot of candles in the last few months, mostly rolled beeswax, poured beeswax pillars and soy votives, and I've had tunnels and mushrooms and drowning wicks and floating wicks, but nothing resembling anything even remotely scary. Would it be the fragrance oils? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chris77 Posted January 23, 2007 Share Posted January 23, 2007 People make candles dangerous by burning them in unsafe conditions...under a curtain, marathon burning, falling asleep, leaving the house....heard of one guy that burnt them in his semi while driving!Candles can be dangerous in the wrong type of container...gets too hot and cracks, spilling your melt pool and exposing more of the wick, thus you have a torch! Same thing with pillars if you have a major blowout and your wick "grows" as the melt pool gushes out.Also if the glass is too hot and you have a little child touch it or pick it up...first gets burned...then drops the candle, possibly breaking glass and either way you have hot wax all over them and anything in it's way....if the glass breaks and the flame gets loose, well, there goes the home and the child.Any time you add fire to anything, the danger level rises. As long as we make the candles as safely as we can, they will only be as dangerous as the people that burn them...which in itself can be pretty dangerous! Thank goodness for insurance! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Everito Bandito Posted January 23, 2007 Share Posted January 23, 2007 Chris77 covered it very well. http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2004/12/09/earlyshow/contributors/tracysmith/main660125.shtml"There's no such thing as a perfectly safe candle," says Jim Shannon of the National Fire Prevention Association. "The most recent statistics we have, for one year: about 190 people killed from candle fires in the United States, and almost 1,500 injured." Those statistics also show that, in one year alone, the number of candle fires rose 15 percent, and nearly 5 percent of home fires were started by candles. Compare that to the early '80s, when only around 1 percent of house fires were caused by candles. Why the increase? Experts say it's the jump in the popularity of candles."In the last 10 years, the increase in candle sales has been at least 700 percent," notes Valerie Cooper, executive vice president of the National Candle Association. "We believe that 80 percent of all candle fires can be eliminated by three basic safety precautions: Never leave a burning candle unattended. Keep away from things that can catch fire, and keep away from children and pets," she suggests. New York City Fire Chief John Coloe says, "You have to remember that, every time you light one of these things, you've started a small fire in your home." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
topofmurrayhill Posted January 23, 2007 Share Posted January 23, 2007 I've done a lot of reading here the last month or so, and I've been wondering what it is that makes candles so dangerous? I understand about the open flame, and cats knocking the candle over, and jars breaking etc.; but what would make a candle turn into a torch? Would it be the fragrance oils?Yeah I think that would be the #1 fire issue -- fragrances causing container candles to ignite. I've heard several people tell about that. I hear they burn impressively. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crafty1_AJ Posted January 23, 2007 Share Posted January 23, 2007 I like to look at manufacturer's recommended fragrance loads, then take that down a notch when I add fo. I always go a bit lower than recommended. Not foolproof, of course, but it sure gives me a little peace of mind knowing that I have a bit of wiggle room there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smokymountainraine Posted January 23, 2007 Share Posted January 23, 2007 I like to look at manufacturer's recommended fragrance loads, then take that down a notch when I add fo. I always go a bit lower than recommended. Not foolproof, of course, but it sure gives me a little peace of mind knowing that I have a bit of wiggle room there.I do the same thing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
islandgirl Posted January 23, 2007 Share Posted January 23, 2007 I've done a lot of reading here the last month or so, and I've been wondering what it is that makes candles so dangerous? It is the nit-wits that burn a candle improperly. If someone is going to buy, and then burn a candle that has a puddle of FO on top of it, Shame on them.. *faint* Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SatinDucky Posted January 23, 2007 Share Posted January 23, 2007 It is the nit-wits that burn a candle improperly. If someone is going to buy, and then burn a candle that has a puddle of FO on top of it, Shame on them.. *faint*That's easy enough to say...but many people are clueless about the dangers. Before I started making them, I would've burned one that had some FO on top. I mean, the manufacturer is selling it that way and they should know what's safe, so it must be ok, right? So, it's a naive way of thinking, but all too common. I will even admit to doing stupid things in my younger days... like buying the little bottle of potpourri oil (like they used to sell to drip on a light bulb - while cool - to scent the room after it heats up), then pouring a small amount of it into the melt pool of a candle. I wanted it to put out more scent since originally it had practically none. I figure d since candle were made with something similar, what could it hurt to add a little more? Yes, I was lucky nothing bad ever happened and yes I know better now :embarasse Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Juggy Posted January 23, 2007 Share Posted January 23, 2007 I have gone to sleep before and forgot to put out a candle. I know not to do that but I have forgotten before and was just lucky nothing happened. I am kind of paranoid about safety now that I am more informed. I'm testing a candle now and am unsure if the container is too hot (with a cd 14). When I wick down, I get a poor mp (cd 12). I'm not sure what other wicks to try. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
islandgirl Posted January 23, 2007 Share Posted January 23, 2007 That's easy enough to say...but many people are clueless about the dangers. I agree totally!!! I think they need to get educated and read the warning labels.If they are going to play with fire, then they may get burnt... Ya know.I would not pick up a chain saw and use it before reading the instructions.If you play with a chain saw, you may cut ...No matter how hard we try to educate people, some people will not burn candles properly and follow instructions. That starts most fires... IMO Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
topofmurrayhill Posted January 24, 2007 Share Posted January 24, 2007 It is the nit-wits that burn a candle improperly. If someone is going to buy, and then burn a candle that has a puddle of FO on top of it, Shame on them.. *faint*They don't need to have a puddle. The issue with wax/FO compatibility can be a lot more subtle than that and the candles can look fine. The same mixture can even burn ok in one container and flash over in another.None of the people I've heard about this from were clueless newbies. A few were exceptionally conscientious designers and testers. The candle formulas weren't unusual or radical. Could easily happen that you never see anything odd and then it turns out a certain percentage of candles go pooft on the customer. Often it happens in normal use and not in power burns or other torture testing where you expect something to go wrong.So I'd say this is probably the top safety issue from the candlemaker's side, because it's pretty dangerous, not all that rare, and can be difficult to fully test for. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Freezin Posted January 24, 2007 Share Posted January 24, 2007 Exactly what Top said. I had an issue with a particular scent used in combination with a certain type of wick that I was testing. If I used the wick with a different scent, no problem. If I used the scent with a different wick no problem. Since the wicks were just in the test phase, I decided not to use them and eventually the scent also. But the combination of what we use, I think, can cause problems. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
islandgirl Posted January 24, 2007 Share Posted January 24, 2007 They don't need to have a puddle. The issue with wax/FO compatibility can be a lot more subtle than that and the candles can look fine. The same mixture can even burn ok in one container and flash over in another. What kind of candles are you making or burning?? I have never had a candle flash fire into other candles!!! You really must use explosive in your candles!!!!Or a bucket full of Oils!!So I'd say this is probably the top safety issue from the candlemaker's side, because it's pretty dangerous, not all that rare, and can be difficult to fully test for.So what are you saying here? We now should test for "Pooft"None of the people I've heard about this from were clueless newbies. A few were exceptionally conscientious designers and testers. The candle formulas weren't unusual or radical. Could easily happen that you never see anything odd and then it turns out a certain percentage of candles go pooft on the customer. Often it happens in normal use and not in power burns or other torture testing where you expect something to go wrong.Who are your people?? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
topofmurrayhill Posted January 24, 2007 Share Posted January 24, 2007 Flashover is when the flame from the wick ignites the candle mixture. Like I said, it's not uncommon and doesn't require buckets of FO. You don't need to see seepage or any warning sign. Hasn't happened to me, but has happened to people I know and also people on this board. It can even happen with candles that are apparently very well tested.The point was to answer the original question. I think flashover from fragrance oil is the most direct and relevant answer to what was asked. I'm not interested in minimizing the design issues on the candlemaking side and ragging on the customers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Di_in_AZ Posted January 24, 2007 Share Posted January 24, 2007 Most of the reports I have seen in the paper have to do with a candle left unattended, knocked over by a child/pet and being burned near curtains. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doris Posted January 24, 2007 Author Share Posted January 24, 2007 Actually Top, you did answer my question. To me, knocking over a candle, or having a curtain blowing over the flame, are really obvious dangers, especially when I heat with wood and have a really healthy respect for open flames. They're also, from my point of view and in my house, preventable, because I'm a little weird about fire. It was the "turning into a torch" that had me wondering. Thanks for the info. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
islandgirl Posted January 24, 2007 Share Posted January 24, 2007 No one is ragging, Top... FO Flashover was your take on it..To answer the question, Many factors contribute to a candle to catching fire. (Oils being part of it) Including the customers.. (Not ragging, just stating) "Candles as Fire Causes"In this course, we will investigate how candles can fail and potentially start a fire. We will explain the characteristics of candle combustion and define relevant terms including flashpoint, flashover, and firepoint. Examples of candle flashover (top, middle and bottom) will be shown and the factors that can lead to flashover described. Candle properties affecting flash over include wick characteristics, pot design, fragrance, wax characteristics and potential customer misuse (debris in candle, long burn etc.)http://www.exponent.com/about/news/archives/2004/02/#candles Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steph in tx Posted January 25, 2007 Share Posted January 25, 2007 I honestly believe it's mostly the consumer that helps cause the house fires. Some should have to pass a test in order to purchase anything related to fire. I do understand about people purchasing candles from name brand companies and thinking, "if it's made this way, it has to be o.k." It's not right, but it happens! We as candle makers have to educate consmers as much as possible. I personally have never had a candle turn torch on me, and I've tested and burned so many over the years. I'm not saying it can't happen, but if made correctly, it's highly unlikely. Maybe if mass produced or someone looking for money instead of perfection, it's highly likely! I believe if you work hard, test well, and do your homework, your candles will be fine. JMHO Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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