jeanie353

ok...I could not figure out how to type on my attachment....I take such horrible pics and the candle is not narrower at the bottom. It is much darker but I hear ya...gotta love cranberry. Now after seeing yours, I think I like the starburst better. I have no fireworks Does it wick the same as feather? I am hoping beyond hope that The Candlemaker's Store palm works like CS did. CSN 14 so far has been perfect on these. Or...if the wax is better I will pay shipping to get it elsewhere. I get my container wax imported all the way to WI from PA just because it is so worth it. I did do the upside down thing with the container palm I did. I did not have CSN wicks at the time but CDN did flare a bit. Not bad but enough that I was not comfortable with it quite yet. Most likely little pockets and not the wick so when I do go back to those over winter when things slow back down, I will try one with each wick to see if there is a difference. First time my daughter walked through seeing a candle cooling upside down she said....just when she thought she had seen it all opening the refrig to see more wax stuff than food. I have more kitchen utensils used for wax and B&B than cooking these days too.

Yep, I found it very hard to explain my wrecking, the residue, clumps and chunks. I will cut one of the ones I was going to remelt open to see what is in there. I may even cut one of the others that have no little air pockets on the bottom as a comparison. I've watched one too many flare ups on the container palm I've made (and put aside for a later time to retry) that I'm not comfortable letting a pillar go out for sale until I'm as positive as one can reasonably be that it won't flare. As you said, it only takes a few seconds and the turn of a head to miss it. It could cause a fire or not alert me that I had unknown air pockets. I will send some out to my testers because it will take me quite some time to test them all myself but I will admit I am a bit uneasy they will miss a flare up and think I mentioned that in a previous post. I'd love to know the exact temp the cranberry pillars hit the molds at because if I could duplicate that I'd do it in a heartbeat...whatever it took. Possibly the dark color as you said was enough but the pattern is much different than the others as well. I have time on my hands while I wait until next week to order a new case of container wax to make the fall scents so if I ever get off this darn computer and back to work I'll cut one or two open and post the pics whether they have air trapped or not... just for informational purposes.

I do/did not take them out of their molds until the next day. When one would accidentally partially slip out as I explained during the removed of the dust/particle type residue I did peek at it but realized when typing the post that maybe my palm should not be: a) either that solid at 5 hours or too solid on the outside but should have had liquid on the inside yet...actually anything but a material easily poked through. Other than handling them for bottom leveling and taking the two pics for this post they were put untouched into a china cabinet I keep my finished products in...in the area I work. I did burn one from each batch early to look for air pockets but the other ones won't be tested until later this week or weekend. I will be doing some and my testers will get the rest. Waiting the extra week + before testing the same batch pillars but after they have had a chance to harden was my line of thinking as well there could be a difference since I did read they get harder as they sit. I haven't noticed the pattern changing in any of them since they came out of the molds tho'. However, I was very pleased with the different patterns they did give me after completely removing from the molds after 24 hours. Before I burned those that I did, I hand polished them with a soft cloth just because I had to see how much sheen I could actually get on them. It was quite a difference from how they were out of the mold. The cranberry colored ones have a completely different pattern than the pumpkin color, the sage or the gold. They even have that shimmer affect. So cool. I believe I poured them all at the same temp. I know I let them all cool the same amount of time so why the fairly large variance with the one color I don't know but I love it. Maybe the deeper the color the more pattern? They are a deep cranberry color. The others patterned very nice as well just not shimmery with high peaking patterns. So then, thank you Stella for the reply. Since it wasn't mentioned, I am assuming the way I did do the relief was thorough enough to remove any human possibly found air pockets.

I used to use IGI 1260. The MP is 163. I was able to pour the gel fairly thin (fairly hot) over the embeds and had no melting. The embeds burned right along with the gel using zincs. If you are going to color your gel...it only takes a tiny little bit for gel to color. A toothpick works great if using liquid color. Just keep dipping it in until you get the color you like. If you want uniform for future or multiples of the same then I'd suggest to go by the drop. I'd suggest one drop at a time taking your stirring spoon to drizzle a little on a piece of paper or something. The color you see is the color it will stay unlike regular waxes that change as they cool. Oh, and you would want to pour slow which helps to prevent air bubbles. Also while stirring your gel the slower probably the better as too fast stirring will also cause air bubbles in the wax. You can get some or most of them out if it happens by putting the jar in the oven on a very low temp or sitting on a window ledge. Sometimes you want little air bubbles to look like it is under water. That is fine. If you get an air bubble void in the jar...that is not so good for burning and you may want to zap it with your heat gun from the outside of the jar to try to melt that out of there. And I forgot this....if you can, try to get your zinc wicks with a higher safety tab like 9mm.

I poke around and wreck the slight crust that forms until it gets to where I can feel it has formed on the bottom (top) of the mold. Then I leave it sit for about 5 hours on a 3x6" and come back and poke holes similar to a paraffin pillar but just a whole lot more area. I have a big circular hole after I'm done around the wick pin to way down in the pillar to almost the bottom (top) of the mold. At 5 hours it is really easy to poke yet. It is solid most of the time but not rock hard solid. There is a difference between the bottom (top) where it has solidified first and I cannot poke through it up to the top (bottom) where it is no longer liquid but not rock hard. While I'm poking and eventually getting a big hole around the wick pin there are lots of little crumbly pieces of palm that come out and are all over the top (bottom) of the candle in the mold. This is how I am saying it is solid but not rock hard solid. Of the bunch I've poured, I may get 1 or 2 where it has some liquid left at this 5 hour time. Which in itself is odd because they are all lined up on the same over rack, covered with the same type towels but it happens. When I poke at that 5 hour mark, I often...actually almost always will hear air escape as soon as that hole is poked as well as sometimes the next or the next. I pick up the pieces from poking all around, turn it over the melting pot to let all the pieces and residue laying on the top (bottom) fall off and out, heat the wax and fill the void or hole. When I fill it, it pours in and goes down in there real nice. I re-cover them and leave until the next day when I unmold them. Next time I make some I will take pictures of the poking that I have to show this crumbly residue and how easy it is to poke around in the solidified pillar. This wax my first 50 lbs of palm pillar that I bought off the classies. It was from CS and it was palm feather. Now I'm wondering when I get my next 50 lbs which won't be from CS since they no longer carry it if I will have the same crumbling as I did with the previous 50 lbs or if the wax was maybe old? I don't know but I do know I could easily poke a formed solid palm pillar at the 5 hourish mark. Now that I think about it, several times when I had the pillar over the top of the melting pot to get rid of the crumbles, the candle slid out of the mold. At the time I was excited because I got to take a peek at how it had formed to that point. Now I'm hearing maybe it should not have done that.

Yep, those are air spaces at the bottom by the edges. I am wrecking the bottoms about 1/2 of the way across. I wait about 4-5 hours before I begin so wax don't slush up through the holes and poke as far as the wax will let me. Usually I can still get almost or most of the way through at the 5 hour mark on 3" x 6" pillars. Do you think I should wreck farther across like almost to the edge? I've test burned one of each batch so far with no flare ups but I am so new at palm pillars if you think I should be wrecking farther out, I will surely do it. Leveling is quite the challenge sometimes. I have a little level I use each time I bring them off the griddle. It helped a lot when I began using a piece of contractor towels. It made for much less wax on the griddle so nothing drips down the pillar side when I pick it up. I will be remelting the pillars in the pics + a couple more but have 8 that look good enough to send out to my testers to be sure I'm not getting any air pockets. I do worry tho' that my testers may miss a short lived flare up which is why I wondered if I should wreck farther out.

Sorry for the hijack.

Off Topic

Oh darn...forgot to address this little bit of info for ya there Kawboy......I was not involved in any posts in the OT that is thought to be the reason the board went down.

Really? Ever hear of wickless candles? Oh yes, I do know what a gel candle is but the difference between you and I is that I don't get off on sarcasm or a knowledge contest. Let's say I am secure in my own skin enough to ask questions when needed and take constructive advice when given. A fast check of your previous posts show you obviously enjoy stirring the pot. Common sense says if you are going to make a quality candle you take every possible safety precaution for the buyer who does not follow directions or does not read directions and knows nothing of the dangers candles can create. Read my posts...you will find I just had a situation of a person who did not burn as directed. I changed my wick prime and I changed my neck tab way above normal standards because our buyers do what our buyers do sometimes. Sorry Sliver....I was typing during the time you put your post up.

My wisdom with gel does go way back. I did it for many years before working with soy and to the present working with my new waxes. Per your request for the benefit of the thread Stella, I will answer one right here. Never insert a wick in a candle not meant to be burned regardless if it is gel, soy, paraffin or palm. If our new member wants to give safety advice then he should get it right for the new people trying to learn the safe way. In fact I'll answer two...make that three....air gaps in gel candles can be dangerous as well as off center wicks.

Kawboy....If you are referring to my post, I am not in any click with anyone. I also have no desire to complain and have not until I nicely asked you...as a new person...to not be sarcastic. Trust me...I don't need you to make me feel better about myself. I simply would like the board to stay up and running which you most likely have no clue what I am talking about but I will leave it at that.

Yep Kawboy it is your thread but this forum has been here a long time and something you need to know is it is a friendly forum where criticism and smart remarks are rare and not taken well. You did answer a couple of my questions very nicely but at the same time it is disturbing to see animosity started with other members.

Thank you....she is currently using 44-36-18z x3. Those are taking some of the crust with it. If I remember right with zincs, the middle number is the rate of consumption making the 44-36 consume less than the 44-24? We had been re-thinking possibly a higher rate of consumption will help rather than hinder the crust melting more than she would like.

They burned me twice when I needed supplies to get orders out. It was about 2 years ago but that is one place I won't be going back to for anything!

I agree Stella....First, I did/do not want imperfections on my finished products. However, I could not get a perfect palm pillar bottom so I thought maybe this is normal for palm and I just need a label to cover the imperfections. I did also find running them across the griddle QUICK did work the best but on the ones where they were off in level more to one side or the other I'd put a tiny bit more pressure on that side as I slid them across. I also found putting a white contractor towel (the kind they pull out of the box to wipe their hands) has very little design in the towel and worked really good. It soaked up any liquid on the griddle yet gave me just enough liquid in the towel to slide the candle and fill in some of those little dips and voids. I would cut off any excess bumps and stuff with my Exacto (sp?) knife before I leveled then and then did set them down on the countertop right off the griddle to keep that bottom flat until they cooled completely. Counter clean up was a breeze with my plastic wax scraper and any thin residue came off with Awesome spray cleaner from the Dollar Store. I do tend to be self critical on my products and probably into the perfectionist area but I like the properties of palm so much I am going to get another 50 lbs and will most likely make these a part of my line. I do wick them to burn as luminaries rather than self consume and these were a breeze to wick unlike my containers that took 2 years of testing.

Welcome Rich....How generous of you to offer your expertise in the gel making aspect of candle making and your products look wonderful. I am working with a member here who is trying every which way to get a 5" candle pie to burn without either running over the sides or burning up the top edge of the crust. We have tried using (3) of the 44 series Z, 51z (1) 60z...none of which are producing results acceptable yet. Any advice on 5" candle pies and how to wick them? When I did them I used (3) 44z but this is not working for her. TIA Jeanne

Georgia...Thank you so much for your opinion and the label info. This is my 1st 50 lbs working with palm so I wasn't sure what was up with the bottoms of the pillars. I did do a 2nd pour on some of the indents and relief holes but filling in any farther in the areas like those showing on the pics caused the wax to run over the side of the pillar. I got sick of re-melting them and decided to put the question up here for opinion or suggestion. I should be able to find the scrapbooking template at Michael's or JoAnn Fabrics now that I know how to make/get the larger warning labels.

These 2 are the worst of the bunch.

Straight and to the point there Stella...lol. It never even crossed my mind but I'll go down in a bit to take a few pics and see if I can figure out how to upload them on here.

That is great news you are getting replacements. People have been reporting excellent customer service. I did email him once myself on how to put in my shopping cart the .99 sample pack and he responded within like 15 minutes via email. I wasn't going to discard the company as a possible source but I was going to hold off a bit on my order next week to see how this went and if anyone else came up with problems. I was just being cautious because it is a new with such great prices.

Geezeeee....I've got some ugly palm pillar bottoms going on here. I've leveled them on a pancake making square pan I found in the cabinet but some are not very pretty when done. I've looked around for 2-3/4" warning labels to cover the imperfections but can only find 2-1/2". I've got a few that have some tiny voids or imperfections close to the edge. If I level any further they are going to be 5" instead of 6" candles. Well, alright that was a stretch but just sayin.... So I'm calling out for the advice of any palm pillar makers if this is the nature of the beast and let it go or not so much? TIA Jeanne

soapbuddy.....thank you for the advice. I've done the research part so now all advice from those who actually work with CP is very much welcomed and appreciated.

Steve....Thank you and also thanks for the warning that even touching a wipe with raw batter will cause burns. I don't think I would of thought of that with it being second nature to grab a nearby paper towel to wipe hands quick. I've done it many, many times in candle making.