Changing wax C-3 or 464????

[001]

I haven't used C-3 in such a long time that I really can't remember. I think they are both good I just have had very nice results with the 464. The deciding factor may be if you want to color your candles or not.

I actually just saw this, 464 has good fragrance throw with the scents that it works with and so does c-3 but c-3 works with many, many more fragrances than 464 does. In fact out of the 400 or so fragrances I've tested in it I have had maybe 10 or so that did not throw at all and I have a catalog of around 300 I thought that the fragrance throw was "good" or "excellent."

[tam1116]

Thank you all for your comments. I will be testing both waxes.

[bart70]

Hi,

Just a quick clarification - Is the C-3 referd to here Naturewax C-3?

I have been reading this with interest as I am thinking of doing some testing with Naturewax and wanted to clarify that this thread is referring to the same wax.

Thanks,

Bart

[RichardLOZ]

Bart

Yes it is and I know where you are going to get yours from

I am also thinking of getting a sample of the C3 & possibly the C1 also to test. I am pretty happy with my 464 / palm combo, but like many have found there are a number of oils that it just does not work well in, and I think about the last 30 or so samples have all been in that category

I have a credit owning to me from the supplier so may use it to get the samples, as they dont have my jars right now. Their glassware is very well priced and is excellent quality as well. I have used their apothecary jars, which are a little larger than all the other suppliers have, in height not diameter, so they still work well for me, although I have to fill with about an extra 50 - 60 grams of wax, however the cheaper price of the jar offsets this to a large degree.

I have been very impressed with the quality of the jars I have purchased from them, and providing they can assure me of supply, may in fact change to them as my preferred supplier.

Cheers

Richard

[TallTayl]

I actually just saw this, 464 has good fragrance throw with the scents that it works with and so does c-3 but c-3 works with many, many more fragrances than 464 does. In fact out of the 400 or so fragrances I've tested in it I have had maybe 10 or so that did not throw at all and I have a catalog of around 300 I thought that the fragrance throw was "good" or "excellent."

After spending about 18+ months fiddling with 464 alone and in various blends (and not loving it), I finally tried C-3.

C-3, in my 2 week limited experience with it, is proving far easier to work with. Wanting to make an educated comparison I poured side by side uncolored containers of both 464 and C-3 using FO's I had previously liked in 464. In the test group, the CT, HT and appearance of C-3 is far better in the several FO's and containers I've tried. The HT is very strong after a short 24 hour cure and improves measurably by the day.

CD's and CDN's have been fabulous in the C-3. YMMV.

I wish I had listened to Stella and other C-3 evangelists and switched earlier.

[tam1116]

What percent of fo do you use. Do you have any jumping around with the cd wicks?

[TallTayl]

What percent of fo do you use. Do you have any jumping around with the cd wicks?

Not sure if this was being asked of me, but I'll share my experiences.

I started and stuck with 6% FO in C-3 and have been amply pleased with both CT and HT. Felt no need to go higher as this load in a 3 inch tin easily fills a room. I was testing two tins in my workshop last week and was surprised to smell them in a stair well 50 feet away at the other end of the building.

My workshop and home are both cold (62 degrees +/- a degree or two) and a bit drafty, so I have seen some wick dancing in the tins, but no sooting. Less dancing with the smaller of the two CDN wicks I'm using in the tins (CDN10 and CDN12). Trimming the wicks short eliminates any movement. ECO's and CD's in 464 and 464 plus 4633 blended behaved the same.

A CDN-12 in an 8 oz sq mason danced a little in the first 25% of the container, but settled as the candle burned further down. It is about 62 degrees in the room where that one was burning. Will be testing a CDN-10 in that same container starting today so I can compare. The CDN12 had a near perfect classic melt pool which I suspect in warmer weather will be too hot.

HTH

[Tribalvixen]

Richard and Bart I too am going to try C-3. I spoke to them on the phone and they seem very nice and happy to answer my questions...unlike others who either answer quickly and get me off the phone or are just pretty much rude. Goto love facebook for spreading the word around.

[moonshine]

Not sure if this was being asked of me, but I'll share my experiences.

I started and stuck with 6% FO in C-3 and have been amply pleased with both CT and HT. Felt no need to go higher as this load in a 3 inch tin easily fills a room. I was testing two tins in my workshop last week and was surprised to smell them in a stair well 50 feet away at the other end of the building.

My workshop and home are both cold (62 degrees +/- a degree or two) and a bit drafty, so I have seen some wick dancing in the tins, but no sooting. Less dancing with the smaller of the two CDN wicks I'm using in the tins (CDN10 and CDN12). Trimming the wicks short eliminates any movement. ECO's and CD's in 464 and 464 plus 4633 blended behaved the same.

A CDN-12 in an 8 oz sq mason danced a little in the first 25% of the container, but settled as the candle burned further down. It is about 62 degrees in the room where that one was burning. Will be testing a CDN-10 in that same container starting today so I can compare. The CDN12 had a near perfect classic melt pool which I suspect in warmer weather will be too hot.

HTH

Hi Talltayl

This is very interesting to me... Several others including myself are experiencing the opposite with different waxes- steady flame to start then dancing a quarter of the way thru

I have been using 464 and not completely satisfied tried the 415 and really like it- but same flickering with CD and CDN wicks

I tried C3 a while back and did like the hot throw- I may have to re- visist this myself!

I have read conflicting information on the C3- a couple sites claim 100%. Soy and others on the forum refer to it as a veggie wax... That was my only reason to not continue with testing- people around here want natural soy

But if it throws good and doesn't dance ( I use that same jar) it just might be my relief to all the migraines I have been getting! LOL

Thank you for sharing that information

[deb426]

Soy wax is hydrogenated vegetable oil so a 100% soy wax is a veggie wax.

[bart70]

Richard and Bart I too am going to try C-3. I spoke to them on the phone and they seem very nice and happy to answer my questions...unlike others who either answer quickly and get me off the phone or are just pretty much rude. Goto love facebook for spreading the word around.

Facebook is great for spreading the word....albeit good or bad by the looks of some of the popular Oz pages :rolleyes2

I have not spoken with the C-3 suppliers but by the sounds of it they are obliging which is a good start. In my testing I have found 464 and blends thereof to be ok, but I am still not impressed by it. I have dabbled in a very minor way with Ecosoya but just don't like it.....So having another alternative here in Oz is a blessing.

Richard - I was not sure if you knew of them or not....I recall hearing about them some time ago but did not realise they had competitive pricing on wax, or an alternate soy.

Am interested in giving some a try for sure......Still trying to get my head around the differences between C1 and C3 - Will start that discussion in a new thread though.

Cheers,

Bart

[RichardLOZ]

Richard and Bart I too am going to try C-3. I spoke to them on the phone and they seem very nice and happy to answer my questions...unlike others who either answer quickly and get me off the phone or are just pretty much rude. Goto love facebook for spreading the word around.

Hey there. I have bought glassware from them before, and also spoke to them regarding the Naturewax. Worth a shot I guess, perhaps 5 kg each of C1 & C3 and see how they go. Will be easier then buying 2 waxes to blend from 2 different suppliers. Anything to make life easy is good. Don't even get me started on that FB page, as I will get crazy.....LOL

Richard

[KoalaGirl]

Can someone help me out here please, since I'm clueless as to who you guys are talking about.

[minx]

I'm with you Koala, no idea who they are talking about though I know Candle Supply has the C3 wax, which I am considering buying today.

Question though, do htp wicks do any good with C3 in an 8oz tin?? I have quite a few of them and would be a shame to waste them.

[Tribalvixen]

candle supply is who I was refering to. They have some different glassware and they carry c1, c3 and a votive blend. FO are expensive they are in Sydney KG

[minx]

I noticed their FO wasn't cheap, but is it any good?

[bart70]

Can someone help me out here please, since I'm clueless as to who you guys are talking about.

Candle Supply in Sydney as I think was already posted. They are stocking Naturewax C-1 & C-3 so we now have a little more choice (and an option of another wax supplier) for soy waxes here in Australia. Not sure how long they have had it for but I recall thinking a while ago that I would like to try it but could not find an Australian supplier.

We now have a little more choice in waxes.....would like to see more choice in wicks but I guess you can't have everything!

If this wax is as popular as it appears to be in the US I think that Candle Supply will become a larger player in soy wax supply here.

Bart

[RichardLOZ]

Candle supply have been around for quite a while, however not in the small wholesale supplier market. They have typically supplied very large customers as well as producing their own range of candles, the brand which escapes me right now. I have had a number of conversations from them and have purchased jars, both being good experiences. I will try the wax and see how it compares to my current blend and then make some decisions, with one of the most critical being continuity of supply.....

Richard

[bart70]

I have had a number of conversations from them and have purchased jars, both being good experiences. I will try the wax and see how it compares to my current blend and then make some decisions, with one of the most critical being continuity of supply.....

Richard

Yep....Continuity of supply is a biggie that other other two still have not mastered yet, hopefully having been supplying larger customers previously, Candle Supply will know about how important it is to be able reliably supply. If their glassware is of good quality it will be a plus also. I am not buying glassware from the west anymore due to poor quality product. Most of them looked like 2nds and could only be used for testing as they were not of store quality.

Will be placing an order in the near future for some C-3 so will see how it goes. I still have a full test bench of 464 and different blends thereof currently burning so will be keeping my options open. I am keeping my fingers crossed that the issues I am trying to engineer out of 464 are not an issue with C-3.

Bart

[Sue]

To Bart and Richard, Just wondering if either of you have tested the C3 yet?....Would like to hear your thoughts before I buy some to test for myself. I usually buy from NCS but if I buy C3 from Candle Supply, plus glassware, the cost (including postage) is so much cheaper for me, only their fragrances are a bit more pricey.

[minx]

Bumping cause I'm interested in hearing how the testing is going too!

[bart70]

Hi Minx,

Actually a bit of a coincidence that I logged in and saw your post following on from our thread some months back. I have not been on for a few months and was pleasantly surprised to see the same thread running!

As I said - I have not been on for a few months as life and family basically got in the way of candle development for a while (mixed with a little frustration!!) so we have been concentrating on producing what we know and do well and put further development on hold for a while until I cleared my head, as well as built up more funding :smiley2:

I was having good results with C3 and found it easier to use than 464 up until I stopped development. I pretty well had adhesion, frosting/bloom and rough top issues sorted by pour temp/cooling process. HT was excellent in the FO's that I worked with. I had decided that I would continue with C3.

A few days ago I re-birthed my testing program and re-commenced some pours. Totally opposite season means a few adjustments to cooling process may be required and hopefully will be able to perfect that as I pour more testers. What I am currently pouring are for wick/HT/burn testing so will give me a chance to play with seasonal adjustments for cosmetics.

My frustration previously was with wicking and is not related to the wax (I believe) as I encounter it with other waxes. I get very different results using CDN wicks to those using the same overseas. There is speculation that one supplier of CDN wicks in Oz are having them made themselves and not actually selling CDN. If my issue continues I will source some from overseas and test for a differential.

As far as C3 wax goes, I found it much easier to work with than 464 (....but I was also a 464 novice). I found it much easier to 'work out' C3 and get good results than 464 overall.

I cannot say how you will find it....but I would say give it a go and see what you think. I started with a 5kg bag to experiment with before buying boxes.

HTH.

Bart

[blue]

I've gotten so much information off of this forum so I'd like to give back and tell my experience with 464 and then C3. This seems to be a topic of much interest. After testing several soy waxes, I settled on 464 and have been working with it for about 6 years. I've been selling for the past 2 years in my little shop (also my workshop) in the center of my town. 464 makes a beautiful candle, no wet spots, decent scent throw. However almost all fragrances will frost after a period of time and the post burn is ugly...but that's soy. I've also always gotten air holes and required a repour (tall jars). I've been able to control my environment (temperature, sunlight etc.) so far and have been selling a beautiful product. This summer I have been asked to wholesale my candles at one of my local "dream" locations! I'll not be able to control the environment and was very concerned about this. I just didn't trust 464 to keep looking nice. I'd been testing C3 from time to time with a little USA (so Thanks, Stella for the recommendation!) and was pleased with the results. So this wholesale stress has made me step up my C3 testing full force and I am so happy with the results. I am getting a nice white candle, no wet spots or frosting, great scent throw, much improved after-burn appearance, and best of all NO holes. Every FO I have tried ( nearly all my Fall scents) has worked beautifully in this wax. I always knew I'd like to switch waxes one day (and was dreading it!) because 464 was good, but not quite what I was hoping for. I'm really liking the C3.