So what is the proper way to extinguish a fire?

[EricofAZ]

Ok, so candle wax fires are pretty spectacular at times. Water, in small quantities, steams and throws the oil into the air with the flame. Bad.

What is best to extinguish a candle fire?

Its one thing to say "don't use water" on the warning label, but I'd like to say what the person should use.

CO2? That cools, but it also tends to blow hard and spread the wax.

Powder? I understand there are several kinds of powder extinguishers that can be purchased. Powder is recommended for electrical fires. Powders don't tend to blow has hard out of the nozzle, they just move the O2 away without any cooling action. But I think they don't spread the wax as much.

Thoughts?

Edited October 11, 2010 by EricofAZ

[candlesprite7]

If it's a small fire you can use a lid to cut off the air flow.

[Stella1952]

Same as for a grease fire. Smother it with a lid or metal pot large enough to fit over it. Leave the lid in place until the whole thing has cooled down, lest it reignite.

[EricofAZ]

I'm thinking more in terms of a warning label. It is fine to tell someone what not to do "Don't extinguish with water." But I think a warning label should be in the positive, ie, tell people what they should do.

[EricofAZ]

I found it. When in doubt, read the directions.

Astorlite J223 =

EXTINGUISHING MEDIA:

Carbon dioxide, dry chemical or fine water spray. Avoid water stream on molten burning material as it may scatter and spread the fire.

Candlewic's Smooth Pillar Blend =

5. FIRE FIGHTING MEASURES

Extinguishing Media: Small fires: CO2 or dry chemical

Large fires: Foam

Candlewic's Soy125 =

SECTION IV - FIRE AND EXPLOSION HAZARD DATA:

Flash Point: Above 6000FFire Point: Above 6750F

Extinguishing Media: Foam, Dry Chemical, CO2

Special fire fighting procedures: Avoid use of water in

extinguishing fires.

I read a bunch more and it looks like Powder (dry chem) or CO2 are the preferred. Foam for larger fires.

So I'll have on my labels "In case of wax fire, extinguish with Dry Powder or CO2 Extinguisher, do NOT use water."

I also put on my labels www.candles.org/safety.html

I doubt that anyone has a foam extinguisher at home. Most of the available are dry powder or CO2.

Edited October 11, 2010 by EricofAZ

[CareBear]

don't give specific advice - you don't need the liability.

[dnj]

Baking soda

[Karen M]

I agree with dnj, baking soda.

[mrsadler05]

I know you can't spray or splash water into this type of flame, but would it be safe to cover the candle with a wet towel to try to suffocate the flame? I have been thinking of what to do personally since I am now in the test burn phase.

[EricofAZ]

I think we have two lines of thought in this thread. One about how best to put out a fire and the other about liability and labels. That's fine. Both are of interest to me.

I'm not a fire fighter, however, I have had some training for aviation and nautical fires. One day when I was flying a helicopter, I had a radio explode and light fire to the instrument panel so I've also experienced the situations (and I burned my room down when I was a kid, by accident).

Anything that lowers the temperature and/or removes the oxygen (preferably both) should extinguish a fire. Wax and oil can re-light easily if they remain hot and the O2 is re-introduced (smothering then removing the towel, etc). Water stream into the molten wax does not cool fast enough because the water steams at 212 degrees and the wax fire is much hotter, thus taking the liquid and vapor wax and expanding it with the steaming water - POOF!

As for the legalities, I think warning labels need to be effective. There is ample reason to warn against using water (despite the one wax company above that correctly points out that a mist of water is beneficial).

What bothers me is that everyone has water and thinks of water right away since we see it on every firefighter show on TV. Not everyone has a fire extinguisher or smoke alarm and if I tell these folks that they can't use the one thing they have, well, then what?

By providing the website, and warning and giving options, I think the label becomes a better label. I would be interested in the opinion of any attorney that disagrees with this, or anyone who wrote a better label and had it go against them.

Edited October 12, 2010 by EricofAZ

[chuck_35550]

The automatic response is to pick it up and do something with it like put it in the sink or take it outside. A really good way to get some serious burns; I might re-think adding a warning about not picking up a hot burning jar. The bottom line in civil law is that anybody can sue you for any reason at any time but that have to show you are negligent in some way and that they have been damaged in some way. Hey Stella! Where you been hiding?

Steve

[EricofAZ]

Right, there has to be negligence to make the suit stick. Negligence has 4 parts. Duty, breach, causation and damages.

My warning does say not to move the candle while lit and wait for it to cool.

Stella is around, she had the skin grafts. Wickipedia has some interesting stuff about that McDonald's Coffee Case and I checked it out, they got it right. 700 prior burn victims? Whoa! But I digress.

[Stella1952]

Hey Steve! I gotta job I hate that is taking too much of my god-given time on the planet for WAY too little money, but I'm always around.

Stella is around, she had the skin grafts.

Ummm... wrong Stella. :laugh2:Maybe some minor face lifting could be helpful, but no skin grafts needed... YET!

I think THE Stella of the infamous coffee-spilling case may have passed on to the Golden Arches in the sky - she'd be 97 this year... Here's Stella Liebeck's REAL story... http://www.stellaawards.com/stella.html

Edited October 12, 2010 by Stella1952

[mrsadler05]

Eric,

Thanks for the info about the candle re-igniting if reintroduced to oxygen too quickly. I forgot about that. My original thought was to try to suffocate the flame with a wet towel giving me time to gather myself and figure out how to use my fire extinguisher if necessary.

I am glad you posted this becuae it actually mnade me go find my fire extinguisher and read the directions so I am better prepared if I ever need it.

Instead of trying to fit all of the information on a tiny warning label that most people will ignore, what about printing an informative flyer? You could include all fo the great features about your candles, contact info to buy more candles and then the warning and fire hazard websites.

Yes, you would have to be consistent and include one with every purchase, but that is simple and inexpensive enough to do.

[CareBear]

Cautionary Labeling Standard

Reference #: ASTM F-2058

Effective Since: 2000 Revised October 2007

This standard sets forth specifications for the warning label that cautions consumers to always burn a candle within sight; to keep candles away from things that can catch fire; and to keep candles out of the reach of children.

Reference title: Standard Specification for Candle Fire Safety Labeling

http://www.candles.org/industry.html

Personally, I'd follow the ASTM specs. I'll see if I can get a copy of it from work.

[scifichik]

One way to NOT put out a fire (particularly if it's a pizza igniting in an electric oven) is to through the canister of flour in the oven, followed by a good dose of water from the garden hose dragged through the back door into the kitchen.

Just ask my husband and teenage son, both of whom I stupidly left alone to their own devices one evening for a ladies' church event.

"But what will we have for dinner?" was their lament, to which I replied, "Put a pizza from the freezer in the oven."

Obviously, I failed them miserably, for I failed to remind them TO REMOVE THE CARDBOARD before they placed said pizza in the oven.

The local fire department thought the entire arrangement was quite humorous. When I arrived home, I found it not so funny.

After all the smoke was cleared and the firemen gone away, teenage son sheepishly says, "Hey---what are we gonna have for dinner anyway?"

The paramedics were called in shortly after that question.

[EricofAZ]

I always wondered why frozen pizza tasted like cardboard. Now I know.

Ok, national guidelines are good and following them is good. So is following the wax manufacturer's recommendations. Looks like candles.org has a suggestion to add manufacturer guidelines in addition to the three basic rules. http://www.candles.org/safety_label.html

I think printing the candles.org website url on the label is a good idea for those who want to learn more.

To me, leaving out anything from the national standards is bad. Adding more information should be helpful, I would think.

Edited October 13, 2010 by EricofAZ