Palm Wax

[TxSioux]

How would yall rate Palm Wax for throw? Better than soy, but less than paraffin? I've tried just about everything but Palm & don't find too many posts that address the throw. I'm leaning towards Glass Glow, which is described as having an 'exceptional' throw. Does that mean exceptional when compared to all waxes, or exceptional compared to other palms? Also, do most fo's work well in palm, or is it a crapshoot, like soy?

Thank for any insight -- Susan.

[cybersix]

For me it rates around 8, on a 0 - 10 base.

Way better than soy. It's really reliable in throwing, sometimes it seems better than paraffin.

And every FO I used it's a winner.

Give it a try, and you'll see for yourself! Happy testing!

[bugtussle]

Susan, I use the Robnat 1230 from Taylored. I add 5% steric. Even though it is a pillar wax, I can pour it in containers. I think its hot & cold throw are comparable with my paraffin/soy blends, 6006 & 223.

I do not wreck the tops of my candles and double pour. If you pour really hot and cool slowly, I don't get the large voids/caverns that so many talk about. It is a feather/crystal palm. When you go to DFW, you can pick it up and save the frt. Carole

[WendyByTheBay]

I love palm. I was able to have them sitting out side during the warmer months without having to worry about them getting soft before the end of a show. I have used both palm and 6006 and I think they both throw great!

Like Carol said, have them cool slow and you won't have to repour.

[Stella1952]

In general, I think palm wax throws equally well as compared to good soy wax, but, like soy, there are some scents that it seems more suited. Scents that do not do as well in soy, most notably citrus or sharp herbal scents, seem more accurate in palm. Bakery scents seem to do better with soy.

Soy has a better, longer lasting CT than does palm wax. After a period of time, it's hard to smell palm wax - it's like the outside hardens and locks the fragrance inside. If one rubs the bottom of a pillar, the CT is there. When burned, the HT is right there, but the CT fades after a few weeks. The addition of soy to palm wax enhances the CT properties, which I have noted when I make hurricanes. HTH

[Candybee]

I work with parrafin, soy, and palm and its been my experience that parrafin and palm are the easiest to get an excellent H&C throw. I can get soy to throw well too but it took me a lot more fussing, testing, and research. I find each wax has their own set of pros and cons.

Having said that, I am currently using palm and love its scent throw, beautiful crystal patterns, and its easy ability to color. I also don't get wet spots because of great glass adhesion. It seems like a dream but palm wax has its cons too. Because of the crystalization process you need to release air pockets that form inside the candle, around the wick or near the top as it cools. At first I wondered if I wanted to continue doing all this work making palm candles. But then I got better at it and hopefully more efficient. I love working with palm but it can be trying. Another problem with palm is a great many customers are not familiar with the wax and believe only soy is a 'natural' wax. So you need to have patience and an ability to educate potential customers about palm wax.

So far I have yet to find a FO that does not throw well in palm. But I have had similar luck working with parrafin. Parrafin takes fragrance well and most FOs I put in my parrafin threw very well.

What I like about soy is how 'homey' some fragrances smell in the burning candle. Its hard to put a finger on it but some scents smell like they were custom made just for soy.

[CandleLadyBusiness]

I haven't personally used palm or purchased to make , but love the look of it for sure.. it is beautiful.. the candles I am selling now contain palm soy veggie blend and I tell you , no more ugly looking candles.. beautiful look before and after burn.. this can not be achieved with all soy.. so I am glad I found this line..

Diane Mumm

[lsbennis]

I haven't personally used palm or purchased to make , but love the look of it for sure.. it is beautiful.. the candles I am selling now contain palm soy veggie blend and I tell you , no more ugly looking candles.. beautiful look before and after burn.. this can not be achieved with all soy.. so I am glad I found this line..

Diane Mumm

Just curious...are you making the candles that you now sell or are you getting them from someone else?

[TxSioux]

Thanks all -- great info & makes me more excited about giving this a shot! Several of you mentioned adding steric or soy -- will this reduce the wax pattern? I only make containers & Dixie Cup votives ... I so hate molds! I definitely want the pretty palm pattern, but I'm really more interested in the throw! Carole - I may give you a call to pick your brain.

Susan.

[CandleLadyBusiness]

I no longer make candles, just am a candle distributor now, much easier for me personally..

[Stella1952]

Several of you mentioned adding steric or soy -- will this reduce the wax pattern? I only make containers & Dixie Cup votives ... I so hate molds!

Stearic acid aids with mold release. If you want the showiest crystals, using a metal or glass mold results in the best crystals because they are rigid and very smooth. Paper doesn't have a smooth surface. Thin plastic will allow movement of the mold as the wax contracts and also doesn't hold up well to the high temperature that encourages the best crystal formation with palm wax.

Remember that even when making little votives, you need to release the air trapped inside as the wax crystallizes. I see so MANY really badly made palm wax votives because people do not bother to do this. eBay is FULL of them!! Allowing voids to form/remain in the interior of a candle is a safety hazard that should be taken very seriously by ANYONE who pours palm wax products.

Adding soy varies the pattern until, at higher amounts, the palm wax loses the pattern altogether. It enhances COLD throw somewhat but doesn't affect hot throw. Since you are making little candles, it's easy to test this all kinds of ways to discover what works best for you. Have fun!

[TxSioux]

Good info, Stella - Thanks! I was concerned about the palm pouring temp & the Dixie Cups. I think the highest I've poured in them was about 175 & I was worried they wouldn't hold up. May have to re-think that one!

Susan.

[ladysj]

Stearic acid aids with mold release. If you want the showiest crystals, using a metal or glass mold results in the best crystals because they are rigid and very smooth. Paper doesn't have a smooth surface. Thin plastic will allow movement of the mold as the wax contracts and also doesn't hold up well to the high temperature that encourages the best crystal formation with palm wax.

Remember that even when making little votives, you need to release the air trapped inside as the wax crystallizes. I see so MANY really badly made palm wax votives because people do not bother to do this. eBay is FULL of them!! Allowing voids to form/remain in the interior of a candle is a safety hazard that should be taken very seriously by ANYONE who pours palm wax products.

Adding soy varies the pattern until, at higher amounts, the palm wax loses the pattern altogether. It enhances COLD throw somewhat but doesn't affect hot throw. Since you are making little candles, it's easy to test this all kinds of ways to discover what works best for you. Have fun!

Stella do you mind telling me how you release the air in yours. I have been giving the containers a good stir & I'm test burning it now so far no problems with air holes that I can tell.

[Candybee]

Stella do you mind telling me how you release the air in yours. I have been giving the containers a good stir & I'm test burning it now so far no problems with air holes that I can tell.

The crystalization process occurs as the wax cools so stirring the wax in the candle isn't the same. I can see the first signs of air pockets forming when the top layer is already hardened. You can see the pockets if you move the candle slightly it looks just like water moving around inside just under the top layer only its an air pocket.

You have to break thru the top layer and poke around the wick several times while the candle is cooling to release the air pockets.

Stella has a much better way of explaining it but I think you get part of the picture here. She calls it wrecking. Anyway once you are done poking you can either do a repour to level the top off or use a heat gun to level it.

[Stella1952]

Stella has a much better way of explaining it but I think you get part of the picture here. She calls it wrecking. Anyway once you are done poking you can either do a repour to level the top off or use a heat gun to level it.

Candybee explained it just fine with fewer words! However, someone else coined the term "wrecking" - I never really knew WHAT to call it... I stir more than I poke.

[snewbie]

I found it easiest to poke the top after my votives have half way cooled. After a few more minutes, I poke through the same holes again and then pour my wax about a millimeter or 3 above the original level. There will be some bubbling as the wax fills in the voids. The heat gun is my worst enemy when it comes to palm wax or stearic acid candles because it ruins the crystals. They never from back right again.

[Stella1952]

They never from back right again.

Until the candle is burned. The top will crystallize differently after burning anyway, regardless of heatgunning or repouring. Repours often run down between the candle & the mold causing untold consternation in demolding and in the appearance. There's no one right or wrong way to do this - just make sure you release the air bubbles and all will be well.

[snewbie]

I havent had a problem with repouring since I dont wait until the candles have cooled enough to pull away from the mold.

The only easy thing in this whole candle business for me has been those beeswax and palm votives. I feel like I could make a 1000 per day if I had enough molds and space!!!

Edit; I am using crystal brite Palm wax PB poured at 195F in unheated votive molds cooled in a 65F room.

Edited March 8, 2010 by snewbie