inherowndominion Posted February 9, 2010 Share Posted February 9, 2010 Hello all! I'm having a problem with soy...I'm using 1.5 oz ppw (when I use less than that, it doesn't seem to throw well at all! The 1.5 oz seems to be the power number for this scent). It's 100% soy by the way.I'm using a 16oz jj and an HTP 1212 wick, with a hyacinth FO. It's cured and throwing great, BUT...The flame is just WAY too high for my liking. Yet, it's not getting a full melt pool at 3 hours, yet the wax depth is really deep, way more than 1/4"! The HTP 126 didn't do the job either, way too much hang up.(Sorry for the pictures, I'm so bad at taking pictures!)Ok, here is the candle burning, it's the 3rd burn, I've trimmed the wick (1/4") before burning, at this is right before I blew it out (at the 3 hour mark) You can see the crazy melt depth too[ATTACH]18830[/ATTACH]Next is when I blew it out, you can see the hang up on the side there...[ATTACH]18831[/ATTACH]I would think that the flame being so big would be caused from the wick being too big, yet if I use smaller wick, the throw is affected AND it leaves so much hang up.Anyone have any suggestions on this? Thanks!!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stella1952 Posted February 9, 2010 Share Posted February 9, 2010 What wax are you using? There are many "100% soy" waxes, all with different burn properties...Is that a 16 oz wide mouth canning jar? If so, I am familiar with that container, but it really helps to include an inside diameter when asking questions because it's hard for everyone to remember the dimensions of every jar on the market! Yet, it's not getting a full melt pool at 3 hours, yet the wax depth is really deepIt's pretty much at FMP. Your candle has hangup on one side because the melt pool is off-center. You have to keep the HEAT of the wick centered in your container or the candle will burn hotter on one side than the other. This will not only cause the cooler side to have hangup and the hotter side to be too hot, it also contributes to sooting.If I am looking at a wide mouth canning jar, that burn looks accelerated for a 3rd burn @ 3 hours to me - looks like it's burned down about 2" into the container. Because the 16 oz. mason is deeper than it is wide, a wick that's a little too hot at the start can really heat up the container as it burns down into the jar. A 1/4" deep MP on soy is not normal - usually I shoot for around 1/2". Much more than that generally indicates that the wick is too hot. To give you an idea, I use 8 oz. wide mouth canning jars, identical except for the depth. By the 3rd 3 hour test burn, mine would have burned down maybe 1/2" into the container. I think yours is burning too fast.I don't use the same wicks as you do, so I can't offer any suggestions for HTPs. I use a CDN 12-14 for that container at 1 oz. FO pp. If I couldn't get a good HT at 1 oz. PP, I'd change something (wax, additive, wick) because that just raised one of the most expensive ingredients in my candle by 50%. Hyacinth is generally a slightly delicate floral, so I would expect to give it a little extra curing time before I tested it for HT... Using extra may help with HT (to an extent) but you may not like what you will sacrifice in burn quality. FO is a major contributor to burning problems and frosting, so using more is NOT the best idea. Try to use as little as possible and still have a pleasing throw. If you have any CDs laying around, pour a tester with a 12 & a 14 and see how they work for ya. HTH Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
inherowndominion Posted February 9, 2010 Author Share Posted February 9, 2010 Stella, thanks!No it's not a wide mouth, it's a regular mouth jelly jar 16 oz. I believe the only difference between that and a standard mason jar is that the jelly jar has smooth sides and more of shoulder. But the diameter is the same I believe.I tried adjusting the FO and couldn't get a throw .7oz per pound all the way (in .1 increments) to 1.4 oz per pound (yes, I know, I'm anal LOL) but once it hit 1.5 oz pp, it threw! I changed nothing else, go figure!So do I need to off center the wick? I'm using a wick setter which puts it right in the middle of the jar so I thought it would be fine, but I guess not!I think I may have some CD's laying around. So I may try that and see what happens.I cured them all for 2 weeks, I generally pour a bunch of candles all at the same time in different wick sizes and FO amounts, etc, so I can compare side by side. Then let them all cure so they are ready for testing at the same time. And if none of them are a go, I start all over again. I know it's wasteful, but it's easier for me that way. I'm still kind of new at this.I think it's burning too hot too, the flame is just way too high. But I was miffed cause the 126 didn't cut it! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stella1952 Posted February 9, 2010 Share Posted February 9, 2010 (edited) No it's not a wide mouth, it's a regular mouth jelly jar 16 oz. I believe the only difference between that and a standard mason jar is that the jelly jar has smooth sides and more of shoulder. But the diameter is the same I believe.Measure, please. I've never seen a 16 oz. standard jelly jar...You certainly have gone to a lot of trouble with that FO - perhaps it's the FO and not your wax? Have you tried the same scent from another supplier?Again, what wax is this? Some waxes DO need extra FO generally...A quick way to test is to put a scoopful of wax from a candle with no HT (but decent CT) in an electric melter (NOT one with a flame!) and see if it throws. If it does, the problem isn't with the wax or the FO - it's something else.Wick setters center wicks great. But that does not insure that the HEAT from the wick will be evenly distributed. Watch the candle and turn it a quarter turn every so often if you see the melt pool becoming off center. You can also poke the base of the wick in the direction of the cooler side to help center the heat. You can also twist the wick so the heat rotates as it burns. CDs & CDNs burn off-center because of their self-trimming stance. I don't set the wicks off-center because it looks like hell. Twisting solves the problem for the most part for me and I have not noticed this causing any change in the burn properties of the wick. Edited February 9, 2010 by Stella1952 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
inherowndominion Posted February 9, 2010 Author Share Posted February 9, 2010 I'm sorry, I'm using EZ soy. I forgot to answer that last time.Here are the measurements of the jar:5.3 inches talloutside diameter is 3"The HTP's tend to dip to bend as well, I think they are self trimming, and this one has bent too, I find that desirable most of the time cause it seems when the burn is perfect the HTPs bend a little and almost never mushroom for me at all. Maybe I'll try giving it a twist and see if that helps. How would you tell a customer to do that, or wouldn't you? Would you just offset it by tipping the base as you said?I've used that same FO in tarts, and it works GREAT. But, it does take slightly more than usual to scent the tart wax too. But I LOVE the fo, it's only true hyacinth I've found, all the others I've tried give me a serious headache (I am not a huge floral fan to begin with). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stella1952 Posted February 9, 2010 Share Posted February 9, 2010 OK. I rummaged in my cabinet and found a standard pint mason... I'd try a CD or CDN 12 to start...Maybe I'll try giving it a twist and see if that helps.The wick is twisted before pouring. Can't do it later.Would you just offset it by tipping the base as you said?"Tipping the base"? Read back... I didn't say that! I'm not entirely sure what you mean, but it sounds like you are talking about burning the candle on an unlevel surface or something - if so, no, I wouldn't do that nor recommend it! How would you tell a customer to do that, or wouldn't you? As far as telling customers how to burn a candle, most preprinted warning labels I have seen refer to keeping the wick centered. What they SHOULD say is to keep the MELT POOL centered... This is just a normal part of candle maintenance like wick trimming or fishing trash out of the melt pool. I provide instructions and burning tips. Customers will either read and follow the instructions or not... not my job to hold their hands through life. My job is to make a candle that's reasonably safe even if they ignore the instructions.I've used that same FO in tarts, and it works GREAT. But, it does take slightly more than usual to scent the tart wax tooSo this particular FO is NOT a great thrower... Try different wicking, but realize that some FOs just do not work very well in candles... You may need to simply offer this one in tarts only. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Candybee Posted February 9, 2010 Share Posted February 9, 2010 That doesn't look like a jelly jar to me. I make candles in JJ and they are straight sided. That jar looks like a bulb type jar-- it flairs out as you go down the jar. So you may have to wick for the wide section of the jar. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
inherowndominion Posted February 9, 2010 Author Share Posted February 9, 2010 "You can also poke the base of the wick in the direction of the cooler side to help center the heat"That's what I was referring to when I said base (have no idea how to use the quote function on here, lol, Im tech stupid LOL!), sorry, shoulda been more clear But that makes sense to me....and twist the wick BEFORE, can't do it while it's burning, got it! Thanks, I'll try that. And I'll try the CDs too, pretty sure I have some...I KNOW I have some LX wicksThe place I ordered it from said it's a jelly jar. I want to say I got them from Candles and supplies, http://newcart.candlesandsupplies.com/Store/Products/Candles/PID-MJ-16.aspx?VariantID=10 There's the link, pretty sure those are jelly jars?I might have to offer it in tarts only, that sucks though cause I LOVE it, it smells just like real hyacinth! I'll give it one more go with twisting the wicks and using CD's (maybe even LX) and make a decision then. I don't mind having to use more FO for one or two candles if they are good sellers, but I don't wanna make it a rule cause it IS expensive! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blt212 Posted February 9, 2010 Share Posted February 9, 2010 I use that jar and also get them from Candles & Supplies.....I don't use your wax but I use anywhere from an ECO8-ECO12 in most FO's in that jar. I've also used a CD18 successfully on really hard to wick FO'sHTH Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soy327 Posted February 9, 2010 Share Posted February 9, 2010 Stella, Can you explain more about twisting the wick? Does it help your wick stay straiter when burning?Linda Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Judy, USMC Posted February 10, 2010 Share Posted February 10, 2010 Stella, Can you explain more about twisting the wick? Does it help your wick stay straiter when burning?Linda - here's a link to read that explains the method. It doesn't keep the wick straighter.http://www.craftserver.com/forums/showthread.php?t=70030&highlight=twist Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soy327 Posted February 10, 2010 Share Posted February 10, 2010 (edited) Judy, Thanks I finally found it. I posted on the thread so It came up on the other forum. I get it, as the candle burns the wick kinda rotates and gets a more even melt pool.LindaJust read the link you posted and it was not the same as the one I found but it explained it well. Thanks again. Edited February 10, 2010 by soy327 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.