Quick help please...

[Lexi]

Hi all. I am new to this forum although not new anymore to soaping.

Anyway, I am making a creamsicle soap for a customer and the fragrance oil has a low (135 f) flashpoint. She wanted the soap sooner and so I did cphp. I let the soap cool to 10 degrees lower than the flashpoint before adding but the soap turned out a bit crumbly. Not only that but the fragrance is a bit weak. Sigh. So...I have enough of this particular FO to make ONE more batch. What should I do? Should I rebatch and add more FO? ( I have never rebatched before so I would need help especially since the flashpoint is so low) Should I just make a room temp or lower temp cp and ask her to wait? Should I make another cphp batch and just add the FO whenever? What would YOU do? Help please please please!!!

[PixieWick]

i would REALLY love to help .. but that whole post you made .. is like another language to me :laugh2:

didnt understand any of it .. mainly cause i dont do anything with soap other than M&P an even then its been 3 yrs since i did.

I hope you get this figured out soon ...

[Lexi]

LOL! I appreciate your reading it anyway. I wonder if others will find my post confusing too...Hmmm! I may have to actually SPELL things out, huh?

[bugtussle]

Pixie, why would you post in a cp/hp forum when you have no answers?:rolleyes2

Lexi, I don't think Flash Point of FO has any relevance to CP or HP. Flash point refers to point at which FO will igniite if exposed to open flame. Someone correct me if I am wrong. Carole

[Lexi]

Carole,

Its hard because I have read SUCH contradicting info. I realize its not going to ignite or anything in my soap BUT I worry about evaporation. Is it going to completely evaporate out? I guess I should have just bought an extra bottle of the fo and played with it first...

[chrisinpa]

If it was me, I would re-batch it in a cooking bag and add a little more fo.

I used this method on a botched batch and it came out so creamy smooth!

here is a link to some info on it

http://www.craftserver.com/forums/showthread.php?t=74356&highlight=bag

[PixieWick]

i posted because i wanted to ..

[Carrie]

PixieWick, it seems to me that posting just to up your post count isn't productive and sometimes, the number of responses to a help thread will keep experienced soapers from opening the thread, assuming it's been taken care of.

Is this the response you were trying to delete?

[IndulgentCreations]

Lexi, I don't think Flash Point of FO has any relevance to CP or HP. Flash point refers to point at which FO will igniite if exposed to open flame. Someone correct me if I am wrong. Carole

Carol, you are correct. Has nothing to do with the scent burning off or out of soap. I'd say most likely it's just a weak scent in soap, you may have to use more. I have some that are perfect at 1 oz PPO and I have others I have to adjust up or down. If you have a limited supply, I'd probably do the rebatch so you can make it stronger. If you do another batch with the same FO amount, you'll most likely get the same result. HTH

[PixieWick]

no i wasnt trying to delete this one ..

i'm sorry if its got people mad at me

I was just trying to be nice an a bit funny .. and say that i hope she gets it figured out

i wasnt trying to "up my numbers" like i have time to care about that ..

i was just trying to be nice sorry

[Lexi]

April- Fantastic! Thank you for clarifying what Carole was trying to tell me. (I have awful preggo brain, lol) I will just rebatch then. I just got the bags I needed so I hope this works...Hopefully my soaps will come out as nicely as the tutorials. Wish me luck!

Pixie wick- I appreciated the laugh honestly. I have been so frustrated by trying to figure out what to do that your first post actually made me smile and relax.

[SliverOfWax]

i posted because i wanted to ..

I'll post because I want to, too. I don't do soap and I have zero soap answers.

What I will say is I agree 100% with bug and Carrie. It is never productive to post just to see yourself post. And what's even worse than posting for no apparent reason is to post incorrect information and/or assumptions. I have seen people heading toward disaster in chandling because someone who didn't have a clue posted just to see themselves post.

I guess the bottom line is if you can't help with answers derived from experience, you could be doing a great deal of damage. Lye is involved here and if you don't know lye and the horrendous damage it can do if bad information is given, it's probably best to go to a section you do know and only respond if you know the answer.

That's my response and I'm sticking with it!

[PixieWick]

Pixie wick- I appreciated the laugh honestly. I have been so frustrated by trying to figure out what to do that your first post actually made me smile and relax.

and my work here is done :tiptoe:

[HelenW]

How much FO did you use PPO? I recently did CP soap with Tony's Orange/Vanilla FO (Creamsicle) and was a bit disappointed in the scent at the beginning of the cure, but it has started to come back and I am happy with the scent now. :yay: Maybe your scent is a fader and then will reappear?

[Lexi]

Helen- I used .7 ppo...It smelled so strong at first that I was sure it would be lovely and then it went weak. I didnt do the rebatch last night but I will be working on that today. I will keep everyone updated!

[deb12c]

I have a question while we are on the subject...

So what you guys are saying is that if your flash point is low on a fragrance, then you would probably need to add more in your soap for a strong scent? And if it is high then you would add less? I'm still kind of new to soaping, less than a year. I know it depends on how strong the fragrance is, but it this 'basically' correct?

[bugtussle]

In my limited experience with CP, the Flash Point has nothing to do with how well the FO sticks in CP. Carole

[jbren]

Carole is correct.

While some fragrances do lose their scent if added to too hot soap...that is not flashpoint. Most of our soaps get to higher temperatures during gel but they don't ignite.

The technical definition of flashpoint is:: the lowest temperature at which the vapor of a combustible liquid can be ignited in air

That's why flashpoint is much more important to chandlers than soapers.

edited to add: the bolding of the word flashpoint it because I did a search and copied and pasted the information which I originally posted elsewhere.

[deb12c]

Thanks Carole and jbren

[CareBear]

wow, I go out of town and miss a discussion on flash point. Absolutely it has nothing to do with the stability of a fragrance oil. first off, as april, jbren & carole pointed out - the definition makes that clear. and second, once you make a mixture with the FO it's the MIXTURE that has a whole new flash point...

you might concern yourself with the temp at which it evaporates, but even THAT is totally changed by making it a mixture.

what was the supplier of the FO? and exactly what FO was it? that matters a lot.

deb - some will swear to a connection - and that they have to soap cool with a low FP FO or some such stuff, but if they truly IS a correlation it's tenuous - and more likely coincidence or perhaps related to the FO components (perhaps less stable components/FOs tend to have lower FPs?). Cause we all know that FOs for use in soap need to be formulated to stand up to the rigors of soaping - temps, pH, etc. So deb, what we are saying is that the FP does NOT tell you if or how or at what level to use and FO.

I've been over this with the perfumers I work with, and our technical people (the perfumers either think of themselves as chemists or artists) and they tell me the same thing over and over.