soap expirations and grapefruit seed

[Jo Ann]

as long as one doesn't use something like canola oil, how long does soap usually last before it expires. i also read in several places that using grapefruit seed extract is a preservative, but none of the sources gave the amount.

i usually use lard, OO, CO, castor oil as the sap oils, and then super fat with say grapeseed oil or sweet almond or something like that as well as adding aloe vera gel 100% and of course EOs

i would hate to sell and give soap away and it turns out that there should have been an expiration date on it somewhere.

[soycrazy]

Soap doesn't expire it's still soap even if the scent disappears. Unless you get DOS then I think it's garbage if I remember right, maybe someone can correct me on that Why shouldn't I use canola oil? I use it all the time and haven't had any problems. I use gse in my salves, balms and for my pets & myself, but not for soap you don't need a preservative in soap. I have read that GSE does cause acceleration though.

[Jo Ann]

ok, thanx...i read somewhere, that soap has a shelflife, that canola oil can go rancid easily....but you don't find that is a problem when you use it? cuz i have a big bottle of it. but i quit using it cuz i was worried it would go rancid

[mystical_angel1219]

Soap doesn't necessarily expire, but when the oils go rancid, you'll know it.

ROE can be added to fresh fixed oils to curb rancidity. Any ingredient used in soapmaking can spoil at any given time~ depending on the temps and how you store finished soap. Milk, aloe, botanicals, short-expire fixed oils, being "airtight" in a plastic box and excessive heat/humidity will hasten the process.

[soycrazy]

My oldest soap that I made that has mainly canola in it is about 10 months old and it's still a awesome bar.

[Jo Ann]

great....i also just read that the cheaper grade of OO is better than the virgin and extra-virgin OO.

[Jo Ann]

what percent of canola do you usually use?

[jbren]

I use canola at 15% in one of my recipes with no DOS problems at all.

[soycrazy]

The one recipe I use with canola has 40% in it.

[Jo Ann]

wow...that is good.

does anyone sell soap and put an expiration date on the label?

[Carrie]

When you say you are adding grapeseed as a superfat oil, are you including it in the lye calculation or are you just adding it at the end as extra oil?

[Jo Ann]

well i did add it after without including it in the calculation, but i was told not to do that but to be sure to add it to the calc and then add it after trace.

When you say you are adding grapeseed as a superfat oil, are you including it in the lye calculation or are you just adding it at the end as extra oil?

[Jo Ann]

what about replacing OO with canola? does this make a good soap

hmmmm....i just noticed that the INS is not high enough just using canola oil.

[Carrie]

The reason I ask about the superfat is that many new soapers don't realize that it must be included in the oils in your lye calc. When people superfat with an oil at trace it is to hopefully keep more of that oil unsaponified than the rest of the oils. Personally, with grapeseed, I wouldn't do that. Because of it's short shelf life I want all of that saponified and I'll superfat with something that has a longer life. I don't know what causes DOS but I assume that it has to do with the unsaponified oils spoiling. I wouldn't want to use or sell soap with DOS.

As for Canola vs Olive I have no idea, I've never soaped with Canola.

[Jo Ann]

well, canola is too low for ins. so won't be using it, but i found out that it is more healthy to cook with canola than OO, so i decided to use oo for soap and canola for food.

now, as for castor oil, what would be the lowest and highest percent that should be used in soap

[Jo Ann]

The reason I ask about the superfat is that many new soapers don't realize that it must be included in the oils in your lye calc.

thats what i had done, didn't realize it needed to be included in the calc, but now i do, won't use grapeseed too much, wanted it for its anti-oxidant properties.

[Peachdream]

I usually use castor at 3-5%. When I first started soaping I was using it at 10% but really did not notice much difference in the lather with the lower percentage. Its also a more expensive oil so I use just the minimum to keep costs down. I prefer to spend my money on my fragrances and additives...

[Jo Ann]

I usually use castor at 3-5%. When I first started soaping I was using it at 10% but really did not notice much difference in the lather with the lower percentage. Its also a more expensive oil so I use just the minimum to keep costs down. I prefer to spend my money on my fragrances and additives...

i know what you mean...i just made an order for eo, pigments. can't wait till they come!!! it was getting way too expensive to buy from my health store.

i am thinking of changing my superfatting to 4% instead of 5% only because i want to make sure the bars have good shelf life.

[Jo Ann]

after reading saopmakers companion and everything soapmaking, i finally have a much better understanding. for me its hard to search the net only because things can be out of order as i find them, but with books, things are usually in a good order where i can understand better.

[kidsngarden]

In another forum one of the more experienced soapers said she was beginning to think DOS did not happen if there was and additive in it like oatmeal, milk, etc. I found that interesting as I pretty much only make GM soap and the only bar I had DOS was a non gm bar! And in the beginning all of my soaps had canola at about 20% too!

I use sunflower now and also find it or Rice bran oil to be a cheaper alternative to OO.

Bethany

[Jo Ann]

In another forum one of the more experienced soapers said she was beginning to think DOS did not happen if there was and additive in it like oatmeal, milk, etc. I found that interesting as I pretty much only make GM soap and the only bar I had DOS was a non gm bar! And in the beginning all of my soaps had canola at about 20% too!

I use sunflower now and also find it or Rice bran oil to be a cheaper alternative to OO.

Bethany

hmm interesting. i have goats milk here, but haven't had the nerve to try it yet. i think too, with OO, alot of ppl find have soap with OO in it is more appealing even tho there are other alternatives. like at work, i got a couple of "oooooo, its made with real olive oil!"

[kidsngarden]

Yes, oo has greater label appeal. No one has ever said, "does your soap have olive oil in it?" to me though. I think they just like the GM part and are taken aback by that and that I handmilk my very own goats to get it. Overshadows the whole oo thing I think.

Bethany

[Jo Ann]

Yes, oo has greater label appeal. No one has ever said, "does your soap have olive oil in it?" to me though. I think they just like the GM part and are taken aback by that and that I handmilk my very own goats to get it. Overshadows the whole oo thing I think.

Bethany

wow, ya milk your own goats....nice. i would love to have some alpacas, so i could spin and dye my own yarn....alpaca wool has no lanolin so its really nice to use.

[topofmurrayhill]

I looked into grapefruit seed extract as a preservative for a non-soaping application, but it turned out to be BS when I researched it. Studies found that the GSE contained artificial preservatives added by the manufacturer. Without those it doesn't have any effect.

That was about antimicrobial properties though. It wouldn't be relevant to DOS, which seems to be a matter of oxidation. Things that apparently work are ROE, BHT and EDTA. More info here:

http://cavemanchemistry.com/HsmgDos2006.pdf

[soycrazy]

I looked into grapefruit seed extract as a preservative for a non-soaping application, but it turned out to be BS when I researched it. Studies found that the GSE contained artificial preservatives added by the manufacturer. Without those it doesn't have any effect.

Do you have a reference for this?