Help needed with 4627

[Winterwillow]

I'm not getting a strong cold throw. I melt to 180 and 8% FO (honey gingerbread), stir for 3 min. then pour into 8 oz WM jelly jars. In order to smell the Fo , I almost have to put my nose in the wax!What am I doing wrong?

[flcandles]

im having the same problems with igi4786 using banana. It smell great in the bottle nice and strong but im smelling nothing in the candles.

[IndyGirl]

Try 12%....I have tested this oil and had no problems with this wax.

[Winterwillow]

IndyGirl,

Do you find that you have to use more FO with this wax? Also, how long do you stir the FO and at what temp did you pour into your containers?

I have 8 oz. of pumpkin cornbread I want to try, so I'm going to try 12%.

I'm going to place another order with backwoods, have any suggestions on what scents throw super strong?

[mizbizzyb]

I'm not getting a strong cold throw. I melt to 180 and 8% FO (honey gingerbread), stir for 3 min. then pour into 8 oz WM jelly jars. In order to smell the Fo , I almost have to put my nose in the wax!What am I doing wrong?

maybe candle nose - have someone else try it to see if they can smell it.

[IndyGirl]

Hi Willow! I always use 12% load not matter what the oil. As far as stirring and pouring temp, I'm not all that scientific! LOL! I stir until I think it's well mixed usually 80 times sometimes less.....temp.....probably around 180-185 ish. In my process I don't check the temp before I pour because I go from melter to mixing on a hotplate set at medium! As for cold throw, I don't worry too much about that becasue it's the hot throw that I'm looking for and it has to be strong. As I remember the could throw wasn't so strong on this fo but, the hot throw is great and really surprised me. I have only had one fo that I loved from BW that didn't have a good hot throw. If you want to try one with super cold throw try NG Doney Lav/Van! That one kicks butt cold.

Indy

PS...try about .51 per 8oz candle and test burn it........also, are you topping off after it cools?

[Winterwillow]

Hi Willow! I always use 12% load not matter what the oil. As far as stirring and pouring temp, I'm not all that scientific! LOL! I stir until I think it's well mixed usually 80 times sometimes less.....temp.....probably around 180-185 ish. In my process I don't check the temp before I pour because I go from melter to mixing on a hotplate set at medium! As for cold throw, I don't worry too much about that becasue it's the hot throw that I'm looking for and it has to be strong. As I remember the could throw wasn't so strong on this fo but, the hot throw is great and really surprised me. I have only had one fo that I loved from BW that didn't have a good hot throw. If you want to try one with super cold throw try NG Doney Lav/Van! That one kicks butt cold.

Indy

PS...try about .51 per 8oz candle and test burn it........also, are you topping off after it cools?

No, I don't top off after it cools. My tops are pretty smooth. If it is of a bit I hit it with a heat gun.

Thanks for the hekp. I'm going to try again tomorrow.

[Flicker]

Have you tried lidding the candles up and letting them cure for a few weeks? If not I am betting this is what you need to do. With many waxes and this is one the cold throw takes time to develop.

I do not recommend using 2 oz per lb with any conventional single pour container wax, they are not designed to hold that amount of fo. Think of wax like a giant sponge...what happens if you add too much water, it seeps out. Same concept with fo and wax. Since fo is HIGHLY flammable this is not a recommended process and it could lead to a fire. Not something I'd want for you or anyone else.

IGI recommends the load on that wax to be up to 1.5 oz per lb. I find normally with a quality fo the load that works best is 1 oz per lb. But never judge a candle right away, always let it cure and never judge straight off cold throw. Let that bad boy burn!

[IndyGirl]

Paraffin wax does not require a cure time at all. I have never had a seepage issue with the max load of fo in 4627. Some fo's just don't have a significant cold throw.

[lsbennis]

Im confused...why would you want to use 12% fo, especially in 4627 which in my experience usually throws great at 6%! I just feel that if a fo doesnt throw at 6% to 8% then its time to find another fo that will! JMO...

[Flicker]

Paraffin wax does not require a cure time at all. I have never had a seepage issue with the max load of fo in 4627. Some fo's just don't have a significant cold throw.

All waxes can require a cure time. it is really just depends on the fo more than anything. Glad you are not having seepage issues. I personally never exceed 1 oz per lb or I won't use the scent. I just feel it is a waste of supply money.

[sharig]

This is just my opinion and knowledge of using this wax for about 20 months now. I have tested and tested and tested some more. CS allows for a 12% fragrance load, however, if you pull up the reccomendations from IGI they only allow for 10% per pound. In my experience with this wax, I have had seepage from 1 FO, Dreamsicle. Even at 6% this FO would seep.

Some FO's have a weak cold throw while having an awesome hot throw. In my experience, I would never add 12% per pound. Honestly, it is not worth my money. If I have to add that much fragrance, then I loose money in my pocket.

What you might want to consider is your FO. If you got it from a reputable supplier, then maybe it just has a week cold throw, but will throw really well while lit. If it doesn't throw that well while hot, then I would consider maybe using a different supplier's FO for that particular scent. Like the dreamsicle, honestly, I won't use it again. It's just too much of a pain for me.

I hope this might help ya'll and maybe some of the more experienced chandlers that have used this wax can give you some more suggestions.

Shari

[itsmejeffd]

Paraffin wax does not require a cure time at all.

WHAT?!? You've got to be kidding. All candles require a curing time to smell their best. Though some may be shorter than others.

4627 has a great hot and cold throw after about a week of curing. Granted, not all FO's work well with all waxes but it's seldom that I have a problem at 6% to 9%. Oh, and try adding your FO at 190*.

[PurpleHippie]

Flicker is correct, ALL waxes can require a cure time. That includes paraffin. It just depends on the FO and the individual nose and sense of smell. I have yet to test one wax that the scent throw didn't get better after a week, some times more. 12%! ! Nice that the wax can hold that much but I wouldn't use a wax or FO that required that much. That would double my cost for FO and add more to the price I would have to sell the candle to cover that much FO. JMO, if it works for you that's great:smiley2:

[IndyGirl]

I have experimented in reducing the fo % and it does make a difference in the quality of fragrance throw. It's just not as strong at a reduced rate. Perhaps it is as strong as you would like it but, not my customers......they can tell the difference. But whatever, it's your choice!

[SliverOfWax]

I suppose it stands to reason that someone who uses 12% FO would also state that paraffin does not need to cure.

I wish I had that kind of money to throw away.

WinterWillow, if you're not getting good throw with comfort blend and a maximum of 8% in a wicked candle after curing a week, trash the FO and buy somewhere else. It's possible your wicking isn't right. If it's too big, it will burn off some scent. But cold, it should smell awesome.

But if you're getting the burn you want, it would seem the FO isn't any good. I don't know anything about the FO you tested, and since you didn't mention the supplier, it's anyone's guess.

www.StuffSunshineLikes.com

[sharig]

I suppose it stands to reason that someone who uses 12% FO would also state that paraffin does not need to cure.

I wish I had that kind of money to throw away.

WinterWillow, if you're not getting good throw with comfort blend and a maximum of 8% in a wicked candle after curing a week, trash the FO and buy somewhere else. It's possible your wicking isn't right. If it's too big, it will burn off some scent. But cold, it should smell awesome.

But if you're getting the burn you want, it would seem the FO isn't any good. I don't know anything about the FO you tested, and since you didn't mention the supplier, it's anyone's guess.

Bravo!

[PurpleHippie]

Just as Sliver stated I have also never had to use higher than 8% with any FO that I use to get an outstanding scent throw. I test in a large 1st floor room and I only give or sell candles that produce enough throw that I can also smell upstairs while burning downstairs. That's just me and the way I like to test and what I expect from my candles. I haven't had to use any higher pecentage of FO to get those results. Sliver is right, it may just be a problem with that FO.

[Ring of Fire]

I'm not getting a strong cold throw. I melt to 180 and 8% FO (honey gingerbread), stir for 3 min. then pour into 8 oz WM jelly jars. In order to smell the Fo , I almost have to put my nose in the wax!What am I doing wrong?

Is this Honey Gingerbread from Backwoods? If so, something is definitely wrong. This stuff throws in anything.

[lmn]

This wax requires you to heat it to 185 and then add fragrance. If you aren't getting your wax hot enough the fragrance isn't binding well. I heat it even higher for heavy fo's and most vanillas. As far as 12% fo load ? I couldn't afford to stay in business using that much fragrance in every candle, and this wax just doesn't require it.

180 is not hot enough to add fragrance and I am guessing right off that is your problem with cold throw. The fo is not binding as well as it should....that even affects hot throw. Try heating it to 185 and you should see a difference. I never go over 10% fragrance load and my candles are very strong both cold AND hot...most of my oils only require 6-8 %

Also......even if seepage doesn't show up right away, it can appear later on when you use too high of a fragrance load or a really heavy oil. My #1 example of a pain in the butt seeper is BCS Banana Nut Bread. It seeps after a while no matter what I do but it's the best out there so I just put up with it

This wax does allow you less waiting for candles to cure...but I let ALL of mine cure at least 12 hours before testing. Some throw awesome at that time, some take longer. I like oils that throw in 24-48 hours because I make my candles to order. Years ago I coudn't do that, but now there are plenty of suppliers out there with oils that allow me to do so..

good luck!

[Winterwillow]

Is this Honey Gingerbread from Backwoods? If so, something is definitely wrong. This stuff throws in anything.

yes, it is from backwoods. I'm going to try another batch and let it cure for about a week,

[Cetacea]

2 things:

1.) Let it cure at least 2 days (give the wax time to cool all the way).

2.) Go sniff some coffee beans or go outside for 20 minutes to clear your nose.

Flicker is right, wax is a sponge....it will only hold so much FO before it starts to seep. I'd stick to 8% if you are getting a great hot throw and its burning correctly and just let it sit for a few days then sniff with a clear nose for cold throw.

I find the longer my candles sit the stronger the cold throw....and lets face it, if a customer can't smell it when they pick it up you can explain all day how great it smells burning but they will put it right back down.

HTH

[dsipp138]

This wax requires you to heat it to 185 and then add fragrance. If you aren't getting your wax hot enough the fragrance isn't binding well. I heat it even higher for heavy fo's and most vanillas. As far as 12% fo load ? I couldn't afford to stay in business using that much fragrance in every candle, and this wax just doesn't require it.

180 is not hot enough to add fragrance and I am guessing right off that is your problem with cold throw. The fo is not binding as well as it should....that even affects hot throw. Try heating it to 185 and you should see a difference. I never go over 10% fragrance load and my candles are very strong both cold AND hot...most of my oils only require 6-8 %

Also......even if seepage doesn't show up right away, it can appear later on when you use too high of a fragrance load or a really heavy oil. My #1 example of a pain in the butt seeper is BCS Banana Nut Bread. It seeps after a while no matter what I do but it's the best out there so I just put up with it

This wax does allow you less waiting for candles to cure...but I let ALL of mine cure at least 12 hours before testing. Some throw awesome at that time, some take longer. I like oils that throw in 24-48 hours because I make my candles to order. Years ago I coudn't do that, but now there are plenty of suppliers out there with oils that allow me to do so..

good luck!

I'm having some bad luck with suppliers. Could you please suggest your favorite place.

[dsipp138]

This wax requires you to heat it to 185 and then add fragrance. If you aren't getting your wax hot enough the fragrance isn't binding well. I heat it even higher for heavy fo's and most vanillas. As far as 12% fo load ? I couldn't afford to stay in business using that much fragrance in every candle, and this wax just doesn't require it.

180 is not hot enough to add fragrance and I am guessing right off that is your problem with cold throw. The fo is not binding as well as it should....that even affects hot throw. Try heating it to 185 and you should see a difference. I never go over 10% fragrance load and my candles are very strong both cold AND hot...most of my oils only require 6-8 %

Also......even if seepage doesn't show up right away, it can appear later on when you use too high of a fragrance load or a really heavy oil. My #1 example of a pain in the butt seeper is BCS Banana Nut Bread. It seeps after a while no matter what I do but it's the best out there so I just put up with it

This wax does allow you less waiting for candles to cure...but I let ALL of mine cure at least 12 hours before testing. Some throw awesome at that time, some take longer. I like oils that throw in 24-48 hours because I make my candles to order. Years ago I coudn't do that, but now there are plenty of suppliers out there with oils that allow me to do so..

good luck!

Would you mind suggesting your #1 supplier for FO's.

[SliverOfWax]

lmn went out of business a couple of years ago. She bought from a lot of different suppliers.