464 and strange appearance

[anabanana's candles]

I am using gw464. Some candles have this weird thing happening. The bottom and top set up fine, but in the middle the candle almost looks like it isn't set up. There are light and dark speckles. My supplier said to cook the fo in for between 10-30 minutes and I do that and it still happens. So I read that you will get a better throw if you add the fo before you pour. So I tried that, still the same. It happens on strong and light scents. What is it. The supplier that I use isn't fond of soy and has never personally used it so I need some advice from pros. I am heating to 150 and pouring at 140. Help. They smell great, but look funky.

[iammommytwo]

In my experience w/this wax, it sounds like your fo may not be fully blended w/the wax. I heat to 175, add fragrance, and cool slowly (mixing every few minutes). I personally like to pour slushy.

[anabanana's candles]

I am thinking that it might also be air pockets. When I reheat the outside air bubbles emerge from the spaces. How long do you cook in your fragrance? I cooked hyacinth for 30 minutes and still had this issue. It should be fully incorporated by then right? HELP

[SouthernGal]

I would think if you cook you f/o for 30 min. it would burn off the scent. Jmho

The light and dark specks could be frost from the soy. Are you coloring your candles?

Please understand this is all my opinion. But you might want to use a supplier who has tested and worked with the products they sell. Atleast until you have more experience working with soy wax. Soy can be a pain and using a supplier who doesn't have experience working with the wax might add to the problem. They may not offer other products that are compatable with soy.

Did you buy your wicks from them? If so, which ones did they suggest?

Also there is alot of info about 464 on this board. I noticed you are new and just wanted to let you know there is a search at the top and you can find tons of info there, too. Hth

[Marilyn]

"Cook" is not a commonly used phrase so I'm not sure what you mean by that. Usually wax is melted in a melt pot and then poured into a pouring pot after it reaches the temp you desire, say 175*. Then you add your fo to the pour pot at the temp you want, say 170*, and gently stir the fo in, gently so you don't add air bubbles. Add dye if using, and pour at desired temp. For 464 I've found pouring @ 120 does good. If you get a discoloring occurance, it probably is what we call frosting. And frosting is something that is an ongoing battle, altho commonly accepted as a "soy thing". Hope that helps.

[Stella1952]

I do understand what you mean by "cooking" - it means that you hold the wax at a particular temp for a particular length of time. This is what people do when they temper their wax, which helps with smooth tops. You should stir your wax - not so vigorously as to incorporate air into it, but gently to keep it moving and mixing. The oil does not blend into the wax by itself! Stirring is also part of the tempering process and is done to keep the entire batch at the same even temp. Otherwise, it will be hotter at the bottom (near the source of heat) and cooler at the top.

Without a photo, it's hard to say what your dark and light spots really are. I DO know that my Chinese manufactured Presto pot sheds the teflon coating and causes little debris like pepper. Guess who is now straining her wax before pouring...:rolleyes2

Sometimes dark spots (like little bits of "stuff") are actually hard pieces of pigment that did not incorporate into the wax. The light spots, I am gonna agree with whomever guessed frosting. Frosting is a natural occurance with soy wax, but can be largely eliminated by using certain additives - how much and what depend upon the kind of wax you are using - and tempering the wax. The amount of frosting is also worse with certain FOs and pigments. While it is natural for frosting to occur in soy wax, you do not have to simply accept it. You can do things to control its occurance. Soy wax behaves much like chocolate in this respect, which is why tempering does it so much good in general. Frosting does not affect how the wax burns and throws, so if you do not mind its appearance, then don't lost any sleep over it.

You can eliminate air pockets by rapping on the containers or under where they are cooling to loosen and allow the air bubbles to surface and pop or poke relief holes. The micro-bubbles that accumulate as the candle is burning and give the wax that "spitty" appearance are a different matter. I do not know of a way to eliminate them. If anyone does, I hope they will let us know! I have noticed that they do not occur as much when the candle is properly wicked. If it's underwicked, they seem to accumulate more. HTH

[anabanana's candles]

I thought of another way to describe the way that the candles look grainy and almost mottled. I have not run across anyone else with this problem. I called my supplier and they couldn't figure it out either. I need help. Could it be the wax? I am melting to 170 adding color and 3/4 ounce of fragrance for 12oz 464 wax. I am pouring at around 120, but I have tried pouring at 110, 130, and 140.

[Stella1952]

Without seeing a photo, I can't think of anything else to suggest to you...

[Monvi33]

Hi I am new to the forum and am also having this exact issue. I agree with you in describing a mottled appearance. I have spoke to two different suppliers that I order from, one suggested it's a fragrance oil not being blended issue, and the other one said it's a temperature issue. I also have tried pre-heating the jars, pouring slower, pouring cooler, pouring hotter, pouring faster. Nothing is working. I use 464, heat to 185 add 7% FO at 180 and have tried pouring at 115, 120, 135, and 140. I would also greatly appreciate some help with this issue.

I thought at one point it was a problem with the wax, may I ask you which supplier you get your was from?

I just ordered a new batch of wax and am going to see if that's the problem, because on my first box of wax my candles did not have this problem, so I will let you know what happens.

[katcandlemaker]

I have had this issue but on only some of my oils....I noticed too the faster (like too cool in the building) it seems like the center is not setting up and gets somewhat sloshy but still wet looking even though the rest is ok. Once dried, it is smooth except the center where it looks mottled. I think its the FO's and I noticed on some that I have recently ordered, they have been doing this....even though never had issues with those exact oils before in the past. I heat mine to 185 and pour at 120 as supplier directed, because cooling/pouring milky and sloshy wasn't setting up nicely...my candles come out nice and creamy smooth tops...its just recent. Don't know if its the wax or the oils these days.

[Monvi33]

I am using gw464. Some candles have this weird thing happening. The bottom and top set up fine' date=' but in the middle the candle almost looks like it isn't set up. There are light and dark speckles. My supplier said to cook the fo in for between 10-30 minutes and I do that and it still happens. So I read that you will get a better throw if you add the fo before you pour. So I tried that, still the same. It happens on strong and light scents. What is it. The supplier that I use isn't fond of soy and has never personally used it so I need some advice from pros. I am heating to 150 and pouring at 140. Help. They smell great, but look funky.[/quote']

I am a newbie to candles, but i will share my experience. I got my new box of wax last night and tried a little experiment on cooling temperatures, and the wax. I poured 3 candles: 1 (made from old wax) I poured at 165, pre-heated jar, and left candle to cool in turned off warm oven overnight, 1 (new wax) I poured at 140 and left to cool on counter with only a blanket wrap, and 1 (new wax) I poured at 100 and left on counter to cool with no other insulation.

I don't know if this is the reason or not but the two candles that cooled on counter came out PERFECT and the candle that cooled in oven had those lines/mottling look.

So for me the candle that cooled very Slowly, cooled too slowly, Is that possible? All of the information posted always said to allow to cool very slowly.

My specs are 16oz 464 (from Peak), heated to 185, fo and dye added at 180, cooled to pouring temp. oh yeah, and my temp in my house is usually around 74 F.

I also found that If I heated the sides of the containers with a heat gun, that the "lines" were actually trapped bubbles that released as they were melted. I tried to fix the ones with the lines, but not really any luck with that, the more I seemed to melt the was and release the bubbles, the worse it would look.

Sorry for the long reply, I hope that it helps you a little, it's a very frustrating problem.

[Jeana]

Anabanana, is it possible you are putting too much fo in? I didn't see the amount you are using. Are you coloring them?

I pour this wax hotter. Maybe around 170 or 165. I've never had any mottling problems. For me, pouring hotter helps with frosting and smooth tops. If you pour too hot, you"ll get air pockets around the wick.

Can you post a picture of what is going on?

[Candlemwoman]

I thought of another way to describe the way that the candles look grainy and almost mottled. I have not run across anyone else with this problem. I called my supplier and they couldn't figure it out either. I need help. Could it be the wax? I am melting to 170 adding color and 3/4 ounce of fragrance for 12oz 464 wax. I am pouring at around 120' date=' but I have tried pouring at 110, 130, and 140.[/quote']

Is your supplier local to you? Have you taken the candle into your supplier so they may look at it? That may help them be able to assist you in what is wrong. What kind of color are you using? It sounds like either cold shock or it could be unblended color, I agree with the FO too.

[Candlemwoman]

I would think if you cook you f/o for 30 min. it would burn off the scent. Jmho

The light and dark specks could be frost from the soy. Are you coloring your candles?

Please understand this is all my opinion. But you might want to use a supplier who has tested and worked with the products they sell. Atleast until you have more experience working with soy wax. Soy can be a pain and using a supplier who doesn't have experience working with the wax might add to the problem. They may not offer other products that are compatable with soy.

Did you buy your wicks from them? If so, which ones did they suggest?

Also there is alot of info about 464 on this board. I noticed you are new and just wanted to let you know there is a search at the top and you can find tons of info there, too. Hth

If your supplier makes candles I imagine they have tested the soy wax. It may have just been the personal opinion of the supplier, that they didn't like soy. Most suppliers I have worked with test all items in there store. You may want to ask them when you speak to them.

[Sharon in KY]

If my candles cool slowly they will get this slush appearance. And if I pour at the slushy stage they will sometimes. I love to pour in a cool room so the jar is cool, pour faster and at the thick syrup stage, that's when my candles look the best. Love when the wax pulls away from the jar. If I don't catch the wax at just the right time they'll look like that but it doesn't affect the burn.

[kyme]

I had that problem too, and also really rough top (with 464) I started pouring at a cooler temp (about 90 degrees) "slushy" and the problem so far has stopped.