strugglebrother

Ok, let's try another link instead

The original FO load for this scent blend was 13% in soy/coconut (it's a bit softer but very nice). The HTP 73 burns through the whole candle with a good flame and a good hot throw. Cold throw was perfect (commercial/industry standard).

Taking it down to 10% with 25% paraffin compromised the cold throw but improved the hot throw (due to the paraffin). I could always try 8% but I'm afraid it will weaken the cold throw .

You mentioned that I could try CDN8 and it burns like HTP 83? Is that correct? I'm getting too hot with HTP 73 and I would certainly get crazy hot with HTP 83? Shouldn't I get lower in numbers with the CDN's? Then try CD 7, 8 and 10?

This is how the HTP 73 burns with 25% paraffin

https://streamable.com/qnpmk

1 hour ago, moonshine said:

CDN is basically the same wick as CD the difference being the coating on the wick to make it more suitable for burning in vegetable soy waxes 

in straight soy I have found CDN to burn a bit cooler in my application

if I test a CD10 and a CD12 and the 10 isn't quite enough leaving Hangup on the jar and the 12 burns too hot for my liking usually the CDN12 is always a winner 

 

I used HTP a long time ago and they are similar to CD AND CDN but seem to lean and curl more burning more off center and I had issues with either way too hot or not hot enough so I made the switch to Cd having CDN as my "in between"

 

all bets are off now though with testing a new soy and I'm trying them all again

 

with 30-% paraffin you may like HTP better as I found cd really let off a lot of soot in a paraffin blend, the CDN is better but that could be just the blend - is the 73 too hot or what is going on with it?

 

try a CDN 8 and 10 in comparison to a HTP 73- I get mine at southwest candle supply as they have more sizes than candle cocoon 

3

With 25% paraffin, the 73 is great the first 6-7 hours of the candle. Then the flame starts to dance and gets pretty high with a bit less HT, could still do with it but it's not optimal as before. FO load was 12% before and I lowered it to 10% with the paraffin.

It's the 8oz jam jar so the diam of the candle gets smaller as it's burning down.

Southwest candle supply doesn't have any CDN's under 10. Candle Cocoon has CDN 4, 6, 8, 10, 12, 14, 16, 20, 22 but is missing 5 in the series.

I'm thinking to try CD 7, 8 and 10?

Would you say CDN 8 and 10 to try for HTP 72 & 73? I found this chart but there it looks more like CDN 5, 6 and 7 (even though I can't buy CDN 5 here in the states) but it might be off?

Next step could be to lower the paraffin to 20% if that would help and up the FO to 11%?

Sorry for all the questions, but do you think there will be a continuous supply of CDN wicks? Has it been easy for you to find them all these years you have been using them?

I'm currently testing right now the HTP 72 with 30% paraffin.

I'm switching from my soy/coconut blend to a mix of soy/coconut and paraffin.

My HTP wicks stopped to work as perfect as before when I switched the blend a bit .. I'm now stuck with needing something in between HTP 72 and 73.

I've seen that CD and HTP are supposed to be 'sort of' the same type of wick? This is a comparison chart between them, even though it's really old

HTP-31, CD-4

HTP-41, CD-5

HTP-52, CD-6

HTP-62, CD-7

HTP-73, CD-8

HTP-83, CD-10

HTP-93, CD-12

HTP-104, CD-14

HTP-105, CD-16

HTP-126, CD-18

HTP-1212, CD-20

HTP-1313, CD-22

I'm thinking maybe to test the CD7 and CD8, but are they the same or could I strike a lucky one and get it right in between 72 and 73. CDN seems to be harder to get hold of but might work better in vegetable waxes, I'm playing with 20% to 30% of paraffin in the blend to fix the soy problems we have right now with the soy waxes.

Have anyone tested CD vs HTP vs CDN to see if they do the same thing but gives more options? I really like how the HTP performs, it seems to work well all around for me.

Both manufacturers have completely different charts which don't add up at all, but they might do completely different tests and use different waxes.

10 hours ago, Candybee said:

Strugglebrother I love that color wheel with scent categories! Where did you get it? I've seen it before but don't remember where?

I was looking for a "fragrance wheel" and googled that, there is a fair few ones so check it out and pick one that works for you. Then you can change it a bit so it works for how you look for things etc.

2 hours ago, Trappeur said:

Very nice organization Strugglebrother!

 

Trappeur

Thanks... I'll put this up here also if it helps someone.. 

This is what I used to categorize the scents

Here's how we have it...

I got a bit of OCD with our samples so I put a color dot on each top of them so we can easily just clean off and put them back after blending. Life got so much less complicated after we did that

On 11/3/2017 at 2:25 PM, PINKT said:

I get the APRICOT  WAX  and COCONUT WAX from Accu-blend.. yes they are blends but mostly apricot and coconut. they do have a little soy in them but no paraffin. Thee apricot is APRICOT-74 and the coconut is COCONUT-83.   I add to them and they perform outstandingly.. I mix the 2 waxes together...  They are great on their own, but I have found that they are much easier to wick with the addition of palm, beeswax or soy modifier.

Can you order online from Accu-Blend and in which quantities?

I get my Coconut-83 wax from California Candle Supply but they don't seem to stock Apricot-74. I'm also keen on trying this since soy wax has gotten worse and worse.

4 hours ago, Candybee said:

Since you won't be using a fragrance, you basically want the wax to fully harden before testing. I would wait a minimum of 2-3 days or longer. I found through my own testing that candles don't burn the same when you compare a freshly made candle to one that is several days old. The new candle pools too quickly and doesn't give me an optimum burn. A candle that has had time to cure for at least a few days is harder and burns the way I expect a fully cured candle to burn.

Thanks, they should be good to go then since it's gone 5 days.

Hi,

How long does unscented soy need to cure? For some reason, I have never done an unscented candle and always let scented soy candles cure 10-14 days.

But if I don't put any fragrance in the soy wax, when can I test burn the candle?

I'll put pictures of a line we did for s shop in New Orleans with the old CS tumblers before they changed the painting of them ....

1 hour ago, GailC said:

 

Like I said, I  have never bought the black ones.  I use the white frosted jars which are good quality.  I also have bought an assortment of colored jars, some frosted, some not.  They all look good to me.  I have never ordered colored jars from CS so I can't compare.

I will try and call them to see if they are different than CS... Thanks for pointing me to these

Shipping is double the price of Candle Science's shipping but maybe they are offering pickup from our own courier.

2 hours ago, Trappeur said:

You know Strugglebrother, I have looked at these before and they really aren't bad at all.  I can't remember if the are painted or a solid color glass but with that bamboo lid or even the cork lid those jars could be really quite nice looking with a smashing label on it.  And they could be a real classy looking jar when all put together.    Actually I really like them!  But you have to like the jar.

 

Trappeur

Yeah I got samples with all the colors a long time ago...

I think it's a personal preference, nothing wrong with them but I like the jars straight and more simple. And then full black and full white painted.

2 hours ago, GailC said:

 

Candles & Supplies has 10 oz black tumblers.  I have bought some colored ones there, although not black, and I think the quality is good.

These actually looks like CS but bigger...

http://www.candlesandsupplies.net/10-oz-Straight-Jar-per-case-36?sc=7&category=1828

Have you tried these, are they better than the CS ones?

11 hours ago, Sebleo said:

I see now that the candle containers in black and white are a matte finish. I did not notice that before. The Reed diffuser bottles have a glossy finish and I thought the candle containers were the same. 

I think these one's look pretty terrible and not classy

https://www.glassnow.com/8-5oz-heavy-glass-votive

And they are also not black or white... It's more of a hippy feel than classy feel..

I haven't found any other colored glass that I'm happy with except the CS ones.. But they are far from perfect either.

The problem is that there are NO black or white painted glass tumblers except the ones from CS that are decent.

The Glassnow painted tumblers look terrible in my eyes and other painted glass I have found here in LA looks worse than the CS ones...

We were waiting for the new ones from CS for our client and he had a look when they came and said, NO... We are bringing tumblers over all the way from Australia for him for this order

6 minutes ago, TallTayl said:

Same here -  OOB at least. I have not yet burned it in anything. 

 

Re:essential oils. Many are very affordable. The secret to getting throw is to not wick as hot as usual. Lavender 40/42 can smell beautiful in soy wax. Lemongrass can knock your socks off. It takes some out of the box thinking, but it can be done if you're able to find the right wax and Wick combo.

They are great for throw, always punches through... 

Many of them can give me a "headache" feel to it. So I burn and test a lot before I use them.

Haven't burned it yet either

Fresh Squeezed Oranges from Rustic smells just like it in my opinion.

2 hours ago, birdcharm said:

From what I recall, I thought they mostly sold aroma chemicals, but I haven't been back to check to see if they also carry fragrance oils.  You can *very carefully* use some aromas to add to a fragrance oil, but you only use a very small amount and before you order them, I think it would be very wise (critical) to look up the flashpoints and read reviews about how they may perform in candles, and also take note as to how they are to be stored, handled, etc.  In other words, you can't just buy any aroma and use it.

 

 

 

 

Thanks,

We have a lot of their aroma chemicals for blending perfume but they do carry a lot of really good fragrance oils also which we haven't tried in candles.

I spoke to the lady who runs it before and she told me she doesn't have much knowledge about candles but her customers have reported that they use some of her stuff in candles. 

I just did a tester today of one of their premium FO's in a soyblend.

12 hours ago, moonshine said:

Really?? Because I am supposedly the only one complaining about soy wax to them 🙃

I have an ongoing email with them regarding all of this with the soy and fragrances being affected by the fire, their shipping costs due to not having product in both warehouses....apparently I am the only one concerned, they say although they appreciate my persistence and involvement in this...soy wax has NOT changed 

they have no reason to believe aaksoy/GB wouldn't be upfront with any reformulations and ecosoya waxes are the only ones affected by the FDA regulations on soy- now I am arguing how they can even say that when my wax - 415- is food grade soy and ALL food grade soy has had to have transfats removed from my understandsing, I asked them if they have even tested any of the soy waxes to see for themselves they are not the same and I have a hundred failed testers as proof if they would like them- this is not a minor typical soy encounter, this wax is completely not behaving typical at all 

then it comes out they had a moisture issue with their equipment but this is definitely beyond moisture 

Their reply to the fragrances was the same to me - they will not be affected other than the few they have been working on removing phthalates....now how is it a couple suppliers have stepped up to the plate and announced they may be out of stock on some FO due to the fire when they run out and yet other suppliers (CS) claim it will not have any impact on them 🤔

My advice - take it with a grain of salt and test every one you buy to be sure and if it's not the same - raise an earthquake 

 

I am being told they are going to look into the soy more but 🤷‍♀️ Been told that before as well 🙄

 

I do have to say she was very nice and seemed to understand my frustration but first time around they were also nice and seemed concerned and yet... people are still being told no complaints 

sad because I really used them for many things but I'm not sure I can anymore, a news article of some sort of issues coming up from customers would be great PR for them - we will see if they do it now or continue to wear blinders 

CandleScience has always been nice to me... They are hands down the quickest when it comes to pack and ship out their stuff and they have the best prices there is in this business for the quality you get.. This compared to many other suppliers that sometimes sit and wait 4 days until they put the order in a box and sends it off (which amazes me as they have much higher prices).

One of the products I and they have been struggling with is their straight-sided painted tumblers... They have been very upfront with that and have refunded anything that has been inconsistent with me. Always very friendly customer support.

I don't know how their testing works. They recommend 6% in soy wax for fragrance load which gives you a pretty weak candle overall ... so ...

I was told that only a fraction of people have reached out to them and the complaints have only been if the wax is rancid. But if you look at the recent reviews on their site it's a different story. So I'm with you there, something is fishy

I posted a review regarding the 444 wax, I urge anyone else who has any problems with the GB waxes to do the same.. I think that's the only way the problem can be looked into.

I understand they are a middleman in this and I doubt the manufacturer would say they shipped one year of badly performing wax to all the crafters in America.

I'm switching to a blend for our line, which means I have to reprint $1000 worth of stickers, but I'd rather do that than sell candles that don't throw or have other weird problems. 2017 has been a weird year... I've lost some money and also taken the decision to give up on the weekly market here in LA as they have been very unprofitable...

 My girlfriend work in the beauty industry and sales are DOWN.

They just need to focus on buying nicely scented candles instead of reading the news  Hoping for a better 2018!

8 hours ago, jackbenimble said:

Hey guys! I contacted Candle Science this afternoon and was told that they will not be impacted by this fire as of now. If anything should impact then in the future they will notify by email and social media so that customers will know. 

I wonder if they are really honest about that - they told me that I'm the only one being concerned about the latest soywax situation....

Have anyone here tested their fragrance oils in candles with any good results (not their molecules)? 

2 hours ago, moonshine said:

Even pouring to almost slush?

I haven't come across this yet in tins or Mason jars - I pour at 100-105 in warm containers just when it starts to cloud - now when I pour when it's cloudy I get a crystalized top- some tops are "wavy" and others are baby but smooth....this is finicky soy wax to pour - like TT stated I wonder what that additive is, I have found it's soy based additives but the only ones I know of are USA and I used to use it all the time with 415 and my tops were more consistent than 444

Yeah, I tried to pour when it's slushy also.

Yes it's definitely better with 415 and 464 but 444 has the strongest cold throw for me so I'm sticking to it.

1 hour ago, TallTayl said:

By sink holes, do you mean air cavities? 444 used to be super easy. This last year complaints a plenty about the same thing. 

 

I dont see, to get them in my 8 oz tins when I pour on the cool side (cloudy, almost slush).  As @Trappeur noted, pouring hot risks popping the wick tabs and also melting the wax coating on the wick. That wax coating really helps keep it from slumping into the MP.

 

with larger containers that cool slower it is harder. I recently made fairly large  (1 lb of wax) and a wood wick in a ceramic jar. the entire area around the wick was air pocket on two. The tops looked great. The wood wick would not stay lit - when I looked I could see why. A knife slipped easily down both sides of the wick with wiggle room. I poured those a little hotter, but now will always poke and fill around undo that wick

Yeah like this... I haven't been able to prevent this from happening ever with 444 in my jam jars. Different pour temps, heating up the jars etc... So I gave up and heatgun each of them which takes quite some time.

Pretty much like this: 

1 hour ago, moonshine said:

I was referring to allergens to paraffin, not the fragrance themselves

One of my sisters gets itchy watery eyes and runny nose when burning paraffin-  I recently sent her some melts with straight soy which she never had a problem with and then I sent her some in the same scent with coconut and beeswax and a parasoy---- the parasoy made her react and she did to the coconut beeswax a little also but not the soy

You cant control what people are sensitive to I understand but its always been my business practice to lay it all out there so people know what they are getting- the product sells itself so long as they are not allergic

 

soy blend is stating it contains something else so yes people use it but I dont agree with it but I just one small little person in this world 

I totally agree... I think what I meant is that if someone is allergic they should look for a product that clearly states that it doesn't contain anything of what they are allergic too.

Unfortunately, paraffin has such a bad reputation, and it's blown up out of proportion.