9% FO, 16oz Jar, what size wick

[ebarnes]

would you use?

The HTP105 are not big enough and the HTP1212 are too big.

[geekrunner]

Have you tried an HTP-126? It seems to me smaller than a 1212. If you have a widemouth jar, you could try 2 x HTP-83 or 2 x HTP-93. Works for me on widemouth 16 oz apoth. HTH

[Kaybee23]

Have you tried an HTP-126? It seems to me smaller than a 1212. If you have a widemouth jar, you could try 2 x HTP-83 or 2 x HTP-93. Works for me on widemouth 16 oz apoth. HTH

I'll have to second that, that's what I would try as well. If the double 83's are too large, I have had to go one size down and double 73's. Some people won't agree, but I like that size jar double wicked.

[ebarnes]

I'll have to second that, that's what I would try as well. If the double 83's are too large, I have had to go one size down and double 73's. Some people won't agree, but I like that size jar double wicked.

I use two 105's one seems to always drown and they both curl

[Kaybee23]

Some thoughts...

what is the dia. of your jar? The wick recommendations are for approx. a 3 1/2 inch dia. jar. If it is larger, you may have to up your double wick. If one wick is drowning and the other is not, you my have trimmed it to short to start. Double 105's should not be drowning in a 16 oz. jar. As for the curl, they are flat braid type wicks and that is what they are designed to do, is curl on the ends. This is to reduce carbon buildup and mushrooming.

[Fern-Marie]

May I ask how it is that you can use 9% FO? I thought that we weren't supposed to use more that 5%....?

What's the trick?

I use CB Advanced...can I use 9%?

Thanks,

Fern-Marie

[Kaybee23]

I use 8% and 9% FO in all of my candles, maybe 7% if it is a stronger FO. Many use that amount, 9% is not an unusual amount for soy.

You may be thinking of paraffins, a lot of straight paraffins only hold about 4-5% FO, without additives.

[Fern-Marie]

Thanks, I think that I just might give it a try. I wondered if I could use more fragrance when I am not using dyes especially.

Now I'm going to be thinking about it half the night...I'll be up at the crack of dawn...again!

Fern-Marie

[topofmurrayhill]

May I ask how it is that you can use 9% FO? I thought that we weren't supposed to use more that 5%....?

What's the trick?

I use CB Advanced...can I use 9%?

Thanks,

Fern-Marie

You can usually use more than 5% but 9% is pushing it. More than 6% is a common enough practice but not necessarily a sensible one. If you're going to spend 50% more on FO you're better off spending the money on buying an FO that throws well at 6% or less. The result is a better burning and more professional product.

Premium commercial products seldom (probably never) us FO levels like that and often throw much better.

[Kaybee23]

You can usually use more than 5% but 9% is pushing it. More than 6% is a common enough practice but not necessarily a sensible one. If you're going to spend 50% more on FO you're better off spending the money on buying an FO that throws well at 6% or less. The result is a better burning and more professional product.

Premium commercial products seldom (probably never) us FO levels like that and often throw much better.

I don't want to turn this into a debate as that is not originally what this thread was about. Just some other thoughts to ponder on the subject of FO load.

I would just like to say here, that how much FO that you put in the wax is sometimes related by your perception of how strong it smells. I have some FO's that I use at 8% because I don't think they are strong enough at anything less. Then along comes my husband, who is knocked over by how strong it is and thinks I can do less. Now I have customers who are the same way. I have a Ginger Peach that I tried at 7% because I think it is plenty strong, but the best customer I have for my Ginger Peach candles, doesn't think it is strong enough, so I put 8% in it. I do carry some more expensive oils, but in my soy, I have had to use about 7% as well, to get a good throw, to me.

I also don't believe that just because you use a more expensive oil, makes your candle more professional and burn better. My customers have no complaints about my candles, and I do sell a lot of them. They have no idea that the FO that I used may only be $17.00 lb, and not $28.00 lb. It doesn't matter to them. Only thing that matters to them is that it fills their house with aroma, and they like that.

As far as the premium commercial products, I have a Yankme candle that I recently paid about $26.00 for, it is fairly small, don't remember the oz. on it. I have burned it 2 or 3 times in my kitchen, which is pretty small, and I cannot even smell it across the kitchen. You have to go right up next to it to smell it. And after it burns each time, these little beads of FO pop up on top of the candle. I don't have privey to how much FO they use in that baby, or how much the FO costs, but it burns like a cheap walmart candle.

I am proud to say that my candles burn much better.

[topofmurrayhill]

I'm not talking about Yankme candles. That is not premium.

One of the candle types I specialize in is mottled paraffin pillars. If you use the amount of oil in one of those that most crafters use, it cannot be shipped in the summertime and burning the bottom inch of it will leave a puddle on your plate. On the other hand, a mottle from Illuminations can sit on a sunny windowsill and remain bone dry. I don't think there is more than 3% FO in there tops, and on the average their fragrances have as much or more throw than pillars many people make at 6% or more.

There were studies done by IGI on soot generation. They found that when wicked properly, both paraffin and soy burn clean. The two biggest factors in producing soot were a mismatched wick, which is avoidable, and fragrance oil. It varies from oil to oil but a lot of them generated quite a bit of soot. If you can get the same throw with half the oil it is just plain better. You have to select your oils very carefully for that. Paying a lot helps but not always. Another thing people do is use oils that throw well for instance at 4% and put in double the amount. That's a total waste.

Add 9% milk to your coffee for a visual illustration of what you're doing to your wax. I respectfully suggest that crafters are too preoccupied with how big an FO load they can get, setting their general baseline too high, and not concentrating enough on how to get maximum fragrance with minimum oil. That is my point and I think it's one way we can strive to create a better product.

[Kaybee23]

I agree with most everything you just said, and I get the point you are trying to make now. I agree if it will do as well holding 4 or 5%, it is a waste to use 8 or 9%. I think a lot of us try to be picky when selecting oils. I know the last few months I have weeded out some of my poor sellers and have been testing some better oils to replace them with, some of them more expensive, some not. I actually have some new FO's I just started testing, that I put in my wax at 7% but still smell strong enough I could probably get by with 6%, from Candle Cocoon.

When I first started making candles last year, I started in soy, because like most, thought they burned clean. It didn't take me long to discover that they soot just like paraffin candles do, even though their soot is not black. I still do primarily soy, but have been playing in the paraffin and the parasoy blends. Just too many waxes, wicks, and FO's to try. But that is the fun of candlemaking. Thank you for your insight, your posts are always enlightening and really make you think.

[topofmurrayhill]

Lyschel knows her product. Her oils should work at 6% in soy. I just got a bunch to try out and I'm gonna give them a go at 5%.

[Kaybee23]

Let me know how they work at 5%. I was so impressed with the 4 that I have put in wax already, that I ordered another 5 from her tonight.

[scentlady]

I haven't tried Candle Cocoon scents yet but I will. I would like to be able to use less scent. I've been using a lot of MC and from their message board most seem to use 1.5 oz per pound except for the real heavy oils. So being new I followed their lead and the scent throw is great. I use CB135 and I do have a couple of scents that don't throw at all. Besides Candle Cocoon who else has great scents that I should be able to use at 5%.

[Kaybee23]

I haven't tried them yet, but I understand that Wick Your Wax FO's are usuable at less per lb. If you live in the U.S., Bittercreek North sells some of them. Maybe a couple of others will chime in here with some other suppliers.

[topofmurrayhill]

Wick Your Wax scents are recommended at lower levels. They're from Canada and BCN sells them in the USA.

There are some B&B suppliers like Scent Works and Sweetcakes that are known for quality FOs. They're expensive and primarily blended for soap. It's about nuance and complex fragrance notes, not necessarily strong throw in candles. I'm still kind of experimenting with those to see how they throw at lower addition rates. They do have a lot of nice scents.

To a great extent you have to go scent by scent. Each one is a different animal. Even the middle tier suppliers have FOs you can use in smaller quantities but you have to evaluate them individually.