More Questions About 464

[GoldieMN]

The saga continues. . .

I've been testing 464 in an attempt to get a better hot throw as compared to 415. I'm confused on the pour temp. With 415, I followed instructions to pour at 110 which was the slushy stage. With 464, I'm seeing recommendations from 170 to 135, many again saying "slushy". My 464 is not slushy at any of these temps until it gets to about 100. So should I be pouring when slushy or when the wax gets to a particular temperature? And how does the pouring temp affect the candle? I'm using regular-mouth pint Ball jars, 780 Premier wicks (even though the Premier chart recommends something smaller), heating to 180 then adding 10% FO. Yes, I went to 10% because the last batch at 7.7% still didn't have the throw I wanted. I do wait the two weeks before testing.

GoldieMN

[Trappeur]

Hi Goldie,

 

Pouring determines what the finished candle will look like, if you have dips, craters.and unsmooth tops.  I use those jars and that wax with cd wicks and htps....but mostly cd's. For me, my ideal pour temperature to pour is about 149 lately, give or take....it depends too on how cold my house is.  Generally I get smooth glass like tops when I pour around that.  When I poured slushy, down to 100 or 105 give or take, I always get cottage cheese tops and have to top off the candle with another repour if I were to pour that low.  Now others I know do pour about that...but you have to just experiment what works best for you till you come up with the best temperature to get a smooth top.  Hope this helps a bit!

 

Sounds like your doing everything perfect to me.  And if your waiting those 2 weeks for a good cure that is awesome.  If you find your' not getting the throw after that time period, it most likely is one of these things.

 

1.  What ever fragrance you are testing just may not be a good one for that wax......so move on to another fragrance and just know not to order that one again..

2.  Upping the fragrance definitely could play into not a good throw but if you tried it at 6% and it didn't work, myself...I would know that one was a dud.

3.  Possibly maybe trying a different wick might work?  Now for me, I'm not going to go through all the testings of 6 different style wicks...that's just me...if it doesn't perform with my choice wicks.....then that oil I use for firestarters or even melts for myself.

4.  Curing is the key......it really is.

 

What scents are you testing and from where ???

 

Trappeur

[Guest OldGlory]

Goldie, try pouring around 140-150. I have heard that many people get fantastic results at that temp. I think the ambient temperature in your work area has an effect on the outcome. For me, sometimes I get nice tops, sometimes I don't, but I always reserve a small amount of wax to top off the ones that need a smoother top. Usually that's 9 out of 10.

Not all fragrances work in any given wax. Do you have someone to test them for you? It could just be you. Or it could be one that requires a longer cure.

[GoldieMN]

When I started pouring candles, I was using 6% oil. I had success with 415 and NG's Cinnamon Stick/Styx, RE's Christmas Bliss, Amish Quilt, Mac Apple, & Pumpkin Creme Brulee. Somewhere along the way I switched to Premier wicks (can't remember why). When I tried RE's Butter Rum Cappucino and Cornbread, I had no luck with hot throw. Upped the wick eventually to 780 and the oil to 8% which was better but still not enough hot throw for me. A few weeks ago, switched to 464 and started at about 7.7% oil. I figured I could live with 7-8% if it worked out. I got a good throw from RE's apple/pumpkin strudel. However, I tried the three pumpkin oils suggested on a post here, Pecan Waffle, Hanzel/Gretel, RE's Cinnabon, as well as the others that weren't working with 415. I get a good throw from Pecan Waffle but none of the others. That's why I thought I would give it one more go with 10%. I was hoping to have at least the Cornbread for my next sale; but there isn't enough time to cure now.

I have a couple family members who check out the hot throw and seem to agree with me.

GoldieMN

[nursekiki]

Goldie, I'm in the same boat as you, following this thread!

[GoldieMN]

Goldie, I'm in the same boat as you, following this thread!

You might find the following thread interesting as well. I just came across it as I just had my first candle seep oil. What else? lol That batch I am going to remelt and get the % down to 6 or 7%. So thankful to Trappeur and OldGlory with their suggestions as well as anyone else who wants to join in the discussion! Anyway, lots of info here:

http://www.craftserver.com/topic/105416-6-fo-versus-8-fo/page-1?hl=seeping

GoldieMN

[Guest OldGlory]

Goldie, I may have given you bad advice recently - I thought you were using 464. So if I advised you on something that was for 415, NOT 464, I apologize.

I did not have any luck with 415. I tried it earlier this year with a fragrance oil I know works in 464 and throw very well - and 415 did not give me the same fragrance throw. It was noticeably weaker in 415. For about a month after I poured the 415 I did not have frost, but the frost showed up eventually with the 415, as bad as with 464. So I decided to stick with 464.

[GoldieMN]

Goldie, I may have given you bad advice recently - I thought you were using 464. So if I advised you on something that was for 415, NOT 464, I apologize.

I did not have any luck with 415. I tried it earlier this year with a fragrance oil I know works in 464 and throw very well - and 415 did not give me the same fragrance throw. It was noticeably weaker in 415. For about a month after I poured the 415 I did not have frost, but the frost showed up eventually with the 415, as bad as with 464. So I decided to stick with 464.

Nope, you didn't give me bad advice. I was using 415 then switched to 464 when I wasn't getting the hot throw I wanted with a couple of fragrances. So your advice is on target.

After my fall sale next week, I'm going to start testing everything with 6%; going to test as many samples as I can starting with those recommended by a number of you on this board. Anything that doesn't work, gets shelved.

Thanks for all your help.

GoldieMN

[Shoegal]

I pour my 464 when it's slushy and my tops are normally fine. When I poured hot, like around 170, I had great tops as well. I almost always got sink holes and awful frosting when I poured at 135. 464 behaves strangely in my environment. I get the best throw when I add my scent right before pouring. I realize this doesn't work for everyone, but it's what has worked for me. 464 can be temperamental, but it is a really great wax once you get it figured out.

[GoldieMN]

I pour my 464 when it's slushy and my tops are normally fine. When I poured hot, like around 170, I had great tops as well. I almost always got sink holes and awful frosting when I poured at 135. 464 behaves strangely in my environment. I get the best throw when I add my scent right before pouring. I realize this doesn't work for everyone, but it's what has worked for me. 464 can be temperamental, but it is a really great wax once you get it figured out.

Wow, now that is interesting, adding scent right before pouring. I've always added my oil at 180. Is that my problem??? Need to go back and reread some threads.

GoldieMN