Paintguru

4 hours ago, Pam W said:

Ya know, you should always have a bottle of Patch on hand.......it can be blended with soooo many other FOs to give a nice throw.......once you get into blending (which will come soon because one day you'll get a wild hair to pour something different....patch, musk and amber should always be on hand to compliment many other scents)  Mix that red current with patch and see what comes out.......that said, I'm one for blending various FO just to see what happens.

Pam, what is your starting point for how much patch to add to a second scent?  I'm thinking < 25% since it is meant to compliment more than take over the scent.  

On 5/20/2018 at 7:51 PM, ellajoan said:

Thanks, Sarah.  I'm looking at Pumpkin Chai from The Flaming Candle, too.  Sounds interesting!

OOB, I love this scent.  I haven't tested it in a candle yet though.  

Yeah I may try a Eco 4/6.  I've liked Eco thus far and wouldn't mind continuing to use them.  I can't find paper cores at my regular suppliers (or I'm too stupid to know what to look for)....what and where does one order when using paper cores?

7 minutes ago, TallTayl said:

In my humblest opinion, All but zinc were pretty well overwicked. I’d bump down several sizes at least. 

 

If if I were using eco, I’d start at about a 2 or at most a 4. Those generate some serious burn power

 

4630 is such a different wax. It will weep wax from the walls without a super deep middle in melt pool. 

 

I would use a paper core in the 44- similar to the zinc, personally. 

I went off the recommendations from the supplier and chose the smallest and middle of the road one.  I almost thought the Eco 8 was a bit underpowered with the residual wax on the side until it melted it at the end.    

I can't seem to post in the official wick test subforum, so if someone wants to move this, feel free.  I ordered a bunch of wick samples and tried a few with my 2.75" diameter tins.  I didn't do any measurements, and I burned them as I feel a typical user would...randomly.  Sometimes I had them run long, other times, they were short burns.  Attached is the progression of each of the samples, along with the wick ID.  No fragrance was used.

Initial burn.  The zinc 34-40 was clearly underpowered for this candle setup.  The other zinc mushroomed pretty quickly off the bat.  

.

Burn #2.  The CDs seem to burn pretty hot, with a big flame.  Even the small zinc mushroomed a bit.  I prefer the burn pattern and flame size of the two Prems, HTP73, and the Eco8.

Burn #3:  Same story (IMO).  Two Prems, along with the HTP73 and the Eco have left a little wax on the edge, but that is melting slowly but surely.  CD's are fully melted, with the HTP93 almost completely melted as well.  Zinc 44-24-8 seems like the right power, but still significant mushrooming.

Final Result:  CDs showing minor mushrooming as well, along with the zinc.  I feel like the Eco8, the Prems, and the HTPs did pretty well, however the Prems and the HTPs left some residual soot on the edge of the tin that the Eco did not seem to leave.  

Not that I deny something happens, but from a pure physics standpoint, I have a hard time figuring out what could possibly happen during curing.  Once the wax solidifies, there shouldn't be any additional molecular motion.  I could see something happening to the FO before I can see something happening to the wax itself.  

I did find some papers and the referenced dissertation on the crystallization of waxes, but again, this should all change during the primary cooling process, not the "aging" process.  

https://digitalcommons.usu.edu/cgi/viewcontent.cgi?referer=https://www.google.com/&httpsredir=1&article=6139&context=etd

2 hours ago, Trappeur said:

Well, I'm liking what I read on these posts so far and am going to give it a shot the 4630.  Then I'm liking the 125 people use.  But for the sheer purpose to order 4630 from Flaming, that would be my best bet.  

If I order 4630 from Flaming (60 pounds) at 100.49 plus  shipping of  27.62 would be 128.11

If I order 125 from Candlewick (51pounds) at 81.30 plus 50.67 (wow! shipping is terrible) it would be 131.97

So actually they are both the same price....I would just gain 9 more pounds from Flaming....

So the better buy is 4630 from Flaming...

 

I just ordered a ton of wick samplers to see what works for the 4630 (HTP, CD, Premier 700, already have Eco).  I'll keep you updated with my results (even though I'm sure results already exist from other folks).  

5 minutes ago, Trappeur said:

Ok..............let me pose another question at you all.....

Ok, so I'm hearing that 4630 is a great wax that people love on it's own.  So if it is that wonderful why are you all trying to blend it with soy since 4630 stands on it's own?  Is it a thing that you all are doing because we all live in a "soy" world and that is supposedly "THE" wax because it is supposed to be better in this "GREEN" world we live in?   See, I would think if it is such a wonderful thrower "why try and fix something that ain't broke"?  You know right off the bat that supposedly the hot throw on a soy candle is no comparison to a candle in Paraffin.  Correct me if I'm wrong here.  I would think adding soy to 4630 is going to diminish the excellent throw of this paraffin candle to something of a lesser throw.  That's what I think.  Right?  So why jeopardize a great candle to begin with?   I'm  trying to understand the logistics of why everyone wants to blend when they don't have to?????KWIM???

 

Trappeur

 

Totally understand.  Just in my case as a not-yet-seller, I have C3 hanging around and just want to experiment.  I'll likely try it blended and unblended and see which one I like better.  

2 hours ago, TallTayl said:

@Paintguru C3 with 2% Universal Soy Additive pretty much solved any cosmetic issues I was having with C3. You'll  possibly need a wick up, but that's a good thing to get that HT!

 

4630 is "OK" with C3, but does not hand over the magic key to perfection.

Understood.  I actually have had reasonable luck with C3 thus far, but I wanted to see if the blend improved anything.  May end up switching to 100% 4630 if it blows me away on its own.  

3 hours ago, TallTayl said:

@Trappeur

this 8 oz tin is 4630 with a paper wick 44-24-18 from candles and supplies.net

scent is my dragons blood 6%

one drop of liquid red color.

 

pictured is a couple of hours into the 4th burn. Yesterday I let it burn for 8 hours without needing to do one bit of maintenance on it. I really wish I had just started with this wax a decade ago. It is so easy all the way around. 

I just ordered a 10 lb sample of 4630.  My plan is to blend it with my C3 and see how that works out.  I'm hoping its benefits transfer over to the C3 and make it more stable with enhanced HT.  

24 minutes ago, ncraiders said:

I just started candle making for myself and have been looking for a different type of wax other than soy since it is so iffy at the moment.  I have been looking at palm wax recently and would also like to hear some about it from people that use it.  

Yeah the Elite 200 sounds interesting as a non-paraffin alternative, especially if it boosts consistency and HT over 100% soy.

So from what people are hearing, are parasoy waxes having the same batch to batch issues that straight soy wax is having?  I may jump on whatever wax is suggested for Trappeur :).  

Hmm, this is an interesting topic.  I've just started with all my testing of C3, and have had what I consider to be good results.  However, as others have been posting, this could all go in the crapper with my next batch.  As I haven't established a customer base yet, I wonder if I should switch over to a paraffin blend or even straight paraffin (heaven forbid!!).  I feel like half of candle buyers just want a nice smelling candle and the other half are focused on the wax makeup.  

I'm in the same boat, and I assume most new candle sellers are.  The hard part (IMO) is covering the cost of insurance and business licensing (varies by state).  If insurance is $400 and I'm making say $4-8 profit per candle, that is 50-100 candles per year sold just to cover that!!  

20 minutes ago, kandlekrazy said:

I think the last time I bought some I had to get them on Ebay because EBC quit carrying them.  I think I was in the same boat, looked everywhere at every supplier.  Amazon carries them as well but the biggest I  could find was like 3 oz.

Yeah that is where I was as well.  3 oz. is fine, but the bulk pricing isn't the greatest.  May be stuck with malibus.  

Has anyone solved this riddle yet?  I've been looking for these tubes as well with little luck beyond what is shown above.  The SKS malibu tubes are a great deal, but not exactly what I was looking for.  

Besides the marshmallow, I did see in another thread someone suggest adding a little to tobacco.  I thought of adding it to a leaves fragrance in the hopes it would smell like burning leaves.  Good luck!

Glad I'm not the only one with this issue!

On 4/5/2018 at 10:17 AM, Candybee said:

 

HSCG won't cover you if you only make candles. You have to make soap and or cosmetics. You'll have to find another carrier for candles.

Right...but you only need one product on the soap/cosmetic side for them to also cover candles.  Seems like the way to go.  

59 minutes ago, Candybee said:

When I first started I had a candle business and was thinking along the same lines. But I learned some good lessons along the way. Making candle's on demand can be problematic especially if you plan to carry a large number of scents.

 

For one thing, carrying a large number of scents means a lot of money up front to buy all those fragrances, pay the shipping, and storing them. If you are running a business that can eat away at any profit having too many scents and can also run you out of the business if you aren't careful.

 

If you are planning to make candles on demand for your website then this can interfere with events in your life, holidays, and weekends you plan to do shows and days you plan to make candles for the events. It can also mess you up when you get multiple orders but not all at the same time. It works better to have inventory ahead of time if you plan to sell on a website. Not saying it can't be done but am saying it is problematic and it would mean you have to be able to fulfill an order even if your time is compromised. Plus don't forget stock supplies. If at any time you are out of something, wicks, wax, jars, FO, etc. and get an order you can't fill it until you restock. If you already have inventory, then you can pull it off the shelf without having to scramble to order supplies.

Understood, and I agree that much of the expense tied up in supplies is really in the fragrance oils and how many one chooses to carry.  Like I said, perhaps the way to go is to start small on the # of fragrances (3-5 scents in 4-5 categories) and then adjust/add as the market seems to dictate.  Have 3-5 of each scent and size in stock and make additional ones as others sell.  Wax, wicks, and containers are fragrance agnostic, and can be aided by economy of scale.  Until the business get's off the ground, everything else is played by ear (I think).  

10 minutes ago, Candybee said:

 

i only do candles in the fall & holiday season and don't carry them year round. I also don't sell them on my website. My website is mostly for showcasing my soap. I run a soap company after all so its mostly about soap.

 

For candles, choosing the number of scents you carry is easier if you have a theme in mind. I have a set up that holds a certain amount of scents. Since I can fit 2 risers on my table and they each hold 7 jars across each step, carrying 14 scents was an easy decision and made sense. I also do only fall and holiday scents so doing 14 scents gives my customers a good variety of themed scents.

Ah perfect.  Yeah I haven't even gotten into planning any sort of craft fair display yet.  I can imagine soaps and candles are the same way where you don't want too few or too many scents.  My thought is that one has a full lineup on their website that they can make "on demand" (not really possible in the soap making world), and then if/when I do a show, I would bring a subset of those scents with and display what makes sense.  It is all just new and slightly anxiety inducing, that is all :).  

16 hours ago, Candybee said:

Something else that isn't mentioned so far is that I have found that too many scents actually confuse customers and can kill a sale. I used to carry 30-40+ scents when I first started too and have since learned to cut back to what fits on my risers. It makes the display look more professional to have all your same scents lined up together.  My customers seem to like the how they can easily find what they are looking for and its a lot easier on me to make more of 14 scents than 40+.

 

Plus it doesn't matter how many scents you have to choose from, there is ALWAYS a customer that wants something you don't have. I just point them to something similar and can often turn it into a sale.

Good points.  Now have you reduced your scent selection for both live shows and your web sales or just for the live shows?  I'm testing a choosing my fragrances as we speak, and it will be hard to figure out my final number of scent choices.  Plus, I guess there is no rule that you can't add more scents later once sales start to increase!!  

40 minutes ago, country bee said:

Yeah,they do! Some reviews say that it is not very strong,I was kinda put off by that but I may order a sample to see. Thank you.

I have a sample of it, but haven't tried it in candle yet.  

The Flaming Candle has a good pipe tobacco.  I have yet to find a good coffee.  

I really like Apple Ginger Crust from The Flaming Candle.