HorseScentS Posted August 29, 2012 Share Posted August 29, 2012 (edited) Since my test of those fancy, cute, narrow-necked hinged-lid Hobby Lobby jars failed miserably, I put them in my oven at 170 and remelted them, then poured a couple of pint masons with the melted wax. I'm using 4627 and HTP 104 and 105 wicks, w/ CS Hazelnut Coffee. How long do I have to wait before test burning these for wick size? For a freshly poured paraffin candle I wait at least 12 hours, or even a day or two, but this was remelted at a lower temp, so do I have to wait as long? Edited August 29, 2012 by HorsescentS Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chefmom Posted August 29, 2012 Share Posted August 29, 2012 I usually give my 6006 parasoy and my paraffin blended pillars 24 hours to cure before testing. I know I've read a lot about soy curing longer, but paraffin doesn't seem to need it like soy does. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HorseScentS Posted August 29, 2012 Author Share Posted August 29, 2012 I usually give my 6006 parasoy and my paraffin blended pillars 24 hours to cure before testing. I know I've read a lot about soy curing longer, but paraffin doesn't seem to need it like soy does.Thanks, Chefmom. I was hoping that because they had aleady cured for a couple of days when I first made them, I wouldn't have to wait as long after remelting and re-pouring them into new containers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrsPacNW Posted August 29, 2012 Share Posted August 29, 2012 Burn those babies..Zero reason why not. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HorseScentS Posted August 29, 2012 Author Share Posted August 29, 2012 Burn those babies..Zero reason why not. Really??? Yay! It's been almost 6 hours since I made them anyway.... Oh, goody!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HorseScentS Posted August 30, 2012 Author Share Posted August 30, 2012 (edited) I tried burning the candles and it was a disaster. I'm so sad, I don't know what to do. I don't know if it's because they needed more time to harden, or if it's impossible to wick 4627 in the regular mouth pint mason.Each jar is about 2/3 of the way full. I lit them up with an HTP 104 and a 105. They immediately smoked like crazy, so I trimmed the wicks down to 1/8" and the HTP 104 burned nicely for about 10 minutes and then started drowning, so I poured off some of the wax, and got another 10 minutes out of it before it drowned again. The 105 still smoked like crazy, so I replaced it with an HTP 93, which didn't smoke and was burning nicely until it too drowned. Is it possible to wick 4627 with HTP's in the regular mouth pint mason? It's a Ball jar, the one with the numbers on the sides. The scent and HT was fabulous! Can it be done? or am I wasting my time? I did search the forum for info on wicking that jar with my wax and didn't find much, except a suggestion to try HTP 105 and go from there, and also I think someone said they were using an HTP 93. Edited August 30, 2012 by HorsescentS Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chefmom Posted August 30, 2012 Share Posted August 30, 2012 Are you sure it's not HTP'S?? I like them, especially since they seem to trim themselves, but I have had the same issues using HTPs in my votives. They do great, you turn around and they drown out.I did use some 93s and 104s in jelly jars in my first big rounds of testing, but they lost out to the LXs (6006 parasoy)I also tried 104, 105, and 126 in my early paraffin blend pillars, and I liked the tunnel with the glow but I didn't think customers would go for such a large amount of wasted wax, so again I moved on.The biggest thing I remember about using them with my votives was I needed to cut the wick on the long side for the first burn. Then the flame was big enough in the beginning to do its job, however I couldn't control a customer trimming a wick to the 1/4-inch before burning, so I gave up on them.I don't wait long to try out my 6006 with LX wicks, maybe the HTP need a longer cure.Wicks will be the death of us all !!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
glowworm Posted August 30, 2012 Share Posted August 30, 2012 (edited) I feel your frustration with all of this testing, remelting and more testing and remelting. I use a blend of 6006 and parrafin but I am never able to make it more than a day before testing...at least just for the burn. I think for the most part this is sufficient but my trouble comes in after that. I usually start my tests in the morning so the first round is done around 11 or 12, but my quandry is when to do that second burn. Every time I break down and retest that same day (unless its late in the day) my wick data gets all thrown off. It almost always melts much quicker therefore ending in drowning wicks or a huge melt pool too early with outrageously hot glass....when will I ever learn Now, if I take that same candle and wait till the next day for the wax to be thoroughly cooled I can either have the same experiences or a great success. There have been many times when I would have thrown out a successful candle combo if I would have based my results on tests done too close together.That being said I don't think burning too early should cause all that smoking...that definitely sounds like more of a wick/wax combo issue. But, given that I'm not an expert I could be wrong. Maybe if your wicks aren't smoking, just drowning, try waiting a bit longer for them to really cool and test again. Not sure if it will make a difference but it couldn't hurt:) Edited August 30, 2012 by glowworm Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrsPacNW Posted August 30, 2012 Share Posted August 30, 2012 (edited) Slab wick testing..This may help...according to candle science they recommend Eco's for this wax.I can't even fathom a guess...since I've never poured a paraffin wax.But your issues on the new repour..do not sound like it's that process that caused the problem. Edited August 30, 2012 by MrsPacNW Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robertgibbens Posted August 30, 2012 Share Posted August 30, 2012 I use htp 93 to 104 with 4627. Wicking 3 inch diameter tins. Never smoke. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HorseScentS Posted August 30, 2012 Author Share Posted August 30, 2012 I use htp 93 to 104 with 4627. Wicking 3 inch diameter tins. Never smoke.Interesting! Thank you! I wonder if that combo would work for you in a 3 inch diameter container that was taller than tins, but still straight-sided like tins. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HorseScentS Posted August 30, 2012 Author Share Posted August 30, 2012 (edited) Are you sure it's not HTP'S?? I like them, especially since they seem to trim themselves, but I have had the same issues using HTPs in my votives. They do great, you turn around and they drown out.I did use some 93s and 104s in jelly jars in my first big rounds of testing, but they lost out to the LXs (6006 parasoy)I also tried 104, 105, and 126 in my early paraffin blend pillars, and I liked the tunnel with the glow but I didn't think customers would go for such a large amount of wasted wax, so again I moved on.The biggest thing I remember about using them with my votives was I needed to cut the wick on the long side for the first burn. Then the flame was big enough in the beginning to do its job, however I couldn't control a customer trimming a wick to the 1/4-inch before burning, so I gave up on them.I don't wait long to try out my 6006 with LX wicks, maybe the HTP need a longer cure.Wicks will be the death of us all !!!Oh, yes! The HTP wicks do seem tempramental, always either drowning or smoking if conditions are not just perfect, but they're recommended to work best with 4627 and I feel safer knowing they'll self-trim pretty well, and the HT is fabulous. It might be easier to use zincs, which I really like, but if the customer doesn't trim the wick the flame gets so big and scary! I'd worry too much about customers burning down their houses. Maybe you're right about the HTPs needing a longer cure. Edited August 30, 2012 by HorsescentS Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HorseScentS Posted August 30, 2012 Author Share Posted August 30, 2012 (edited) I feel your frustration with all of this testing, remelting and more testing and remelting. I use a blend of 6006 and parrafin but I am never able to make it more than a day before testing...at least just for the burn. I think for the most part this is sufficient but my trouble comes in after that. I usually start my tests in the morning so the first round is done around 11 or 12, but my quandry is when to do that second burn. Every time I break down and retest that same day (unless its late in the day) my wick data gets all thrown off. It almost always melts much quicker therefore ending in drowning wicks or a huge melt pool too early with outrageously hot glass....when will I ever learn Now, if I take that same candle and wait till the next day for the wax to be thoroughly cooled I can either have the same experiences or a great success. There have been many times when I would have thrown out a successful candle combo if I would have based my results on tests done too close together.That being said I don't think burning too early should cause all that smoking...that definitely sounds like more of a wick/wax combo issue. But, given that I'm not an expert I could be wrong. Maybe if your wicks aren't smoking, just drowning, try waiting a bit longer for them to really cool and test again. Not sure if it will make a difference but it couldn't hurt:)Maybe you're right about me burning too soon, because I noticed the melt pools were enlarging much too fast and faster than they normally would have. Well, this is a sticky wicket because if a customer burns a candle, blows it out to run to the store, comes back a couple or hours later and relights the candle they'll get smoking or drowning wicks or a too-fast melt with insanely hot glass? When I buy a candle I like to burn-extinguish-burn-extinguish several times all in the same day, myself. Or do you still have this problem when your candles are a few days or weeks old? I think I've been able to burn-extinguish-burn-extinguish close together in the same day with my candles that cured longer...hmmm... not even sure now, my brain is tired of this testing madness. Edited August 30, 2012 by HorsescentS Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HorseScentS Posted August 30, 2012 Author Share Posted August 30, 2012 Slab wick testing..This may help...according to candle science they recommend Eco's for this wax.I can't even fathom a guess...since I've never poured a paraffin wax.But your issues on the new repour..do not sound like it's that process that caused the problem.Thank you, maybe I'll try Eco's at some point. I never thought of that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
glowworm Posted August 30, 2012 Share Posted August 30, 2012 Maybe you're right about me burning too soon, because I noticed the melt pools were enlarging much too fast and faster than they normally would have. Well, this is a sticky wicket because if a customer burns a candle, blows it out to run to the store, comes back a couple or hours later and relights the candle they'll get smoking or drowning wicks or a too-fast melt with insanely hot glass? When I buy a candle I like to burn-extinguish-burn-extinguish several times all in the same day, myself. Or do you still have this problem when your candles are a few days or weeks old? I think I've been able to burn-extinguish-burn-extinguish close together in the same day with my candles that cured longer...hmmm... not even sure now, my brain is tired of this testing madness.This phenomenon usually only occurs when I am doing power burns. I am an extreme power burner when I test just to be sure they are going to be safe when in the hands of customers. If I am only lighting them for a couple hours blowing out, lighting and blowing out I rarely have these problems. I should probably also note that I only experience this on my double wicked jars. I have had the same experience though with some of the bigger name double wicked candles as well...mainly the slatkin ones. Love them, but I have to adjust my burning of them when I see the wicks starting to struggle. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HorseScentS Posted August 30, 2012 Author Share Posted August 30, 2012 This phenomenon usually only occurs when I am doing power burns. I am an extreme power burner when I test just to be sure they are going to be safe when in the hands of customers. If I am only lighting them for a couple hours blowing out, lighting and blowing out I rarely have these problems. I should probably also note that I only experience this on my double wicked jars. I have had the same experience though with some of the bigger name double wicked candles as well...mainly the slatkin ones. Love them, but I have to adjust my burning of them when I see the wicks starting to struggle.I like to power burn too, and maybe me melting down the wax and re-pouring it created the same wax conditions of a major power burn, so good point. I've heard the Slatkins have problems with drowning wicks and that the secret is to never trim their wicks, but I've never tried one. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rjdaines Posted August 30, 2012 Share Posted August 30, 2012 I like to power burn too, and maybe me melting down the wax and re-pouring it created the same wax conditions of a major power burn, so good point. I've heard the Slatkins have problems with drowning wicks and that the secret is to never trim their wicks, but I've never tried one.Daughters used to work of BBW and we had plenty of their candles and at time the wicks did seem to drown but telling people NOT the true seems wrong. Slatkin should find better wicks.Regarding the Mason jars: while not a identical comparison I use similar jars with my 4630/464 blend and wick with HTP-83 if the FO is not too heavy. Ink Sugar for example works very well as does Jamaica Me Crazy. Flames are well behaved and no obvious soot. Trim before each burn. I find that the parasoy works well and the soy turns down the paraffin burn a bit without sacrificing HT. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HorseScentS Posted August 30, 2012 Author Share Posted August 30, 2012 (edited) Daughters used to work of BBW and we had plenty of their candles and at time the wicks did seem to drown but telling people NOT the true seems wrong. Slatkin should find better wicks.Regarding the Mason jars: while not a identical comparison I use similar jars with my 4630/464 blend and wick with HTP-83 if the FO is not too heavy. Ink Sugar for example works very well as does Jamaica Me Crazy. Flames are well behaved and no obvious soot. Trim before each burn. I find that the parasoy works well and the soy turns down the paraffin burn a bit without sacrificing HT.Thanks, rj. I've noticed the wick sizes seem similar for 4627 and parasoy, so maybe I should be testing those two candles with HTP 93 and 83 because they're taller jars and will trap more heat.I might try mixing soy with my 4627 someday, too. Or, actually, I've been really wanting to try 6098 parasoy, but first I want to master the 4627. Edited August 30, 2012 by HorsescentS Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HorseScentS Posted August 31, 2012 Author Share Posted August 31, 2012 :bliss:Success! I lit both candles today, (after scooping and leveling the wax tops a bit because both had tunneled while burning crazy yesterday), and the HTP 104 was over wicked, but the 93 was PERFECT!!! I burned it for a few hours, the HT was fabulous, the burn was clean with a nice steady flame which only flickered gently, the wax got down to half way in the jar and the FMP was never too deep, maybe 1/4" to at the most 1/2" or less, the glass was comfortably hot to hold, so it's looking good...real good! Hope all goes well when it gets down to the last 3rd of the jar. From now on I'm going to have to be more patient and wait at least 24 hours before testing, but even 48 hours might be better. Thanks for all your help, you guys! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chefmom Posted August 31, 2012 Share Posted August 31, 2012 Isn't is just great when it actually works!!!????? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HorseScentS Posted August 31, 2012 Author Share Posted August 31, 2012 (edited) Isn't is just great when it actually works!!!?????Yep, once in a blue moon it works! (It's a blue moon tonight.) http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencetech/article-2195185/Blue-Moon-2012-Rare-calendar-phenomenon-occurs-today.html Edited August 31, 2012 by HorsescentS Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrsPacNW Posted September 1, 2012 Share Posted September 1, 2012 (edited) LOL...good joke HorsescentS.. I'm glad you got it figured out..I tend to "under" wick by some's standards..but I don't want a hot jar..and most of my candles do not clean the sides until that last third..but by the time the wick tab is hit (wick is spent)..the only wax left is level with the tab bottom..the sides are clean..So you can grab the "burning" candle and blow it out if you need to. It's not to hot. Interesting to note that in your wax it was necessary to let it harden REALLY good before burning. Edited September 1, 2012 by MrsPacNW spelling errors..lol.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HorseScentS Posted September 1, 2012 Author Share Posted September 1, 2012 (edited) LOL...good joke HorsescentS.. I'm glad you got it figured out..I tend to "under" wick by some's standards..but I don't want a hot jar..and most of my candles do not clean the sides until that last third..but by the time the wick tab is hit (wick is spent)..the only wax left is level with the tab bottom..the sides are clean..So you can grab the "burning" candle and blow it out if you need to. It's not to hot. Interesting to note that in your wax it was necessary to let it harden REALLY good before burning.Your way is the safest way of doing it, and if you can do that without your wick drowning that's awesome! My jar is hot but I can hold it in my hand, so I'm starting the last third today and hope it doesn't get too hot. If I wicked down to HTP 83 I don't think it would work, I'm afraid it would be under-wicked and drown/tunnel, etc. So I hope and pray the last third of the jar will work with the HTP 93 I've got in there now.Yep, the 4627 was is almost as soft as Vaseline, so I guess that's why it needs a day or two to get good and hard before testing. Looking back I can see that I've tested too soon at times and had problems with either lots of smoking or with drowning wicks, impossible to get it right when the wax is too soft. Edited September 1, 2012 by HorsescentS Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrsPacNW Posted September 1, 2012 Share Posted September 1, 2012 Mental note to me..Stay away from 4627...LOL...I've been using EL Container for years..tried other soys and some were just to finicky..I've never had any case of wax from EL be different in performance from the last in all these years.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robertgibbens Posted September 3, 2012 Share Posted September 3, 2012 Yes. I use the exact same wicks in my 3 inch diameter glass. They burn well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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