lmc Posted January 18, 2012 Share Posted January 18, 2012 ..I tried following the suggestions given but my candles have horrible, crumbly tops since Ive been testing with usa. I tested 1 tsp and then 1 tbs pp, tried pouring at 115*, 130*, & 165*, candles were spaced 1" apart on cookie rack with large box over them in my kitchen with house temp of 72*. Every single time and every candle has this bumpy, crumbly top! I stoppedvadding the CO because I thought it was causing the fo seepage, but my candles were doing much better when I just used CO. Insight anyone? Maybe usa just isnt for my system Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stella1952 Posted January 18, 2012 Share Posted January 18, 2012 Where did you get your USA? I wondering if you may have gotten UA by mistake... Universal Additive is for paraffin; USA is unversal soy additive...Photos would be helpful... What FO and amount are you using? This really is quite unusual... I have seen the "scabies" tops a couple of times but those were "my bad" and were very uncommon problems. Most of the C3 with USA issues I have had were from uneven cooling or dye/FO combinations that didn't play nice and caused frosting.This is what a typical batch of C3 candles should resemble: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lmc Posted January 18, 2012 Author Share Posted January 18, 2012 Stella mine look nothing like that They smooth out but ONLY with use of heatgun-which Ive mentioned I dont like using pita...I use 1oz fo to 12ox wax...Ive always used this amount w/o complications till now. I know its suggested to use 6% but Im happy with ht at this ratio. Feeling a little disheartened...CBA was SO much easier lol. Im starting on my 2nd case and cant believe I dont have this down yet. Only thing I havent tried yet is to use no additives and just temper. CO really helps wax look smooth after a burn compared to no co...frustrated...just cant get the tops right Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lmc Posted January 18, 2012 Author Share Posted January 18, 2012 (edited) Stella, should I lower the amount of usa to 1 tsp pp and maybe not put box over it? Pour temps arent beingbcooperative either....All I want is smooth tops...is that too much to ask for? AARRRGGGH...usa came from the the candlemakers store Edited January 18, 2012 by lmc Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moonshine Posted January 19, 2012 Share Posted January 19, 2012 crap- there is where I just got mine from... have not used it yet but that is not good to hear! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
deb426 Posted January 19, 2012 Share Posted January 19, 2012 Try cooling without covering them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sherry Posted January 19, 2012 Share Posted January 19, 2012 I would like to know have anyone use both USA And coconut oil in the C3 at the same time and what results did they have :smiley2: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lmc Posted January 19, 2012 Author Share Posted January 19, 2012 Thx, I will try that in the morning...frustrating cuz I know smooth tops are achievableMoonshine, I bought it from there because so many here suggested them so I wouldnt worry...Im positive its something that Im doing or not doing lol... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lmc Posted January 19, 2012 Author Share Posted January 19, 2012 Sherry, I posted on 1-12 under thread "FO Seepage"...for me adding both to C3 made a mess out of the tops-I had fo covering the tops! Still in early stages of trying additives tho Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stella1952 Posted January 19, 2012 Share Posted January 19, 2012 (edited) I have never used USA from them. The stuff I use is cream colored, very fine granules and came from another source. Mine does not look like what is pictured on their website at the link below:http://www.thecandlemakersstore.com/category/additives.universal_additive/Did you check your invoice to see if the product number for the item they shipped matches the one on their site? I don't KNOW that the stuff you purchased is different, but that might explain the difference in result. Others have purchased from them and I haven't read any complaints, so I am wondering if there was an error either in ordering or what was sent...This is disturbing because USA was always hard to find. When JBN closed, I bought a buttload from a different source (same stuff) but their website is no longer in operation... very troubling indeed...When we discussed USA here many years ago, it was reported to be distilled monoglycerides, the brand possibly Panalite manufactured by ADM. DMG (distilled monoglyceride) was briefly mentioned in this Elevance Newsletter from March 2011:http://www.naturewax.com/docs/newsletter_201103.pdf I hate heat guns, too. While they will smooth out minor problems, in my experience they make more trouble than they are worth with soy candles and even the best heat gunned results do not resemble what a smooth top looks like when all goes well and no heat gun is used (like the ones in the photo above)... Edited January 19, 2012 by Stella1952 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stella1952 Posted January 19, 2012 Share Posted January 19, 2012 (edited) I know its suggested to use 6% but Im happy with ht at this ratio... Im starting on my 2nd case and cant believe I dont have this down yet. Only thing I havent tried yet is to use no additives and just temper.I find that astonishing! 50# and still rough tops? There is something very wrong happening for sure.Stella, should I lower the amount of usa to 1 tsp pp and maybe not put box over it?Here's what I would do for testing purposes:Don't use anything but C3. No FO, no wick, no nuttin' but C3. Melt 8 oz. wax to 185°F, hold for about 5 minutes, then turn off the melter, add 2 oz. more of wax & stir continuously to the point where the wax becomes opaque and has a shiny, satiny appearance. Hold there for 5 minutes then, stirring constantly, increase the temp back to 165°F & pour. Cool on a rack in your microwave - no heat, no box. See what happens with that.If that goes well, melt 12 oz. of wax to 185°F. Hold for 5 minutes, then add 4 oz. of wax and stir down to the same point as above. Then run the temp back up, stirring, and add 1 oz. prewarmed FO (110°-120°F) at 185°F, stir down to 165°F and pour. Cool as above. See how that works out. If all is well with that, THEN do this again with a wick. Edited January 19, 2012 by Stella1952 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lmc Posted January 19, 2012 Author Share Posted January 19, 2012 (edited) Weird...my usa does NOT look like their picture at all...my bag is labeled universal soy additive and is very fine granules. Should I try 1/2 tbs. to 12oz? I am determined to get smooth tops even if it takes me another case! Ive got the wicking down, no frosting, love the ht, but the #@*%! tops....just saw your post...ok back to square one...one variable at a time Edited January 19, 2012 by lmc Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moonshine Posted January 19, 2012 Share Posted January 19, 2012 Here is a couple pictures of what I received from Candlemakers- 1 pic is of USA and 1 of Palm Stearic Acid- the USA does not look like their website at all but the palm doesStella- does yours look like this? It is cream up against the palm and in the close up you can see small granules...Imc- does this look like yours?I hope this is right before I dive into it tomorrow:shocked2: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beth Posted January 19, 2012 Share Posted January 19, 2012 Weird...my usa does NOT look like their picture at all...my bag is labeled universal soy additive and is very fine granules. Should I try 1/2 tbs. to 12oz? I am determined to get smooth tops even if it takes me another case! Ive got the wicking down, no frosting, love the ht, but the #@*%! tops....just saw your post...ok back to square one...one variable at a timeI have USA from CMS also & it's the very fine granules. Nothing like their picture unless the picture is super-magnified. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stella1952 Posted January 19, 2012 Share Posted January 19, 2012 Judging from what you have reported, lmc, I think you have the correct stuff.I have some specific questions.Are you making 1 candle at a time?If so, what is the weight required to fill that container? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lmc Posted January 19, 2012 Author Share Posted January 19, 2012 Moonshine, yes mine looks like that-very fine granulesStella...I usually make 2-16oz canning jars at a time...12oz wax & 1oz fo per jar..or 3-8oz jelly jars w/18oz wax& 1.5oz fo I heat wax with whichever additive Im testing to 185, remove from stove (use double boiler), cool to 100, put back on stove and heat back up to 185* add dye-stir till disolved, remove from heat, add fo at 170-175, stir gently 2 minutes, then stir off and on till pour temp...which I have tried from 165 down to 115*. I then pour and jars set on a cookie rack with large box over it. I had better results as far as no wet spots or frosting at 115*. As I mentioned, tempering and co really makes the wax look good after burns. I have not noticed any benefit as of yet using usa. The reason I wanted to try it is to get smooth tops, but now the tops are even worse. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stella1952 Posted January 19, 2012 Share Posted January 19, 2012 (edited) We'll get this figured out. :-) Edited January 19, 2012 by Stella1952 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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