Just starting out

[cary]

Hello,

Im just starting out and made my very first candles today! I want to get started doing this as a home business, but have so much to learn. Im so glad to finelly fine a forum that is so informative and active! I have only made 3 candles and I'm using a soy container blend wax. My containers are 8oz and 2oz tins w/lids. I used 10oz of wax (weighed) and .5oz Cucumber melon FO (weighed). I also used a liquid dye and added 1 drop each of blue and yellow, which gave me a light to medium bluish green. I don't know all the terms yet, but find that the more I check the site out the more I have learned. I am just testing the waters on this first pour, to see what I come up with. So far I have noticed that my candles have a rough top I poured my wax at 100* added my FO and color at 125* I also noticed that there is a crust on top, I'm guessing this is called bloom? I havent dont a test burn on them as of yet. I'm also guessing they need to cure first completely before the test burn. My wicks are 60-44-18C soy for the 8oz. tin and a 44-24-18C soy for the 2oz. tin. The 8oz. tin has a dia. of 3" and the 2oz hav a dia. of 2" depth of the 8oz. is 2" and the depth of the 2oz. is 1.5" (if this is of importance)

I found that when I measured my 10oz's of wax thinking I would have enough to make 1 each of the 8oz and 2oz I ended up with enough wax for another 2oz tin. Is this normal? I'm learning as I go with this first pour. and would like any comment good or bad as to what could be causing the bloom and the extra wax. I bought a nice kit at Moon Glow in Sturgis, SD they were the only one I found with this huge kit. also I want to know when I do my complete test burns can I reuse the tins? I know I'm so amateur with this but I want to learn as much as I can from this first pour. Also in my kit came 4-27oz romance jar's I will be saving them for when I get much better at this, but they have a unsusal shape and have seen post on jars where they had problem in their 1st and 2nd burn's these jars are shaped kinda like an upside down pear, and a 1/2" chimney? Dia. at opening is 3" but in the middle its much bigger 4" and bottom 2" I want to know how full should I fill these when the time comes? Sorry for such the long post.

thanks in advance, cary

[periwinkle]

Hi! I'm a newbie also, and YES there is sooooo much to learn!!!! I have found myself reading here for a couple of hours a day lol

The experts here are fabulous about sharing info, and giving tips. One thing I know they will ask you, is which soy wax are you using, and what temp did you heat it to? Just from my very limited experience, it sounds like you may have poured at too cool of a temp for your wax. And you definitely need to let your candle cure for a minimum of 48 hours before doing your first test burn.

Welcome to your new obsession!!!

Edited November 18, 2011 by periwinkle
it's hard to spell while yelling at 4 kids lol

[cary]

Thanks, The instruction said to heat to 160* and let cool to 125* before adding FO and dye, and pour at 100*,but I will try a higher pour temp, on my next making and see if this help. All it says about the wax is that its a soy container blend no details as to what it has blended in it, the supplier said they couldnt give specifics as to what the blend is. I'm really loving the site here too. so much info!

Thanks again!

[Beth]

Thanks, The instruction said to heat to 160* and let cool to 125* before adding FO and dye, and pour at 100*,but I will try a higher pour temp, on my next making and see if this help. All it says about the wax is that its a soy container blend no details as to what it has blended in it, the supplier said they couldnt give specifics as to what the blend is. I'm really loving the site here too. so much info!

Thanks again!

& as a newbie, stay far, far away from the Fragrance forum....it can lead to bad things, lol.

[cary]

Thanks for the heads up. I keep that in mind, lol

[Beth]

On their website, the directions for their soy blend say:

• Heat soy wax to 175 degrees F
  
• Remove from heat source
  
• Add fragrance and dye
  
• Stir while cooling
  
• Pour into wicked container at 95/110 degrees F
  

Which kit did you buy?

[cary]

the instructions they sent with the kit say different I got the ultimate kit

[Beth]

the instructions they sent with the kit say different I got the ultimate kit

ah, they have 2 blends in that MONSTER kit, lol. You should be all set!

[cary]

There were 3 blends total. 2 container blends and the votive blend. Ive seen alot of kits and I thought it was the best buy for the money but I could be wrong. I did ask them if additive would be needed and they said no but from what I see from my first pour, and the frosting I got with the container blend I think I need additive for that blend. I also see that the vybar isnt recomended for the soy but they had one for the soy, added it to the wish list along with some wick samples and wick tabs, lol.

[Beth]

If you do a search here for Millenium, that may find you some tips.

[Stella1952]

Welcome Cary. You have found a large group of enablers for your new addiction.

I found that when I measured my 10oz's of wax thinking I would have enough to make 1 each of the 8oz and 2oz I ended up with enough wax for another 2oz tin. Is this normal?

Containers are rated by liquid measure - volume - usually to their fill line. As you know (I am SOOO proud of you!!), candlemakers do things by weight. For example, I use 8 oz. wide mouth canning jars for my candles. If I were making cranberry sauce, it DOES hold 1 cup (or 8 fluid ounces) of cranberry sauce to the fill line. BUT I pour 6 oz. of wax in it to the same fill line. It's simply the difference between mass (weight) and volume.

To get a rough idea of how much weighed wax your containers will hold, weigh the container empty, tare, then fill it to the fill line with water and note the weight. That is about how much weighed wax you will need to fill that container (water's a little heavier than wax). If you wanted to be dead accurate, do this with melted wax.

I also noticed that there is a crust on top, I'm guessing this is called bloom?

"Bloom" is another term for "frosting" which is the resulting change in crystal structure of the wax. This is called polymorphism. At different temps, different crystal phases are encouraged or discouraged to grow. For nice, smooth soy candles, we'd like for only one particular crystal phase to grow and for that kind to be the one that has the smoothest appearance. MANY veggie oils are polymorphic - soybean, palm, cocoa butter, etc. Oleoscientists in the food industry have worked hard to produce chocolate that doesn't lose its "temper" and develop "bloom." We've all experienced the changes in a Milky Way bar that partially melted then rehardened. The chocolate looks and feels different because the crystal structure of it changed due to the temperature. The huge, showy crystals that palm wax develops at high temperatures represent one crystal phase but if poured at a lower temperature, those crystals vanish. Shortening is nice and creamy white out of the can, but after it's melted and cooled, the structure is quite different and it may appear semi-translucent with larger sparkling crystals.

Battling polymorphism in soy candles is tough, but you can reduce its incidence and severity by paying close attention to the temperature to which you heat your wax, the temp at which you add your FOs (preheat slightly so as not to dramatically drop the temp of the soy wax), the kind and amount of dye you use, the temperature at which you pour and how you cool the candles. Stir the wax frequently as it melts to prevent parts of the wax from becoming hotter than others. After adding the FO, stir continuously until you actually pour the candles. This stirring keeps the temperature even throughout the container.

I can't give you any specific information on the brands of wax you have because I don't use them, but here is the link for the manufacturer, Enchanted Lites http://www.enchanted-lites.com/default.htm

PS Check out the Veggie Wax discussion forum.

Edited November 18, 2011 by Stella1952

[cary]

Thank you so much! awesome link with great info. and I will be sure to check the Veggie forum. So the weight of the unmelted wax is different then when its melted and thats why I ended up with more wax? After I do my test can I reuse the tins? Thanks again for the info. I appreciate it greatly

ps. sorry I'm still so new at this and yesterday was the very first candles I have ever made but they smell great! lol On to the test burn.

Edited November 18, 2011 by cary

[Pam W]

To get a rough idea of how much weighed wax your containers will hold, weigh the container empty, tare, then fill it to the fill line with water and note the weight. That is about how much weighed wax you will need to fill that container (water's a little heavier than wax). If you wanted to be dead accurate, do this with melted wax.

if you take that water weight and multiply it by .86 you'll come out almost perfect on the amt of wax you need.

[Pam W]

Thank you so much! awesome link with great info. and I will be sure to check the Veggie forum. So the weight of the unmelted wax is different then when its melted and thats why I ended up with more wax? After I do my test can I reuse the tins? Thanks again for the info. I appreciate it greatly

ps. sorry I'm still so new at this and yesterday was the very first candles I have ever made but they smell great! lol On to the test burn.

No, the weight of the wax is the same whether melted or unmelted. I'm guessing that you used 10oz of wax and then added the FO & dye which increased the total volume. There is another recent thread about adding the FO - you can add the FO & come out with a little extra or you can deduct the weight of the FO from the amt of wax to come out even (example: 9.2 oz of wax and .8 oz of FO will make total of 10oz.)

Read thru this thread: long but informative

http://www.craftserver.com/forums/showthread.php?99401-I-suck-at-math-need-advice.

Edited November 18, 2011 by Pam W

[cary]

Ok, I will keep that in mind better yet I'll write it down, lol I didn't think 1/2 oz of FO and 2 drops of dye would increase it 2oz. I must have mesasured wrong or my scale is wrong, hoping not with the scale I just got it.

Thanks for the info. Thanks Pam for the math trick I will try that too, and write it down also. my memory isnt like it use tobe lol.

[Beth]

Ok, I will keep that in mind better yet I'll write it down, lol I didn't think 1/2 oz of FO and 2 drops of dye would increase it 2oz. I must have mesasured wrong or my scale is wrong, hoping not with the scale I just got it.

Thanks for the info. Thanks Pam for the math trick I will try that too, and write it down also. my memory isnt like it use tobe lol.

This may help-

http://www.nuscentscandle.com/candle-making-faq.html

[cary]

Thank you! this helps alot! and lets me know my scale is working properly Thanks again! Everyone has been such a great help and I'm so greatful for your post's. Thank you all.

[Laurie]

Ya thanks everyone, this helped me alot too!

Edited November 18, 2011 by Laurie

[GaryPC]

if you take that water weight and multiply it by .86 you'll come out almost perfect on the amt of wax you need.

I thought that was pretty accurate too, until I tried it... measured out the appropriate amount of wax, and came up with a jar 3/4 full My 26 oz jar takes 24 oz of wax, my 16 oz jar takes 17 oz of wax, and my 8 oz jar takes 10 oz of wax (can't figure that one out!)

I found the best thing is just melt some plain wax (you're not wasting it because you aren't adding FO or color), put a hot pot holder on your scale (if your scale surface is plastic, and you don't want to melt it), then your jar, and tare it out. Then just pour the wax to your fill level, and you get what your net weight will be. Took me about 5 minutes to do all my jars, and I now have accurate net weights for all my jars. When I add the FO and dye, it may make it slightly over, but to me it is better to be slightly over than under!

Edited November 18, 2011 by GaryPC

[cary]

Great tip GaryPC! Thank you so much!

[Stella1952]

So the weight of the unmelted wax is different then when its melted and thats why I ended up with more wax?

NO!!! WEIGHT (mass) is different from VOLUME (the amount of space something takes up). Weight is relatively absolute. Volume is not. A pound of feathers and a pound of gold WEIGH the same; but the VOLUME of a pound of feathers is much larger than a pound of gold. Another example is that I can fit 9# of soy wax flakes into my Presto. 9# will not fit in there unmelted because of the airspace between the flakes and molecules, so I pile in 7# to the top, then dd the remaining 2# later. Weight is the same; volume is different.

As Pam pointed out, any time you add something to your wax, you are adding to the weight. One drop of dye may be difficult to discern on our scales, but adding 1 oz. of FO is not.

Then just pour the wax to your fill level, and you get what your net weight will be. Took me about 5 minutes to do all my jars

Exactly what I did and recommended. Why fol around with water, doing math to still approximate when I can just melt some wax (I do have a bunch of it lying around), weigh it and know EXACTLY how much I will be using to fill that container.

[lmc]

...yes, you can reuse your tins for TESTING purposes only, never for resale...

[cary]

Sorry, I'm confused? I understand that weight is the same and volume is different. So wax increases in volume when it is melted? sorry I'm such a newbie at this. I only know that I measured 10oz of wax, added 1/2oz FO and 2 drops dye and ended up with 2oz's extra. it wasnt that big of a deal I just ended up with another 2oz. tin. I feel so dumb, lol. I think I will try GaryPC's advice and see how that works for me. Thanks for all the advice.

[lmc]

On a supplier's website it stated that 16oz of wax=20oz of melted wax...I know that 12oz of wax fills my 16oz canning jars to the correct fill line...but every wax will vary slightly from one another

[Stella1952]

So wax increases in volume when it is melted?

Think about your question. Have you ever seen melted wax EXPAND? No. It does not increase in volume when melted; it decreases.

I measured 10oz of wax, added 1/2oz FO

Did you MEASURE it, as using a measuring cup, or did you WEIGH it on a scale as you said previously? If you weighed it, that would be 10.5 oz.

The question then becomes, exactly how much wax did you really pour into the containers? I explained above that containers are rated in liquid (volume) measure, so a 2 oz. tin may not necessarily hold 2 weighed oz. of wax...

16oz of wax=20oz of melted wax

You REALLY should identify whether you are talking about WEIGHED ounces or FLUID ounces. 1 weighed pound of melted wax = 1 weighed pound of unmelted wax. Your statement above is not true for all waxes. For example, if I were to melt 16 FLUID OZ. (2 cups) of beeswax pastilles it might not weigh the same as 2 cups of fluffy soy wax flakes because the pastilles are denser and packed more closely together than are flakes...

When you buy a bag of potato chips, it is sold by the net WEIGHT, not by the VOLUME, so the bag may or may not appear to be full. To test this, pour a bag of potato chips into a bowl. Look at it. Then put the chips back in the bag. Sit on the bag. Now pour the potato chips back into the bowl. THey will still WEIGH the same but the VOLUME will have vastly decreased.

Units of measure used in the kitchen are VOLUME measurements. An 8 oz. measuring cup refers to FLUID ounces, not weighed ounces. An 8 oz. jelly jar refers to how many FLUID ounces of water the jar will hold.