elliecat Posted November 12, 2011 Share Posted November 12, 2011 (edited) I must have a bad batch of Ecosoya 135... I've been using this wax for about 8 years and know which wicks work with each candle that I make after many times of vigorous testing. This batch is greasier than usual and has been forming sink holes on each pour which I never have had happen at pouring at low tempertures. The candles that I have made from this batch that have always worked are now extinguishing themselves and dropping a big hole around the wick So frustrated and upset as quite a few of these have gone out to new potential clients:angry2: Edited November 12, 2011 by elliecat Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Donnalee Posted November 12, 2011 Share Posted November 12, 2011 Using a Parafin, and having the same trouble. Haven't had this happen for quite a few years....im thinking it has something to do with the additives in the wax. Because I too have used the same wax,wicks,scent etc. through the years and then Bam...I'm having problems. New case of wax though. First slab seems to be burning fine, the second slab is messed up. At $100 a case....makes me sick. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stella1952 Posted November 13, 2011 Share Posted November 13, 2011 (edited) Elliecat, what's the Lot/Batch number from the case(s) you suspect are bad?If you are using a new supply of wicks, this CAN have a big impact on your candles if something has changed about them; the same holds true for FOs. ANY new component should be given a quick test to see if it performs like the previous supply just to be sure...Donnalee, if you suspect a bad batch of paraffin wax, I hope you will post the Lot/Batch numbers, manufacturer, etc. in the General candlemaking forum to see if others using your wax are having similar issues. Edited November 13, 2011 by Stella1952 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elliecat Posted November 13, 2011 Author Share Posted November 13, 2011 Elliecat, what's the Lot/Batch number from the case(s) you suspect are bad?If you are using a new supply of wicks, this CAN have a big impact on your candles if something has changed about them; the same holds true for FOs. ANY new component should be given a quick test to see if it performs like the previous supply just to be sure...Donnalee, if you suspect a bad batch of paraffin wax, I hope you will post the Lot/Batch numbers, manufacturer, etc. in the General candlemaking forum to see if others using your wax are having similar issues.Hi there... I don't have the box for the Ecosoya 135 anymore so I don't know the lot #... and these are the same wicks and fragrance oils that i have used before that worked just fine...so it is something about this lot of wax. It also burns different it creates a hole around the wick and collapses right away... never have seen the 135 do this in many years of using it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stella1952 Posted November 13, 2011 Share Posted November 13, 2011 same wicks and fragrance oils that i have used before that worked just fineYes, but are they from a new purchase or the exact same ones you were using with your last batch of 135 wax? Since you are having trouble, I wanted to be sure I understood correctly that only the wax is a newly purchased ingredient in your candles and that the FO & wicks you used are NOT a new purchase, but rather, the same exact supply as the last time you used 135 with no issues...Many FOs have been reformulated recently (and continue to be) to remove the phthalates. Several new purchases of FOs I have used for years have NOT performed the same (or even smelled the same). Suppliers & distributors change wick waxes, etc. so there is no guarantee that a CD 8 you purchased last year from XYZ supplier will perform the same as one you purchased this year from the same supplier.Perhaps the lot/batch number is on the invoice for your wax? It also burns different it creates a hole around the wick and collapses right away... never have seen the 135 do this in many years of using it. Are you taking about a sinkhole near the wick? This phenom is quite common and can happen with any soy wax if the top cools a lot more rapidly than the bottom & sides... What temp are you heating to, adding FO & pouring? How are you cooling your candles? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elliecat Posted November 13, 2011 Author Share Posted November 13, 2011 Yes, but are they from a new purchase or the exact same ones you were using with your last batch of 135 wax? Since you are having trouble, I wanted to be sure I understood correctly that only the wax is a newly purchased ingredient in your candles and that the FO & wicks you used are NOT a new purchase, but rather, the same exact supply as the last time you used 135 with no issues...Many FOs have been reformulated recently (and continue to be) to remove the phthalates. Several new purchases of FOs I have used for years have NOT performed the same (or even smelled the same). Suppliers & distributors change wick waxes, etc. so there is no guarantee that a CD 8 you purchased last year from XYZ supplier will perform the same as one you purchased this year from the same supplier.Perhaps the lot/batch number is on the invoice for your wax? Are you taking about a sinkhole near the wick? This phenom is quite common and can happen with any soy wax if the top cools a lot more rapidly than the bottom & sides... What temp are you heating to, adding FO & pouring? How are you cooling your candles?Yes sink holes around the wick and also in other places the candle which never did it before...a couple more around the tops even around the edges... I've made candles for 10 years with this wax so I know the correct temps and I live in S.F. where he temps are quite moderate my apartment around 65 degrees....we have an Indian summer... it is behaving differently...I've never ever had a sink hole once before with this wax... so all elements are the same... you do have a point on suppliers going phalate free... but I have been good about using those types of fragrance only as well... so once again... i think it is something to do with an additive in the wax or something in this mixture lot that someone miss calculated... thanks! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elliecat Posted November 13, 2011 Author Share Posted November 13, 2011 also i have a candle that i made from the previous lot that i used all of the same ingredients, fragrance, wick and it burned fine, as usual... so as far as the process of elimation... i feel that has been pretty much covered.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stella1952 Posted November 13, 2011 Share Posted November 13, 2011 Here's NGI's contact link...http://www.ngiwax.com/contactus.htmlPerhaps they can help if you address your concerns directly to them as the manufacturer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elliecat Posted November 13, 2011 Author Share Posted November 13, 2011 Thanks Stella i will... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nadiap Posted November 13, 2011 Share Posted November 13, 2011 Hi there... I don't have the box for the Ecosoya 135 anymore so I don't know the lot #... and these are the same wicks and fragrance oils that i have used before that worked just fine...so it is something about this lot of wax. It also burns different it creates a hole around the wick and collapses right away... never have seen the 135 do this in many years of using it.There are a few of us in Australia too, that are finding the exact same issues with the 135, the sink holes and also glass adhesion - never had as many problems with 135 as I have this winter / coming onto summer in the years I've been using it... I loved this wax, but am now in the process of testing another one, as the 135 is just not performing as well as it used to I personally, would love to know if you hear anything from NGI as to whether anything has changed... our supplier here says that nothing has changed, but with quite a few chandlers having the exact same issues - I kinda don't believe them lol Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elliecat Posted November 13, 2011 Author Share Posted November 13, 2011 There are a few of us in Australia too, that are finding the exact same issues with the 135, the sink holes and also glass adhesion - never had as many problems with 135 as I have this winter / coming onto summer in the years I've been using it... I loved this wax, but am now in the process of testing another one, as the 135 is just not performing as well as it used to I personally, would love to know if you hear anything from NGI as to whether anything has changed... our supplier here says that nothing has changed, but with quite a few chandlers having the exact same issues - I kinda don't believe them lolI have always loved this wax too. This is awfully frustrating :angry2:Trying something new is a bad thought right now especially before Christmas . I am going to contact NGI tomorrow Monday and will let you know..usually companies don't want to take blame for their products and skirt around the issues trying to make it as we are doing something wrong but if we are doing the exact same thing and the wax is behaving differently it is no doubt the wax.. i will keep you posted... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elliecat Posted November 14, 2011 Author Share Posted November 14, 2011 I called Peaks where I got my wax from and they don't keep record of the lots # and unfortunately I didn't write it down, lesson learned on that one...I called NGI and he said that nothing has changed in the formula for CB-135 but said with any organic sort of product the oil and other componets in the soy can vary... he said that he hasn't had any recent complaints. He wanted the lot # which I didn't have. I am drying out this wax on boards since it is so oily and after it dries out more it is not making the sink holes as much. I'm still afraid of it though and am waiting for another shipment to arrive today and hoping that it is the stuff that I'm used to...I will write down the lot # on this one... keeping fingers crossed it is a good bunch... best to all Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stella1952 Posted November 14, 2011 Share Posted November 14, 2011 When one person reports a problem, I don't get real excited, but when several people begin reporting similar issues around the same time, my eyebrow starts going up on one side...This happened with a batch of NatureWax C3 not long after Elevance took over from Cargill. The folks having problems posted their Lot/Batch numbers from their cases and there were quite a few... The supplier(s) were no help and at first neither was Elevance. But once everyone got their stuff together, they asked for samples to be sent (perhaps you should offer to send them some of the wax or a bad candle) and they discovered that indeed, there was a manufacturing problems... seems like in that case it was something about lecithin becoming too hot and burning causing trash & horrible bubbling in the wax... I'm pretty sure they replaced the wax, so don't give up!! I used to dump the wax into a big plastic storage box the first year or so, but because of this issue, now I always store my wax in the cardboard container it comes in just in case... If they want me to cut out the batch number from the case as proof of purchase, I stand ready with a box cutter in hand! I was lucky and did not have any of the affected batches, but this was one lesson I learned from the misfortune of others.I hope y'all will all stay on this and compare notes, send samples, emails, etc. to NGI. One person complaining won't cause them much concern, but if you all email your issues, especially if you have Lot#s to go with the complaints, they should take this more seriously.The squeaky wheel gets the oil. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elliecat Posted November 14, 2011 Author Share Posted November 14, 2011 Thanks so much for your time and your suggestions Stella... there sure are so many things to learn in life the hard way it seems. This has taught me more about recored keeping and testing for sure. That is a good idea sending them a sample and also one of the defective candles from a bad lot. I really hope that I don't have to do it with this new batch that is coming... and I sure am going to test it well before filling orders. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nadiap Posted November 15, 2011 Share Posted November 15, 2011 Thanks for the update elliecat and also to Stella for some info regarding how to get the manufacturer / distributor to take notice... I've used up all my 135 now and in any case, I purchased in 5kg bags the last few times, and these do NOT have a batch number but it is certainly something to keep in mind if I get in any more. At the moment, I'm trialing 464 and it's not doing too badly Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elliecat Posted November 15, 2011 Author Share Posted November 15, 2011 Hi there,I recieved my new batch of CB-135 yesterday lot #1164189000 04023 from Peaks.. now this is the stuff I'm used to... it seems very good it's not oily and is pouring like a dream no sink holes... i'm curing some testers and will test the burn in a couple of days...so far so good... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coconut Posted November 15, 2011 Share Posted November 15, 2011 Didn't this happen a while back with Glass Glow from CS and shortly afterwards they dropped it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stella1952 Posted November 15, 2011 Share Posted November 15, 2011 My BEST advice is to buy your wax in CASES. It seems like a lot, but it doesn't go bad and is the ONLY WAY to trace the wax to the actual manufacturer's batch. If you have more than you need, sell some on the classies and give the buyers the Lot # and information just in case.Didn't this happen a while back with Glass Glow from CS and shortly afterwards they dropped it? Oh coconut... I STILL haven't gotten over THAT little stinky deal... :lipsrseal:lipsrseal:lipsrseal Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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