Aus - Is There Any Way I Can Tell The Brand of FO?

[bart70]

Hi All,

A bit of a long shot.....but looking at getting some FO over from the good old US of A. Trying to source FO from one of my suppliers is difficult with it out of stock when you need it most., and not wanting to advise when it will be in stock again. Also, the Aussie $$ is currently at parity with the US dollar and predicted to climb another 10% over the coming weeks so it could be a good opportunity.

Looking at prices from Candlescience (as reference only...not sure who to go with yet) one of my FO's is $59 for the same amount that I pay $120 for. If I had to pay $50 to ship it I would still be in front!!

My only concern is knowing that the FO I purchase from the US is the same as the one I am currently using.

Does anybody know if there is a way to find out? or know who the 2 Australian suppliers source their FO from?

Cheers,

Rob.

[R.S.]

that's a tough one... most of the suppliers either have them made specifically for them.. or if they are purchasing a manufacturer's standard scent, they probably aren't going to tell you.. otherwise you could buy directly from the manufacturer.

Good luck!

[jonsie]

Bart, I know what you mean. I have suspected that our supplier here on this side of Oz shares the same distributer as CandleScience, but I can't know for sure.

I've always wanted to ask our supplier for MSDS sheets or technical specs similar to what Nature's Garden provides. An example here is there Sugar Cookie FO, which includes the % of vanillin and Flashpoint temp. For what it's worth, I've ordered lots of FOs from NGC since they deliver internationally and I've determined they do not use the same distributer as our supplier.

So my point is, I think we should be able to ask for and receive the technical data on the FOs from our supplier. And based on that, maybe we can compare the specs with other distributers/suppliers to hunt down a replacement.

By the way, I might have small amounts (100 - 500 ml) of FO you might be looking for. I'm only focusing on about 12 scents for Christmas and I'd be happy to work something out. I'm getting nervous about running out of 464 so if you happen to have any you aren't using I'd be interested!

[bart70]

Hi Jonsie,

Agree with you 100% wit MSDS sheets - in fact I think that if you looked into it they would be obliged by law to provide them if asked. They would need to have them on hand for their own protection from a Workcover perspective anyway.

Supply in Oz is a big problem - although the supplier over your way is head and shoulders above the one over here!! At least he responds to emails, and on several occasions has gone to a lot of trouble to make up large FO bottles for us from smaller ones when he has been out of stock. Recently he airfreighted some wicks to us that we needed urgently. He goes the extra mile!

I have been slowly transferring all my business over to them over the last couple of months but have a couple FO's that he does not stock. These are the ones I am looking to go OS for.

Understand your concerns with wax supply - there is currently no feather palm available in Oz - the east coast supplier had problems with a bad shipment and changed suppliers which has resulted in no stock for several weeks. The one over your way has run out due to demand from the shortage. Luckily we made a business decision to keep a buffer of wax and FO so has not really affected us yet. The FO's I am seeking now are new ones that I have partly tested and want to finish as some clients are wanting them for Xmas!

The main one I am chasing is Sun Ripened Berry, although to meet what I need I am going to need a couple of litres.

I dont use soy but have approx 2.3kg of 464 from some testing I was doing with melts a while back. It is not a lot but if you run short you are welcome to it.

Cheers,

Rob

[jonsie]

Unfortunately I don't have any Sun Ripened Berry. Maybe someone will try to unload their supplies on ebay.com.au or gumtree.com.au. And thanks for the offer on the 464. If I get desperate enough I'll shoot you a PM. Hopefully I can find some locally before it gets crazy.

I wish I had thought in advance to stock up on wax. This is my first Christmas and I have no idea what to expect. If I run out, then oh well! Problem is a friend campaigned to let me participate in a very nice craft market over here, and if I can't line up the supplies then I'll turn it down.

Fingers crossed it works out for both of us!

[bart70]

No Probs Jonsie,

As usual David has been great this afternoon and been able to tell us that he should have wax by end of week, as well as the 2 FO's that the other mob can't supply or even know when it may be in stock.

Interestingly, of the 2 FO's we were going to order from the other mob, the one they told was would not be in stock for 2 weeks went in stock on their web page 2 hrs later, and the one that was in stock went out of stock at the same time! Rang them to enquire but "We are too busy to talk to you today....." Can't believe a darned thing they say!!

We sell 95% to retail - if we cannot supply, shop owners simply go elsewhere, particularly this time of year when they want to take advantage of Xmas. We are not a huge manufacturer but we do need to have reliable supply to manage cash flows and survive in the marketplace.

Might be worth ringing to see where your 464 is up to? - if the Feather Palm is close the 464 might be as well! - got my fingers crossed for you!

Give me a yell if you need the 464 I have here~!

Cheers,

Rob

[KoalaGirl]

Hi Bart

I'm hearin' ya re: supply problems! Im still trying to get a straight answer regarding their t-light cups. The boss is always 'in a meeting' when I ring!

Candlescience does supply NCS. I contacted Candlescience a while ago, enquiring about shipping to Aus and they told me 'not at this stage' but I could buy them at NCS.

Do you know if they now ship to Australia? If they did, that would be wonderful especially now with the $ as it is.

I have noticed that the photo that accompanies a few of NCS scent descriptions, has changed. I havn't had to order those scents for a while but I hope a different pic doesn't mean a different supplier. Surely they would tell us if it did?

Cheers

[jonsie]

As usual David has been great this afternoon and been able to tell us that he should have wax by end of week, as well as the 2 FO's that the other mob can't supply or even know when it may be in stock.

Rob, that is great news! When I spoke with them yesterday they said the 464 will be in at the end of the week so that is a huge relief!

Candlescience does supply NCS. I contacted Candlescience a while ago, enquiring about shipping to Aus and they told me 'not at this stage' but I could buy them at NCS.

That is REALLY good to know!

Do you know if they now ship to Australia? If they did, that would be wonderful especially now with the $ as it is.

I'd like to know this too. Their website is still claiming no international shipping. You still may come out ahead using a packaging forwarding service.

[Tribalvixen]

Hi

I emailed Candlescience a about a month 6 weeks ago and they said they do not ship international.

ACS has tealight cups(just in)..yay....I seriously dont need 2500 which is now the only amount you can get at NCS and ACS has lots of pretty colours

[bart70]

Hi

I emailed Candlescience a about a month 6 weeks ago and they said they do not ship international.

ACS has tealight cups(just in)..yay....I seriously dont need 2500 which is now the only amount you can get at NCS and ACS has lots of pretty colours

Yes....Was aware that CS are not shipping internationally. Their site says that may offer it in the future which would be good. I really should be taking advantage of the Aussie dollar the way it is and buy in more moulds and candle making equipment - just wish I had the extra $$ to spare to take advantage :smiley2:.

I have been transferring more and more of my business to ACS. NCS really dont care much about their customers these days - Too many broken promises and lies unfortunately - wont respond to emails and wont return phone calls either. Not for me!! We have found an alternate supplier for everything but a couple of fragrances now...and that will only be until I can get a chance to test equivalents from elsewhere.

Must check out those coloured tea light cups.....They sound nice! :)

Rob.

[jonsie]

If NCS is turning off so many customers, maybe it's time to step in as a new supplier for that side of the country Believe me, I've thought of it but I wouldn't do it here while living in Perth. ACS started off as a candle maker, gradually moved into buying their supplies at wholesale, then started being a supplier for others. David doesn't make candles anymore but is very busy being the supplier now for everyone else. At least that is how I remember him explaining it to me.

[bart70]

If NCS is turning off so many customers, maybe it's time to step in as a new supplier for that side of the country Believe me, I've thought of it but I wouldn't do it here while living in Perth. ACS started off as a candle maker, gradually moved into buying their supplies at wholesale, then started being a supplier for others. David doesn't make candles anymore but is very busy being the supplier now for everyone else. At least that is how I remember him explaining it to me.

I knew that David has a candlemaking history - some of his knowledge has been very valuable to me. Can understand why he would be so busy with supplying.

I believe that Australia could support another supplier. The thought has crossed my mind about setting up but a few limitations prevent me . The main one being the capital needed to invest in stock to do it properly, my geographic location (would be better done from a major centre as freighting from the wharves becomes a cost), and time as I have a demanding full time job that I am not ready to leave just yet.

I like the way that David has evolved - that progression would appeal to me if I was to head in that direction.

Rob.

[bart70]

I'm hearin' ya re: supply problems! Im still trying to get a straight answer regarding their t-light cups. The boss is always 'in a meeting' when I ring!

I am still waiting for some supplies to test that he told me were being sent 5 weeks ago. Several phone calls and numerous emails later I cannot get a response. Another issue in the last week and promises from the 'guard dogs' on the phones that we would be called back (several times) and still no call. Am over them....I don't like your chances of getting your response. Is sad really - when the boss of the company has to tell his staff to advise everyone he is in meetings. No reason why he cannot return a call or an email addressed to him.

I havn't had to order those scents for a while but I hope a different pic doesn't mean a different supplier. Surely they would tell us if it did?

Would not hold your breath waiting on them advise you of any changes - they are in the process if changing feather palm supplier due to a large shipment of bad wax (the reason they are out of feather palm currently).

No notification of the bad wax, or the change to new supplier was sent to their customers. I only found out by accident some weeks ago when I enquired about making a larger than normal wax order. It at least explains why some of my candles started to burn funny (...and luckily the ducks lined up so that I realised what was going on before my customers were affected!!)

I hope you get your response from them, but personally I don't like your chances of getting one, and even then my experiences would make me wary that I was being told the truth.

Rob

[RichardLOZ]

And lets not even mention glassware supply from this side of the country!!!

Jars are our biggest issue. Yes they can be sourced from David, but then I have to deal with the shipping charges. Gala in Adelaide has them, but I wouldnt recommend them either as the quality and consistancy is very poor.

Now with the $ so high it may just be time to bring a pallet in from the States I think.

[jonsie]

Have any of you tried any of the package forwarders available in the U.S.? I even see some pallet forwarders and I was wondering what they might charge for glassware. Sorry for deviating so far from the original topic.

[RichardLOZ]

I have had a quote from the Jar Store in CT to have a full pallet of Libby Lucida 10oz jars shipped over. If I recall it was something like $1.07 / jar and about $1200 to ship door to door, inclusive of all customs charges, duty etc etc. Still quite expensive although not too much different to actually buying the palin apothecary jars locally.

[bart70]

And lets not even mention glassware supply from this side of the country!!!

Jars are our biggest issue. Yes they can be sourced from David, but then I have to deal with the shipping charges. Gala in Adelaide has them, but I wouldnt recommend them either as the quality and consistancy is very poor.

Now with the $ so high it may just be time to bring a pallet in from the States I think.

Couple of things I have noticed with getting shipments from Perth as opposed to Sydney.

1. The freight company used by NCS is quite expensive given the distance. Sydney is 4hrs south of me, Perth is on the other side of the country, yet many items from Perth are not that much more expensive to ship to me than Sydney.

2. If I buy 4 boxes of wax (4 x 25kg) the price difference from Perth is approx $6/box more expensive. On a km for km basis this make the NCS freight company look really expensive. It is still a little more, but I dont mind that cost to deal with a reputable supplier

3. The freight per 25kg box from NCS is the same per box, if I order 1 box or 10. If I order from Perth, the freight reduces the more I purchase.

4. NCS flatly refuse to use any other freight company - they say either like it or shop elsewhere.

5. NCS freight company does not ship consignments together. If I order 10 boxes of wax, it can take up to 14 days to be delivered!!! They will often send one box per night from the Sydney freight centre to the local freight centre, who are not allowed to deliver until the entire consignment has arrived!! The company used by ACS ship consignments together. If I order 6 or more boxes from NCS it can take longer to make it 4hrs up the highway than the same 6 boxes shipped from Perth!!

Also, if you are ordering a large volume of product from ACS (ie - large enough for a pallet rate) it is worth giving David a ring. I know he has told me previously that in some circumstances he can get a better freight rate on pallet loads. Not sure what glassware quantities you were looking at but might be an option to investigate further, even if it suited you to make it up with glassware and wax to fill a pallet.

I agree though, the Aussie dollar is looking so good it is hard to resist getting stock direct from the US. I personally have my eye on a lovely wax melter and delivery system that I dont need at the moment, but would be mighty nice to have down the track!....oh to dream!! :drool:

Rob

[KoalaGirl]

I see that NCS are now into soap and body care making supplies. They are getting their oils for these from Sweetcakes and another supplier {cant remember which one}. Maybe the've lost the plot a bit lately because the're too busy getting the soap side up and running? Shame on them if thats the case!

[KoalaGirl]

T'is me thats lost the plot judging by where I managed to put that thumb thingy.

[MissMori]

If you are buying jars from the Jar Store in large quantities, why not buy them direct from Libbey, if in fact you are using Libbey Jars. http://www.libbey.com/index.php

[nadiap]

I see that NCS are now into soap and body care making supplies. They are getting their oils for these from Sweetcakes and another supplier {cant remember which one}. Maybe the've lost the plot a bit lately because the're too busy getting the soap side up and running? Shame on them if thats the case!

Have you seen the prices of the soap fragrances ??? That is unreal !!

PS: Had a shipment from NCS today and it came via Fastway - not Aust Post - looks like they changed couriers

Tealights (clear cups) - forget them, I've been waiting ages and then they only offer in one lot of 2500 which has now gone - wanna bet they all end up for sale on ebay :-)

[nadiap]

Have any of you tried any of the package forwarders available in the U.S.? I even see some pallet forwarders and I was wondering what they might charge for glassware. Sorry for deviating so far from the original topic.

I recently read of this forwarder - not used them yet,but thinking about it :-) From what I read don't seem so bad - particularly if the company in US doesn't ship to Australia.

http://www.hopshopgo.com/hsg/welcome.do?l=en&c=

[RichardLOZ]

I reckon that NCS has indeed lost the plot. They have been OOS of most of their glassware for the last 3 - 4 months now. I dont know how they plan to stay in business with service like that.

As far as soap supplies goes, I reckon the best place to buy is from Aussie Soap Supplies over in Perth. Great people, great service and carry Brambleberry oils which are believed to be the best for B&B products.

It may be the right time for a group of us to get together to import direct from the manufactures or other suppliers in the States. Palm was seems to be the big issue right now and it is very frustrating when we are paying almost $80 / bag +shipping when we could get direct out of Indonesia for something like $10 / bag. Anyone interested in splitting a tonne of feather palm

[Tribalvixen]

Hiya

3 or 4 months they were out of clear honey pots in Jan or feb and I had an email from them then saying it would be 6 weeks away....and here we are almost the end of October..very annoying

Co op is something I may be interested in but I am mostly hobby with just a few sales now and then atm...

Hubby speaks Indoneasian/Malay so if you need an interpreter let me know lol

Heirloom in Penrith isnt too bad for soap supplies they have Sweetcakes too and there is a few up Brissy way. Theres my for today

[jonsie]

I'm open to help with co ops, but at the moment I don't have much of a need for feather palm. Please keep me in mind for other co ops in the future.

Speaking of Indonesia, it is very likely we'll be living there before our work visa is up here in Oz. I'm not sure I'll be making candles there but maybe I can help hunt out some good deals on palm. Heck, maybe I'll become a supplier