ladydragon Posted August 6, 2007 Share Posted August 6, 2007 Hi guys...I was wondering if anyone had views on a sub for Palm Kernel oil?I've seen many recipes I'd like to try but my supplier doesn't carry PKO...I'd be very grateful for any suggestions and views on an alternative with similar characteristics so it doesn't totally alter a recipe which contains PKO... Many thanks! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RobinInOR Posted August 6, 2007 Share Posted August 6, 2007 The closest in look and feel is coconut oil. A bit different SAP so you'll have to run it through a calculator, but it does have similar properties. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ladydragon Posted August 6, 2007 Author Share Posted August 6, 2007 Thanks for that... I did wonder if they were very similar...Having said that - I've found a number of recipes which already have coconut and palm as well as the palm kernel... Just subbing with coconut only might take that ingredient over the 30% mark - which I understand is undesirable...I've tried subbing with cocoa butter and shea butter (both easily accessible for me) in the calculators but it seems to make a huge difference...Would palm be similar to palm kernel?Not having ever gotten my sticky little mitts on it I've no idea of what it looks/feels like...ThanksAnn-Marie x Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
topofmurrayhill Posted August 6, 2007 Share Posted August 6, 2007 Hi Ann-Marie.If you sub palm or a butter in place of PKO, it's more like a different sort of recipe rather than a substitution.When substituting you want to try an oil from the same category, which in this case is cleansing oils. Some people do prefer to combine different kinds but I think you could still get a satisfactory result from using a larger amount of coconut oil versus a CO/PKO combo. If you're limited in what's available to you, it may be the best option.Here's some good info that includes the categories of oils so you get a better idea of what reasonable substitutions would be. http://www.candletech.com/forums/showthread.php?t=3164 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
topofmurrayhill Posted August 7, 2007 Share Posted August 7, 2007 One more thought about your question.When you sub CO for PKO you probably could use less cleansing oils, so the total CO need not go over 30% to make a similar soap. Let me illustrate that with an imaginary recipe:15% coconut20% palm kernel15% palm50% oliveHardness 41Cleansing 22Conditioning 54Bubbly 22Creamy 18Iodine 54INS 152That recipe is 35% cleansing oils but we can drop it to 30% when subbing with CO and fill in the rest with palm and we get this:30% coconut20% palm50% oliveHardness 41Cleansing 20Conditioning 54Bubbly 20Creamy 21Iodine 55INS 161 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crafty1_AJ Posted August 7, 2007 Share Posted August 7, 2007 Would palm be similar to palm kernel?No, not really. Palm and PKO are two different animals.I agree with the others; I'd sub coconut for pko. I've heard some use babassu, but I'm on a budget. LOL Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scented Posted August 7, 2007 Share Posted August 7, 2007 Yes, but even using babassu (and I'm on a budget too lol) you wouldn't want to use a lot ... like 5%. Personally, you can go over the 30% cleansing oils and still get a good soap that isn't too harsh. Just swap out your coconut value for say hazelnut and you'll see the lye figures drop in your total recipe. I do this all the time without a hitch. Someone else calls it super fatting, thinking that was JenT maybe. You might just try it and see what you think ... or had 5% of some butter to it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
topofmurrayhill Posted August 7, 2007 Share Posted August 7, 2007 Yes, but even using babassu (and I'm on a budget too lol) you wouldn't want to use a lot ... like 5%.As far as I know you can use it interchangeably with CO apart from the cost factor. I usually do a combo, but I've used up to 20% babassu and have a non-CO recipe coming up that calls for 25%. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Meridith Posted August 7, 2007 Share Posted August 7, 2007 I find babassu to not be as drying on my skin as coconut oil. I use a combo of CO and babassu in all my recipes. At 5%, the babassu makes a huge positive difference in my bars so I think it is worth the price. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scented Posted August 7, 2007 Share Posted August 7, 2007 As far as I know you can use it interchangeably with CO apart from the cost factor. I usually do a combo, but I've used up to 20% babassu and have a non-CO recipe coming up that calls for 25%.Might be fine, but I'm not about to experiment to find out. At 5% it works just fine for me and I don't see a need to put a more expensive ingredient in place of coconut ... it isn't cost effective IMO. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ladydragon Posted August 8, 2007 Author Share Posted August 8, 2007 Mmm... Actually, for me, the second recipe does look a tad more appealing - very similar figures all over so I can see your point there - but a slight drop in bubbles and a slight increase in creaminess...As my preference is for a creamy finish than high bubbles it would probably suit me better... ;-)Babassu is definitely not readily available over here - I don't think I've ever seen it to be honest listed with any of my regular suppliers... So both the PK and Babassu are off my shopping list so to speak... ;-)By the look of it a bit of fiddling maxing coconut to 30% then bumping up the palm to compensate for any PK left over might be the best, and possibly the only option if I want to play around with the recipies that do include PK...Or as also suggested, up the coconut to more than 30% and superfat a bit more... Never taken that step - always thought it one of those 'golden rules' that coconut should not be more than 25 - 30% max...Part of the problem at my end is chasing that elusive 'perfect' base recipe... Because of the cost involved in getting our soap safety assessed prior to selling it here; the base recipe has got to be completely consistent... The variables for superfatting or additives get added on as extra ingredients - but the actual base can't alter or it would need a whole new assessment...Methinks I might be better off posting my current fave to see if I can obtain constructive feedback from more experienced quarters...Thanks for all your input Ann-Marie x Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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