Soy container candle melt pool

[Dawn Blakey]

Hello all, I was just wondering with a soy wax glass container candle, how much of the wax should melt at any one time. for example, is it possible for the wax to be clear liquid to a depth of an inch or more? or does the wax have to be burned by the wick as it goes which would mean the candle stays solid.

I hope you all know what I am trying to say.

TIA

Dawn

[Grannyscandles]

It is normal for an inch of wax to be melted when burning a soy wax container candle. It doesn't mean you are doing anythin wrong or that it is overwicked. The thing to watch for is to see how long it takes to get a full melt pool with the wick you are using. I use wide mouth jars so I expect a full melt pool in 3 hours time. If I don't get it I use a larger (hotter) wick.

HTH's!

Teresa

[tangerine]

Dawn,

I'm not exactly sure what you mean. If you mean that you are looking at the side of the glass and your melt pool (liquid wax) is 1 inch DEEP, then your candle is definitely overwicked. Ideally, the melt pool should be 1/4 to 1/2" deep at a given amount of time (depends on diameter of container). For my container candles, I am ok with a certain amount of hang up leftover after the first burn. If properly wicked, the hang up goes away after consecutive burns. Others prefer a full melt pool, edge to edge, from the first burn.

[Dawn Blakey]

It is normal for an inch of wax to be melted when burning a soy wax container candle. It doesn't mean you are doing anythin wrong or that it is overwicked. The thing to watch for is to see how long it takes to get a full melt pool with the wick you are using. I use wide mouth jars so I expect a full melt pool in 3 hours time. If I don't get it I use a larger (hotter) wick.

Thank you for your comments, I haven't tried making them yet as I am still in the theory stage, (I'm in recovery after an op).

Your comments are interesting, How do you know how long you need to get it to a full melt pool? What is the criteria? I am sorry to appear a bit dense on this but I haven't done any testing yet and I am keen to learn.

Regards

Dawn

[Dawn Blakey]

Dawn,

I'm not exactly sure what you mean. If you mean that you are looking at the side of the glass and your melt pool (liquid wax) is 1 inch DEEP, then your candle is definitely overwicked. Ideally, the melt pool should be 1/4 to 1/2" deep at a given amount of time (depends on diameter of container). For my container candles, I am ok with a certain amount of hang up leftover after the first burn. If properly wicked, the hang up goes away after consecutive burns. Others prefer a full melt pool, edge to edge, from the first burn.

Thank you for your comments, yes I was referring to the depth, as you look at the side.

[Grannyscandles]

I guess we have a difference of opinion that might be cleared up with an explanation. I am a power burner as are many of my customers. We would much rather see a 1 inch deep melt pool in our soy candles than any wax hang up, ever. Everyone has a different idea of what is over wicked I guess.

[Dawn Blakey]

The reason I was asking was because if you don't use a zinc core wick in the container and then the wax melts to a liquid, then there is no stability for the wick to remain upright and it could be dangerous. What is the best wick type to use in a Soy only glass container? would it be Zinc or cotton or square braid?

Sorry for all the questions but I am a beginner in both Soy Wax and containers.

Thank you

Dawn

[ebarnes]

I would definately try wicking down, I have some candles that will create a MP of 1" deep in about 20 minutes, the hot throw is fast and awsome but the life of the candle is shorten. I normally use 2 HTP104's for my 3" jars but some require 2 HTP093's.

[Beth-VT]

Just because you don't use zincs doens't mean your wick will fall over. If you're using tabbed wicks and they are adhered to the bottom of your container, your wicks should stay upright even with a deeper melt pool.

As for your original question, I think both of the above gals are right. Soy tends to burn down a bit, and then out to catch up the sides. The first thing you should do is determine your wick size based on the down then out issue. A 3" container should reach a full melt pool by around 3 hours, BUT this probably won't accur until about the third full burn or so so don't wick up or down until you've gotten that far. You can NOT (IMO) determine proper wick size on the first burn....unless you're seriously under/over wicked. Once you've determined you've got a proper wick size, yes, it's not uncommon with soy to reach deeper melt pools on longer burns. It doesn't necessarily mean you are overwicked, it just means that the heat generated down inside the container is transfering to the glass and is eventually spreading down the glass, thus contributing to the melting. You'll see this especially with tins cuz they heat much more quickly and the heat travels right down the sides. The size of your (properly trimmed wicks) flame is an important factor to determine wick size. HTH.

[Grannyscandles]

With a 1 inch melt pool on a long burn I still dont' think you would have a problem with the wick falling over. I use the CD wicks and have no trouble with that at all. I DO love the zinc wicks also though.

Blessings to you!

Teresa

[Dawn Blakey]

Just because you don't use zincs doens't mean your wick will fall over. If you're using tabbed wicks and they are adhered to the bottom of your container, your wicks should stay upright even with a deeper melt pool.

As for your original question, I think both of the above gals are right. Soy tends to burn down a bit, and then out to catch up the sides. The first thing you should do is determine your wick size based on the down then out issue. A 3" container should reach a full melt pool by around 3 hours, BUT this probably won't accur until about the third full burn or so so don't wick up or down until you've gotten that far. You can NOT (IMO) determine proper wick size on the first burn....unless you're seriously under/over wicked. Once you've determined you've got a proper wick size, yes, it's not uncommon with soy to reach deeper melt pools on longer burns. It doesn't necessarily mean you are overwicked, it just means that the heat generated down inside the container is transfering to the glass and is eventually spreading down the glass, thus contributing to the melting. You'll see this especially with tins cuz they heat much more quickly and the heat travels right down the sides. The size of your (properly trimmed wicks) flame is an important factor to determine wick size. HTH.

Thank you so much, the information you have given is very welcome. I did think that ordinary wicks would be ok, but read somewhere that only zinc wicks are suitable for containers. So how does one determine the wick size for a candle when starting from scratch? Is there a universal type of wick? There seem to be so many different types and numbers..... I can get cotton square braided wick locally will this do for pillars and container in soy? The problem I have is that I am in rural UK and it's not easy to get supplies. Ordering from the USA would be great but the import duties make it just far too expensive.

So sorry for the barrage of questions but I am afraid the candle bug has bitten me lol..... this is made even harder by the fact that I am under house arrest at the moment for at least another month Boo hoo...

The only thing keeping my spirits up at the moment is the theory learning...

Thanks again

DawnUK

[Grannyscandles]

Here is a link to the Atkins and Pearce website that shows all the wicks they sell and the melt pools and consumptions rates. It is an indispensable tool for us all.

http://www.wicksunlimited.com/atkins_pearce_htp_wicks.php

You can choose the kind of wicks you want to use and then look and see which one creates the size melt pool appropriate for your container. Takes some of the guess work out of choosing a wick.

HTH's.

Teresa

[Dawn Blakey]

Here is a link to the Atkins and Pearce website that shows all the wicks they sell and the melt pools and consumptions rates. It is an indispensable tool for us all.

http://www.wicksunlimited.com/atkins_pearce_htp_wicks.php

You can choose the kind of wicks you want to use and then look and see which one creates the size melt pool appropriate for your container. Takes some of the guess work out of choosing a wick.

HTH's.

Teresa

Thank you so much for that link. I am learning a lot from you guys!!!!

Dawn

[Grannyscandles]

You are quite welcome. Glad I could assist.

[funnygirl]

Dawn, you may also want to check out the ECO wicks. They are made for soy wax, and I have been hearing some great reviews on them. I ordered some Friday, so I will see how they work for me.

HTH

Brandy

[Dawn Blakey]

Dawn, you may also want to check out the ECO wicks. They are made for soy wax, and I have been hearing some great reviews on them. I ordered some Friday, so I will see how they work for me.

HTH

Brandy

Thanks Brandy, that's very helpful I will definitely look at those when I am better. I look forward to hearing how your results turn out.

Dawn

[scottopus]

I would say that a properly wick container candle after a three hour burn would have a complete or almost complete edge to edge melt pool with a depth of at least 1/4" but not deeper than 1/2". It seem to me that soy burns down first then out. If the candle still has some hang up after the thrid burn, I do another test with a wick one size larger. Another key point is how hot the container is to the touch, flame height, and how quickly you get a edge to edge melt pool. I would choose the smallest wick the meets the criteria for melt pool after a 3 hour burn.

[Dawn Blakey]

I would say that a properly wick container candle after a three hour burn would have a complete or almost complete edge to edge melt pool with a depth of at least 1/4" but not deeper than 1/2". It seem to me that soy burns down first then out. If the candle still has some hang up after the thrid burn, I do another test with a wick one size larger. Another key point is how hot the container is to the touch, flame height, and how quickly you get a edge to edge melt pool. I would choose the smallest wick the meets the criteria for melt pool after a 3 hour burn.

Thank you, that's very helpful..

Dawn

[SheilaW]

Dawn, if you email Atkins and Pearce and tell them the size of the container you plan on using and the wax they will probably ( not sure about their shipping out of country but it's worth a try ) send you some free samples. When I first started out using the palm wax they sent me an incredible amount of free wicks on several occasions, they even called me to discuss my wicking problems and made good suggestions. Excellent company.

I think it's great that you are doing so much research before getting your feet wet so to speak. Once you get started you will be glad you did. I made the mistake of just jumping in head first and ordering at least 15 different waxes, wicks, fo's and tried to do pillars and containers and votives. Spent way too much money and wasted a lot of time. So you are doing it the smart way. Sorry about the surgery enforcing it though.

[Dawn Blakey]

Dawn, if you email Atkins and Pearce and tell them the size of the container you plan on using and the wax they will probably ( not sure about their shipping out of country but it's worth a try ) send you some free samples. When I first started out using the palm wax they sent me an incredible amount of free wicks on several occasions, they even called me to discuss my wicking problems and made good suggestions. Excellent company.

I think it's great that you are doing so much research before getting your feet wet so to speak. Once you get started you will be glad you did. I made the mistake of just jumping in head first and ordering at least 15 different waxes, wicks, fo's and tried to do pillars and containers and votives. Spent way too much money and wasted a lot of time. So you are doing it the smart way. Sorry about the surgery enforcing it though.

Thanks Sheila,

That's very helpful advice, I will email the company and ask their advice.

I would normally do what you did, buy loads of different combinations and then PLAY!!!! That's what I did when I started making soap. At least this operation has kept my feet on the ground lol..

Dawn