HayCreekCandles Posted February 3, 2013 Share Posted February 3, 2013 Okay, so we have been tossing around the idea of a booth in a farmers market for years now, but unfortunately there aren't many around here locally that don't already have well established candle vendors (handpoured I might add) and I wouldn't touch the markets that do. However, today my mom and I decided to take a trip to one market in particular near my work that is a indoor/outdoor year round market. We are walking around checking things out....so far so good no other candle vendors anywhere...hmmm. Seemed strange but okay. There was ONE "store" that took up 1/4 of the end of a whole wing, like this womans booth fee had to be enormous...she was your average primitive country store, everything she has is resale, most of it I recognized from CDM Wholesale, no votives the only jars she had were Keeper of the Light. So my mom and I are walking through this place checking things out and she's watching us like a hawk. I swear some people just have a sense for scoping out another crafter lol. After about 5 minutes of staring us down comes up to us and stands right behind me and says if you need help with anything just let me know. I felt like asking her if she was planning on crawling up my butt as close as she was....anyway so we after we ventured through the rest of the market and antique section we found one decent size stall that was empty...yay I'm thinking it's available. i find the office and ask about it. The womans tells me it's 185 a month, and right now they are waiting to hear back from someone whether or not they are taking but they should know in a week and if not then it's available. she basically said hey if you have the deposit money it's yours. Didn't ask what I do or planned on selling. Okay...so we go home application in hand, and all the while discussing pros and cons. Finally I decide to call them and find out whether or not I can just go ahead and put a deposit on it. I get the same woman I talked to when I was there. I said to her " HI I was just there a few hours ago and I got an application from you for the empty booth" She said yes. I asked her if it was her I spoke to and she said yes. I asked her again just to confirm about the other person who may be taking the booth, if they put a desposit on it or what the deal is. she said yes they did but we are waiting to hear if they are definetly taking it. I said okay so they basically have first dibbs then right? She said yes, so then I asked her whether they could let me know if the guy takes it. I said to her at the store has anyone else inquired about it and she told me no. So then on the phone she pauses and says wait what is it that you want to sell? I explained that I have a hndpoured candle business we have been in business since 2004 blah blah blah.........she pauses........"Well, you can fill out the application and fax it back or drop it off but the owner is very selective of what is allowed to be sold here." ??? Where did this come from.......I said okay well that's fine...we walked around and there were no other candle vendors.....She responds "Oh no there are plenty of candles down at C------ M--------'s" (the primitive store I was telling you about). I said "oh you mean S------ R-------'s store?", she says "yes that one. All I can say is you can fill out the application and send it in, but there's a wait list". !!!!! (Now there's a wait list???) Low and behold people the woman running this store is the owner of the farmers markets wife..And I wondered why there was no other candle OR home decor vendors.....END RANT Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FaithfulScenter Posted February 3, 2013 Share Posted February 3, 2013 Unfortunetly, that sounds about right Hopefully you'll find somewhere to sell that you'll love. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
emilyspoppy Posted February 3, 2013 Share Posted February 3, 2013 (edited) I've been selling in Flea and or Farmer's markets since 1997 on a full time basis.My dad was a part-time dealer and I traveled with him as far back as my first recollections of life.I'm now 63, so I guess I've been involved with this venue for over 55 years.We now have one of the larger shops in our county's Farmer's Market. We have been in a permanant shop for over 10 years. We have been selling at this market for close to 15 years. At first we set up in an outside pavillion. Our best sales were "outside". $1000 in sales per Saturday was average. Rent was $35 per space when we began and is now $40 per space. We had two spaces. For quite a while we were also open on Wednesdays. The rent covered both days. We always recovered the rent along with other fixed and variable expenses on Wednesday's. I have done as much as $2000 in sales on a Saturday in February! It was an unusually pleasant "spring like" day. We did not sell candles at out outside location. We were in clover!Virtually every conceivable thing you could think of will impact a venders sales in a Flea/Farmer's market. Location within the market is a most critical factor. I've spent a lot of time noticing how one part of a market can get very little customer "traffic" while other parts appear to be located on a golden highway.Many times customers who are willing to shop outside, simply will not enter an enclosed shop. Our sales were reduced by 60% the very first week when we moved inside. If you do not believe me, I understand! I still have a hard time believeing it myself. Our old outdoor spot of five years is within a stones throw of our present shop. I see it everytime I look out of one of our two glass doors. Our shop is heated in the winter and we have A/C in the summer. We have a free coffee/punch and cookie bar and a rest area for the hubbies and others who do not share their significant other's penchant for what we sell.We still have a shopper or two regularly claim they remember us from "outside" but thought we had gone out of business. They then ask us how long we have been in our inside shop. It is really unbelievable! Despite a very large lighted sign and a number of colorful banners, we still remain unnoticed by many old and loyal customers.I'm offerring this as the best advice I can. REALLY get to know the whole market as well as you can. Ask as many questions as you are comfortable with asking of venders who seem to be established there. Not all will be willing to divulge information or be truthful with you, but you should be intuative enough to know when to disregard what they are telling you if anything seems evasive or "fishy". Remember too, that many of the people selling in this venue may not have that much business savvy.Proceed slowly and with great caution, unless you are willing to lose some serious money. I have quite a lot of moola tied up in fixtures, displays, neon lights, wall covering (slatwall) and many other items that I will never recover my costs on, if I find I can no longer operate in the financial environment we now find ourselves in. Just last week a vender of 12 years, a shop away from us, turned over her keys to the manager of the market.I regret the day that I decided to go indoors on a permanant basis. Each year our sales continue to plummet. I keep accurate records. I note the weather and temperature, sales by category and anything I find important on the day we are open. Our rent is similar to what you were quoted. We pay $200 per month per shop. We have two shops. We are losing money now. We watch our savings evaporate as we continue to shell out more than we take in. We sell items other than candles, but I'm ashamed to admit that we sold only $25 in candles in our shop during the month of January. We were closed one day due to snow and poor weather did affect the other days we were open, but I find our situation to be unbelieveable.It's not just us, either! My wife reported to me yesterday, that over half of the market is now free of venders. It took me a year of waiting to get a permanant outdoor site. It was four years from the time I requested one until I got a permanent shop. Under the table money was involved. I moved into a shop when the previous owner told me that they were going to have to move out due to her husband finding out he was terminally ill. She told me, before she told the manager. We went to the office together. That's how it's often done. It stinks, but it works.I feel there are many factors involved in what has for us reached a crisis state, but it would take too long to elaborate.It may be a blessing that you were not able to rent the space at your market. I'm assuming it might be near "Green Dragon" or some other PA. market. I'd really try and do some serious on site research, before I committed myself to open a shop again.Each market is unique, but I have not found even one that didn't have several levels of "politics" and favoritism to have to deal with. I have honestly sold at over a dozen different markets. The market we are now in was the best of them while we were outside.If it were not for our wholesale accounts and some excellent customers who call in their orders, we would be having a major candle supplies "yard sale" instead of selling fragrant candles.What I have posted is my opinion based on our circumatances. Your situation may be much different.JMO/HTHI wish you the very best of luck!Dave Edited February 3, 2013 by emilyspoppy Deleted a repeated sentence. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HayCreekCandles Posted February 3, 2013 Author Share Posted February 3, 2013 emilyspoppy....thanks for the advice. We did decide to just stick to our craft shows and customer orders for now. The market does have outside pavilions for warmer weather to rent spaces so that is always an option. we considered green dragon too, but the market I am referring to is in kutztown (renningers). I didn't want to put it out there but to be honest I really don't care at this point. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PAgirl89 Posted February 3, 2013 Share Posted February 3, 2013 emilyspoppy....thanks for the advice. We did decide to just stick to our craft shows and customer orders for now. The market does have outside pavilions for warmer weather to rent spaces so that is always an option. we considered green dragon too, but the market I am referring to is in kutztown (renningers). I didn't want to put it out there but to be honest I really don't care at this point.Yeah Renningers is pretty much covered by Sharon and her candles. I heard now she has her own shop in somewhere in Kutztown. My parents have had an indoor display (monuments) for the past 30 years at Renningers. They do have the big extravaganzas a couple times a year but I think a lot of it is antiques and not so much craft. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
emilyspoppy Posted February 3, 2013 Share Posted February 3, 2013 My cousin, Marilyn Bookman, was married to a long-term former Mayor of Kutztown, of many years past. "Bookie" Bookman was, as I recall, a very nice man. I lost touch with Marilyn and her family eons ago. They had three kids. A little boy and a baby daughter passed away from "CF". The eldest son, Glenn, who is close to my age, if still alive, inherited the recessive "CF" gene. It was a tragic situation for their family. I still think of them often.I've been to Kutztown many times and to Renninger's several times, but never set up there to sell. I remember both it and the Grenn Dragon seemed like busy markets, but it's been decades since I've been to either. My father sold at both from time to time. He told me he always did well at them as an outside vender. He died in 1991 near Chadds Ford, PA.I wish you the very best for your business.Dave Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HayCreekCandles Posted February 3, 2013 Author Share Posted February 3, 2013 Yea I pretty much figured that out after that conversation I had on the phone. Pa Girl you must be near me then? I just figured none of her stuff is handpoured like mine so it shouldn't matter, there are plenty of other places like Zern's for example where several vendors sell candles. Abundascents at Zerns is the major candle store there and they have been there for years, but they still let others rent booths with candles regardless. I have seen them. I guess it's different when you are the one with the store and you own the place.???? oh well, it's all good I was just slightly upset at the time and a little shocked but I'm over it now. LOL!!! thanks for listening everyone! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PAgirl89 Posted February 3, 2013 Share Posted February 3, 2013 Yep I am not too far from you. I sent you a private message. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HayCreekCandles Posted February 4, 2013 Author Share Posted February 4, 2013 I got it! Lol Sorry I will reply back to you PAgirl! I see you found me on fb too! Do you have a page? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PAgirl89 Posted February 4, 2013 Share Posted February 4, 2013 I got it! Lol Sorry I will reply back to you PAgirl! I see you found me on fb too! Do you have a page?Yep I have a Facebook too!http://www.facebook.com/pages/JS-Homespun-Creations/163418423669880 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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