birdcharm

7 hours ago, ichie said:

I am trying out making perfume oils with Fragrance Oil 30% + Carrier Oil 70% for my Roll on Perfumes.  I find that it doesn't last very long before I need to re-apply.

How can I increase the projection and longevity of my Oil perfume?

I'd like to make these sometime.  What is the fragrance oil you are using and what carrier oil?  I would think fractionated coconut or jojoba would be good, but I haven't done much reading about it.

I think some people also use spatulas or slotted spoons ... they all work at moving around the liquid sufficiently to incorporate the fragrance oil with the melted wax.  I don't mean to be rude to those who have been trying to blend with a skewer or other thin instrument, as I know they are shown repeatedly on tutorials, etc., but that's just not the right tool for the job.

On 10/15/2022 at 9:36 PM, KaciC said:

How long are you mixing in the FO for?

I see on this old thread that the info given for temperatures could be inaccurate ... at least I think so!  For instance, heating to 185dF and cooling down to almost cloudy or cloudy seems to work better with C-3.  Regarding your question, I remove the wax from the heat source and add scent at around 175dF, stirring in a circular motion with a large spoon (*not a stick* !!!)  😉 ... for a minute or so, then again for less than a minute a few times before pouring.

16 hours ago, kec91 said:

Yes! Since ~16 of the candles burned without issue for that fragrance, and just one mushroomed, I was wondering if there might be something less common for me to look for though.

I agree, it could be a matter of stirring more frequently; just before pouring and especially mid-way through the process as well as near the end.  I've always thought it's best to stir well at the start, then lightly here & there throughout the process of cool down (i.e., soy wax) or once again prior to pouring.

What is the brand name of the wax and what is the percentage of stearic acid that you're adding? 

I've used your wax in the past and I can't recall ever having a sink hole issue with it, but I use traditional style wicks and not wooden ones.  I suppose you could try leaving space at the top in order to do a repour (top pour, second pour ... whatever you wish to call it!) until you can figure it out.  I have a feeling it may have something to do with the wick in some way ... have you tried pouring one with another wick style?

One issue that seems difficult might be residue on the glass if trying to switch the wick within the same container.  I think I would try slowly melting the candles on an oven tray with temp. under 150dF until they soften, dump it all into a melting pot and melt it all together very slowly, pouring into clean containers.  I wouldn't bring the temperature up to the usual as when using fresh wax, however; maybe try one and see what happens.

As a follow up to this, I found that out of the ones I tested, I prefer HTP-31 for these.  The RRD-29 was too big for my taste, as is CD-5; HTP-41 is okay, but still a little on the large side imo.

To add to graph above for reference:

HTP – 31     0.10     0.76   1.31

ECO 0.5      0.11     1.1      2.0
ECO 0.75    0.12     0.6      2.1
CD-2           0.13     1.2      1.7

CD-3           0.14     1.4      1.9

8 hours ago, Ernie said:

Downside is midway through the candle the wax is ugly because of the wood wick ash.

I'm not sure of all the reasons why I have stayed away from wooden wicks, probably because I like regular wicks.  Maybe I like that traditional wicks are kind of dainty looking and I find the wood wicks to have more a rustic look, and because of what you've noted.  I'm sure in certain areas it's the trendy thing, but I personally seem to be stuck on fiber wicks, but don't exactly know why!

So, here's what I've found out (so far) and I would personally stay away from any f/o's that have certain musks included if I was going to use it for anything that rinses off, but for candles, it's probably not an issue.  As for candles with labels saying they are "eco-friendly" and have musk listed as a scent, I'm not sure they know that this is a conflict in their labeling.  Anyway, there is a family of musk type that is not considered as non-biodegradable as the others, called macrocyclic musks.  Other types seem to all have issues with bioaccumulation and ecotoxicity.  (Galaxolide, tonalide, and cashmeran appear to be the most damaging.)

I've made only a few small batches, but I didn't use wick pins in my metal molds.  After my wax was poured, I waited for the surface to form a bit of a "skin" and then sunk the wicks till they touched the bottom, it took a little practice, but it works nicely.  The bottom of the wick tab catches the partially-cooled wax and glues itself down.  This is fine for votives since they get placed in a votive glass and the wick is not fastened to the container anyway.

9 hours ago, Lizzy said:

These were made using a rustic cold pour with 1343 back in the days in 2008 or 2009....sigh....how I miss the old time candlemaking. LOL

Seems like it was less complicated back then

 

I love that rustic look!  Those are great!

I'm trying to figure out the differences in musks ... are all synthetic musks a substance that does not biodegrade? 

Also, in looking around websites here & there, I see candles being sold as, for instance, "biodegradable, eco-friendly" (etc.) ... and when you see the scent description, there is musk listed.  I'm pretty sure it's synthetic musk, so this is kind of strange, unless there are some musks that ARE eco-friendly, but I've yet to figure that out and I've tried to research it a bit, but I'm still confused.  So, if anyone knows the differences and would like to discuss, please do!

5 hours ago, BenderSF said:

Thanks @birdcharm!  It's a great suggestion for someone who has more skill blending than I do.  I've tried blending before.  I am......not good at it.  😆

I understand completely ... it takes more work than most people probably think!  I do okay here and there, sometimes I actually make something that I never thought I'd get, but it can take setting the bottle down and not smelling it for about a month!

Just to share something I recently accidentally did ... I've come extremely close to making a dupe of an old Avon scent I used to like called "Come Summer" -- I got some samples in and there were a few I didn't like, but they were all rather compatible, so I poured them all into a larger bottle and added something else I thought went with it.  Then, I blended something else in there because I thought it would go with it and after closing it all up and smelling it the next day, I couldn't believe my nose!  It's not exactly that scent, but I have an old bottle with a little remnant in the bottom to compare and I've come extremely close!  Hey!  Maybe you should pour all those samples together and see what you get!!  🤭

13 hours ago, BenderSF said:

Has anyone found a dupe of Yankee's Mountain Lodge?  C&S used to carry one but discontinued it before I could try.  The Candlemaker's Store has one but it's not even vaguely similar to the original.  I've collected a lot of lodge/cabin/woodsy scents in the hopes of finding something at least similar, but no luck.

 

I'm surprised it's not more popular.

I'm not familiar with the scent, but I'm wondering if you compared what you already purchased and tried to note what might be missing if you could work with one of them to blend it yourself ...?

To add this here for anyone's reference -- here are some of the wick comparisons, just to confuse the issue!

ROC (oz/hr)     Flame Height (inches)     Pool Diameter

ECO 1         0.14   1.30    2.20

HTP – 41     0.11   0.84    1.41

HTP – 52     0.13   0.96    1.50

HTP – 62     0.15   1.01    1.60

RRD 29       0.13   1.10    1.80

RRD 34       0.19   1.30     2.00

CD – 5         0.18   1.60    1.90

Thank you all for the recommendations!  I'm just about getting ready to get into this, so I'll see how it goes.  For now I gave up looking for the taller (3/4") cups since I would have had to create an order around them to make it worth the shipping.  So, I just picked up some 1/2" cups that were sent First Class.  I've got CD5 on-hand, so I'm going to use that for starters.  It makes sense that a CD5 works with C3 as TallTayl noted if a CD3 works with GB464.  I think I have some smaller HTPs that I received as a sample once, I'll look for them.  It's not a really big deal (they're tealights!), but still, best to use what works the smoothest. 

It might be a good wax for making whipped cream for dessert candles.  😊

6 hours ago, TallTayl said:

Many beautiful fragrances use resins. I have a few with vanilla type notes that “throw crystals” when cool.  They need to be heated, shaken and used quickly.  One particular custom blend had to be heated to nearly boiling before adding to the wax,  what a pain.  So many resins can be used, but beware of how they may not blend perfectly without some gymnastics. Some resins clog or otherwise gunk up wicking.  Frankincense comes to mind here.  Those sometimes just need different wick series.

 

tonka, I’ve only used FO. The coumarin in it seems to be what is not advised for consumption.  Cou,rain is also in uncontrolled spices like cinnamon so i hake my head. Other countries rely on tonka as a flavoring component, but I don’t have the safety of it in a candle confirmed. 
 

ETA: I have never found any documents that advise not using coumarin in candles or skin products in the US.

I'm thinking that a small amount of absolute would be okay in regard to candle performance, but I'm really not sure about resins, the more I think about it.  In regard to coumarin, I think the toxicity problem occurs if digested in large amounts.

~~~

I found an article in regard to tonka bean in perfumery that I think is interesting ... (link to full article)

"Baked cherries, almonds, sweet hay, cloves, vanilla and caramel… The aroma of tonka beans, the seeds from the fruits of the Dipteryx Odorata tree native to South America, has a fascinating complexity and richness. An important note in a perfumer’s palette, tonka bean absolute (and its main component coumarin) lends fragrances a unique facet. The oriental genre in perfumery is inconceivable without the candied almond and vanilla note of tonka ..."

"While the USA has banned the use of coumarin as a flavor since 1953, many countries in Europe still allow it. In fact, when tonka beans or coumarin are described as tobacco-like, it has do to with the reverse association—tonka tincture has been used extensively to flavor cured tobacco leaves and pipe tobacco blends. In the course of my own experiments with tonka beans as a flavor, I find that the combination of tonka bean and chocolate is ambrosial, with the spicy almond flavor complementing the bitterness of cocoa. I also like to add a pinch of ground tonka bean to dishes containing cherries because it brings out their luscious aroma."

Can someone fill me in if a slight addition of either of these would adversely affect how a candle burns?  I've seen it commented that diluted resins should not be added to a candle scent as it may not burn well, even in small amounts.  Yet, I have also seen the addition of diluted resin as a component included in some scents available.  What do you think? 

My other question is about absolutes ... for instance, Tonka Bean ... should this never be added to a fragrance oil, or is it okay?

On 8/21/2022 at 12:25 PM, TallTayl said:

The soy lobby really got their money’s worth with the all natural campaign, didn’t they?

 

 

It's not only them, however, on the consumer level, we seem to have a lot of people who do not seem equally concerned about what they are using from one substance to the next, and unfortunately, some candle makers are trying to comply, but it's fruitless.  (A person who commonly uses spray air fresheners, heavy perfumes, hair spray, etc. shouldn't care so much about asking about the fragrance oil in their candle!)

On 8/21/2022 at 12:25 PM, TallTayl said:

Just make a candle that burns safely and makes people happy.

I agree!!

1 hour ago, TallTayl said:

How much about soy candles is truly natural anyway? Hexane is used to extract the oily bits  from the soy beans. Round up, Anhydrous ammonia and similar chemicals are used to grow the beans. Hydrogenation through a nickel or similar catalyst is used to turn the solvent extracted oil  into a wax like product. Synthetic fragrances and various lab produced aroma chemicals are used to produce scented candles. 

That's all true.  Yet, soy "wax" is grouped together in the marketing arena as being one of the eco-friendly waxes.  I guess it's all a matter of what the consumer expects or doesn't expect, or if the labeling states some aspects of the additives.  Since there is already that going on in the sense of marketing as "phthalate free" (for instance), then it is giving a message that the candle's ingredients have been considered to not have too many additives that might be considered on the "un-natural" side, although we all know that there is no way to completely escape it.

As for UV inhibitor, I've had paraffin candles I've kept unburned for decoration for decades and they are hardly faded.

4 hours ago, TallTayl said:

When reading hazard warnings, it is very helpful to know the “doses”. “It’s not the poison, it’s the dose” comes to mind.  In that vein, is the hazard for ingesting it, or is the hazard snorting pounds of it raw 24/7?  ....
 

 

Most likely, the substance being present in a candle doesn't pose much risk.  It's the repeated handling & exposure that needs to be considered and how it's handled.  As for it being used in candles that are presented on the "natural" end of the scale with all those things that go with that, the addition of something like this seems to not be a good fit in a way.

I know this isn't going to be a popular post, but I don't like working with UV inhibitors.  I'm not sure if the one (292) is suitable for candles or not, but when I looked it up, I did see some notes about it that makes me uncomfortable.  For crafters using natural waxes, I'm not sure about this as an additive due to the nature of the substance.  I don't know much about it, but every time I go out to read something about it, I end up reading a lot of hazard warnings.

Quote

May cause an allergic skin reaction [Warning Sensitization, Skin]
Suspected of damaging fertility or the unborn child [Warning Reproductive toxicity]
Very toxic to aquatic life [Warning Hazardous to the aquatic environment, acute hazard]
Very toxic to aquatic life with long lasting effects [Warning Hazardous to the aquatic environment, long-term hazard]
Hazardous to the aquatic environment, acute hazard

(source)

16 hours ago, LilFirecracker said:

It's more of a soft floral scent than one of those Fresh Linen or Clean Cotton scents. Cotton Blossom is actually one component in Yankee's Clean Cotton, but I would've never thought it was. I don't pick it up, but others might. Hmmm...makes me wonder how B&BW was able to trademark a name of a real flower. Hell I need to go look. It might not even be trademarked! I just assumed since normally they're all trademarked. Even if it's not, I'm still renaming it. 

I've been under the impression that designer scent dupes can be used with the name of the scent as long as it has "type" at the end of the name.  I could be wrong about that, but that's what I've assumed anyway.