Help with this recipe please

[PurpleHippie]

I have a gallon of Rice Bran oil that will expire in 3 months so I am trying to use it all up. My skin seems to be very sensitive to Coconut oil so I am trying different recipes using very little CO and increasing % to see what I can tolerate. Hard to beat CO for cleasing. I also find that high% of palm are irritating to my skin.

The recipe is a 4lb batch.

Coconut Oil 12%

Palm Kernel 20%

Rice Bran 50%

Castor Oil 13%

Mango Butter 5%

Water % of oils -38

Superfat - 5

Water 689.46 grams(24.32 ounces)

Lye 249.16 grams(8.79 ounces)

Hardness 39

Cleansing 21

Conditioning 55

Bubbly 32

Should it be harder?

I belive the #'s for Rice Bran are very close to Crisco and since I won't be able to get Rice Bran locally I'll be switching to Crisco when needed in the future.

I appreciate your suggestions and opinons:smiley2:

[BekkaF]

From a personal viewpoint, you mentioned your skin doesn't tolerate palm or coconut oil very well. I'd like to ask, have you tried palm kernal flakes in place of coconut oil??? I have eczema and tolerate palm kernal flakes very well. If I use coconut oil, I have to stop at roughly 20%, and I take a lye amount of 6% superfat. It does nicely for me ; ) Although I love RBO in soaps, I would still drop it down a tad and add half in Olive Oil. Another good oil for sudsing action is sesame oil; the more refined kind made by spectrum that doesn't have a scent to it. Sesame oil is easily found in health food store, or if you have a super grocery store like Wegman's with a health food section. I don't use that high of a %age of castor oil. I use right around 2.5%. On another board a chemist tested out castor oil in CP at different percentages and found the higher the percentage of Castor Oil added after 5% actually dampens lather. Might make your recipe a bit soft too. You can boost the hardening factor by using some shea butter, paiy-na butter and optionally maybe an ounce or two of cocoa butter. Also, crisco for me does irritate my skin. It makes a wonderful soap for most, but I have had more than one person tell me they itch when using those bars. Not sure if it is the additives to keep shortening white, ie BHT, but I dropped it for that reason. I still miss those shortening pours and love the way I could swirl in those batches ; )

Huggs, Bekka

[CareBear]

I find that different foks seem to have difficulty with different oils - my skin (I have eczema too, though it's pretty much disappeared since using hand made soaps) loves crisco and I even do well with 30% coconut oils soaps as long as they are well balanced and have a 5-6% superfat.

I agree that you would want to drop the castor oil level - even 10% leaves my soaps soft and sticky except in really hard bars like my castile.

I've never soaped sesame oil - that sounds interesting.

BHT, by the way, is an antioxidant not a whitener - though I supposed rancid fats can turn funny colors so it may serve that purpose. As it's in most processed foods I would not think it likely that it's the culpret unless there are food allergy issues as well. But anything is possible and everyone is different.

[CBE]

I personally love a high % of castor in my soaps. But I usually don't go over 10%... with the exception of one soap I recently made for a swap... I went up to 18% (it was an experiment). As for the hardness... add sodium lactate to your water before you add your lye. I usually add about a tablespoon. You'll see a difference right away! Softer recipes get harder quicker, and you're able to cut alot sooner.

As for your recipe, I think it's perfect like it is! But if you're looking to up your hardness numbers, try dropping down your RBO and adding more mango...

[PurpleHippie]

So I see I am not the only one that has skin irritations with CO.:undecided Thanks for the help and the great suggestions.

I haven't tried Palm Kernel Flakes in place of coconut. I'll have to experiment with that. Several years ago I tested a soap that made my skin itch like crazy. I was told that it had a high percentage of palm. I can't remember the exact amount that was in that soap so I've just tried to keep it low. Maybe without the CO it won't have the same ichy results.:smiley2: Thanks for the sesame oil tip! I'll compare my soap with the Crisco and without to see if if it irritates my skin.

Is it mainly Palm oil or Palm Kernel that tend to be irritating in higher amounts?

I love Castor Oil for the bubbles but I have had a few batches of soap recently that are very soft. So much so that I was thinking I should have just made soap balls with them. I thought maybe the humid weather we are having had something to do with it. I'll try one with a lower % of Castor Oil and see if that makes a difference. 2.5% seems very low. Does that small amount still produce enough bubbles?

Is there any other place besides Lotion Crafters that have sodium lactate? They have a min. order requirement and I don't need anything else from them.

[Meridith]

I don't like a high % of CO either so I use it in combination with babassu. Have you tried babassu?

[eugenia]

Coconut Oil 12%

Palm Kernel 20%

Rice Bran 50%

Castor Oil 13%

Mango Butter 5%

Water % of oils -38

Superfat - 5

Water 689.46 grams(24.32 ounces)

Lye 249.16 grams(8.79 ounces)

Hardness 39

Cleansing 21

Conditioning 55

Bubbly 32

I agree with the others, you need drop the castor to 5-10%. IMO, your base recipe does not have enough hard oils, which should be 50% or more.

Coconut Oil 12%

Palm Kernel 20%

Palm kernel is a cleansing oil. Palm oil is totally different. So far you have 32% hard oils. Mango butter brings you up to 37%.

Can you get some lard, crisco or palm for the other 13% hard oils?

5% castor will leave 45% for RBO.

Plugging those #'s in with 13% lard gives you

Hardness 43

Cleansing 21

Conditioning 50

Bubbly 25

Creamy Lather 27

With Crisco at 13%,

Hardness 41

Cleansing 21

Conditioning 52

Bubbly 25

Creamy Lather 25

13% Palm gives you

Hardness 44

Cleansing 21

Conditioning 50

Bubbly 25

Creamy Lather 28

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[Scented]

Is there any other place besides Lotion Crafters that have sodium lactate? They have a min. order requirement and I don't need anything else from them.

Could swear mine came from BCN.

[diamondk]

...

Is there any other place besides Lotion Crafters that have sodium lactate? They have a min. order requirement and I don't need anything else from them.

I believe I got mine from MMS.

[PurpleHippie]

Thanks again everyone for the help! I can use Crisco. I wanted to make one batch with and another without to see if the Crisco would cause any irritation. Haven't tried any babassu. I'll have to look into that and BC and WSP for the soduim lactate. So it is mainly the Palm Kernel that causes irritation?