ladydragon Posted July 29, 2007 Share Posted July 29, 2007 Hi guys...I'm hoping someone with some expertise in HP might be able to work out where I went wrong in my first HP batch...I got to trace no problem in the actual crock pot with it on the low setting...On went the lid and within ten minutes it was at the climbing out of the pot stage... I stirred it down and very shortly after that it turned into a kind of broken up dough - as if it was a biscuit or cookie dough that was waiting for a bit of extra water or milk to bring it together to shape before baking...And after that - well, it's just stayed at exactly the same consistency... ;-)A crock pot full of varying sized lumps of something that I definitely don't think is soap...lol It's just not moved onto the gelled or softer vaseline type stage I've read about in tutorials...I superfatted by 6% and I also added a tad more water than the actual recipe called for as I'd read this was a good idea due to the water 'cooking off' with the heat...I left the crock pot on a low heat for well over two hours hoping it would start to maybe break down and soften and start to get to a stirring consistency - but it's just not happened...I'd really like to move from CP to HP if possible - but I've obviously done something wrong here and before I repeat the whole experience it would be ever so helpful if I had an idea of how to avoid this happening again... If this batch is 'rescuable' in any way I'd also be grateful for any suggestions as to how to do that...Thanks in advance for any input you might have... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LovelyLathers Posted July 29, 2007 Share Posted July 29, 2007 Here is what I used when I learned hp. http://www.candletech.com/hpsoap/It sounds like it siezed on you. What fo did you use? Did you check to make sure it was soap safe? What recipe did you use. I never add more water then the recipe calls for. You must follow the recipe exactly. Playing around with adding things will cause problems plus could cause dangerous situations. With out knowing the recipe it could have also over heated, over cooked. As soon as you stirred it down you should have added your colorant and fo. Then plop it into the mold. I hope this helps you out. Don't give up keep trying and testing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ladydragon Posted July 30, 2007 Author Share Posted July 30, 2007 Thank you for your reply LovelyLathers...The recipe I used I ran through the Soapmaker software package:Olive Oil 375g (50%)Coconut Oil 188g (25%)Shea Butter 112g (15%)Avocodo Oil 75g (10%)Lye 103.6g (6% discount)Water 269.7g (5% increase)I increased the water as per a tutorial I'd read which recommended upping the water level by 5% to accommodate the heat of the HP process...I *would* have added some oatmeal and Oatmeal Milk & Honey skin safe oil from Indiana... Didn't actually get that far though - so there was no effect from FO being added...Re the water though - I've run the same recipe through the Sage Lye calculator and the allowance there for water is up to 281g which is in excess of the amount I put in - which I'd already increased over what the software had given...I suppose I stirred it down and was waiting for the applesauce/mashed potato phase - it went from trace to fluffed right up in ten minutes and then as soon as I'd started stirring it down it hit the lumpy doughy stage...The recipe has worked ok with CP - I figured it would be a nice alternative to using palm oil which some people can be a bit antsy about... But I have only tried it the once...Just wondering if it could be down to the water amount? Or the temperature of the pot? I kept on the low setting... Or even just that this combination of ingredients get to the moulding point miles ahead of some other recipes?Thank you ever so much for your help... ;-) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LovelyLathers Posted July 30, 2007 Share Posted July 30, 2007 I really can't help too much as I am bad at grams to ounces. I did a converter but I couldn't figure it out. I would say if it didn't sieze up then it probably over cooked. Try again. When it gets to the point of having to stir it down that should be the applesause stage, then when you stir it a few minutes it goes to a thicker mashed potato like consistancy. (If your crock pot is hot like mine even on low it takes less time then what they say).Turn off the crock pot and if you have a removable insert take it out. Add colorant and fo stir and but into the mold right away. See if that helps. MAybe someone who knows grams can check out you recipe but I see nothing theat would cause it to be a problem except that avocado does accelerate but 10% is not too much to cause it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CareBear Posted July 30, 2007 Share Posted July 30, 2007 I don't think HP "seizes" but I could be wrong. Basically you would just cook it through the seize...My HP is a complete disaster if I "discount" water - but others seem to be able to do it. Actually my HP isn't great no matter what. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ladydragon Posted July 31, 2007 Author Share Posted July 31, 2007 Thanks for your help...I gave it another go today and used the much higher water quantity on the M Sage calculator than that given by the soapmaker software...It went sweet as a nut - much faster than any of the tutorials I've read but it was pretty much by the book... ;-)The only muddle up I did make in the excitement of watching it like a hawk was not testing it on my tongue before moulding... It had definitely all gelled and gone through the apple sauce / mashed potato / thick mashed potato phase when I put the EO in and shoved it in the mould completely forgetting to tongue test first...So the next question - is there an alternate way of checking it's all ok? I can't say I'm really enthused with the idea of licking a bar of soap that's nicely fragranced with EO... ;-) Or given it's HP and it did everything it's supposed to do is it just ok to presume it'll have all saponified safely? I superfatted by 6%...I'd also be very grateful for any tips on how to get a smoother finish... It's demoulded now and although uncut it most definitely has a different look to my usual CP... Should it be moulded slightly earlier when it's softer or is there a secret way of getting the lumpy consistency to bind together more smoothly in the mould?Thank you all for sharing your experience... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LovelyLathers Posted July 31, 2007 Share Posted July 31, 2007 Glad it came out better for you. Hp is not as smooth as cp. When you put it in the mold slam it in the floor a few times. It will help it smooth out. As far as the tongue test I wait until after I unmold it and cut it.Doing it before it probably will be too hot to do it and also I would be afraid it would stay on my tongue being in a gel or liquid stage, Yuk!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sudsy Posted August 1, 2007 Share Posted August 1, 2007 Your HP will not be smooth like your CP. LovelyLathers is right, slam that puppy on the counter a few times to get the air out and make it as flat as possible.I tongue test before I scent and pour. I pull a bit out, blow on it to cool and tongue test.Congrats on a successful batch! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ladydragon Posted August 3, 2007 Author Share Posted August 3, 2007 Thank you all for your input...By the time I'd trimmed up the slices they didn't actually look too bad - fairly smooth in fact once the raggedy outside bits were taken off...Hubby and eldest daughter have quite warm hands and the trimmed bits when broken up actually mush together to make soap balls very easily - quite smooth if your hands are warm - ideal samplers I hope... ;-)I did tongue test it after it was all demoulded - no burning but my goodness, it sure does taste horrible...lolJust waiting now to see how long they take to harden up a bit - the bars are still feeling a tad soft - they'd be easy to take a chunk out of them with a finger nail...One thing that's strange though - it's a recipe that's worked well in CP - but it seems to have a much MUCH creamier lather using HP... It still bubbles the same - well enough for the kids to blow large bubbles through their fists (you can tell it's school holidays and their bored! lol) but it's an awful lot creamier - really lovely... Is that a normal 'side effect' of HP?Thanks again for your help...Ann-Marie x Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
katshe Posted August 4, 2007 Share Posted August 4, 2007 I have to say I tried cp hp once and it was interesting, lumpy soap and hard to scoop all into mold...soooo I found an alternative that I am still trying to master but am having better luck withits called in the mold hot process...give it a lookhttp://www.bellaonline.com/articles/art10361.aspMy batch today was nice and creamy with a few lumps but did pour into mold nicelyonly thing I do dofferently than bellonline is I set oven at 170 degrees.This method is so simple for me, I will always use ITMHP love it!!!I just melt oils and turn of to cool and mix lye/water and wait for both to reach 100 degrees and then mix lye in oils, my recipe seems to trace within about 15 min...then pour in prepared mold and into oven, wa la ...next day soap will be ready to cut.Just thought I'd throw that out there in case you wanted to try something different. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ladydragon Posted August 4, 2007 Author Share Posted August 4, 2007 Crumbs... It's different - but makes sense I suppose - forcing the normal process that occurs with CP in the mould more quickly with the heat - but not having to mould it when it's hit that lumpy stage...lolQuite intriguing! ;-)Have you had it fluffing up in the mould though the same way it can do in the crock pot with HP as it's being heated?Bit nervous about the idea of a towel in the oven...Silicone bakeware would be a pretty good option for the mould I'd imagine - that's what I've used with the HP and it doesn't need lining... I wasn't sure if the temperature of the HP might be a bit too much for my wooden CP moulds...Thanks for that bit of info Katshe... Definitely going to look into it a bit more and probably try it out... ;-)Ann-Marie x Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
katshe Posted August 4, 2007 Share Posted August 4, 2007 No problems and no bubbling over...I have a wooden mold hubby made an i made sure to rub it down with olive oil a couple of times so it wouldn't warp...i line my mold with those foam craft sheets cut to fit and I do use a towel on a cookie sheet just as directions say without any problems.I have a batch sitting in the oven now and it looks lovely, can't wait to take it out in the morn. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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