Other people's messes! (vent)

[shebrock]

If it didn't make me sooo mad, I would be amazed! It drives me crazy when I have to work 3 times as hard because someone else takes advantage or in this case, down right rips off a client!

I did a craft show last weekend, and had someone ask whether I did fundraisers and how I did them. I told him, yes I would do fundraisers and gave the specifics. He told me that last year their school (over 700 students) did a fundraiser with a candle maker who, 1. cheated them out of about 1000 candles, she delivered to school, and since no PTO people were not there, her argument was that she delivered what was ordered, PTO, had 10 different people count them out, her answer was that she delivered them all and if any were missing it happened there, eventhough the school placed them in a locked room where no one but the principal had the key. 2. Since the money was paid 100% up front, they couldnt hold up payment till all was accounted for. (those kids sold about 8000 candles) 3. She also made dipped bears for the fundraiser, didnt deliver all of them, the some of the PTO officers even had to go to her house to beg for the some of the other orders for customers who despirately needed them for presents! A couple of the bears she did deliver fell apart, candles were miss labeled, the list goes on and on.

I know that the PTO should have been more street smart and asked for promises in writing, but there still should be some integrety on the candle makers part to at least not steal from a bunch of kids raising money for their school. The PTO had to write dozens of refund checks and hardly had any money to show for the sales!!! What is worse, the people who voted for her to do the fundraiser, knew her personally and trusted her!

The guy that told me all this bought my candles, loves them, would love to do a fundraiser with me, but because of all this, he was afraid the PTO would not vote to do another fundraiser with a candlemaker. I gave him all the positives I could about how I could do better, he said he would help out all he could but couldnt promise anything.

This would be a huge sale for me, maybe even enough were I could quit work and work my business full time, I really hope that I can gain their trust with a contact or whatever it takes, Its just not fair!

Keep your fingers crossed. Ive been working on ideas for a week now, trying to ease their fears. Thanks for listening, sorry this was so long. Just needed to rant and rave a little.

[Ashleigh]

I would get a hold of someone and draw up a contract!

If they KNOW 100% they would get all their orders in full because they have you on a contract and enough sweet talking and easing fears were done... I bet you could get them to do it!!

Good luck!!

Ash

[shebrock]

Thanks for the encouragement Ashleigh.

I just can't get over ripping off kids! That blows me away.

Im going to work on that contract till Im sure that I have done the best I could to gain their trust. It's all I can do short of doing the fundraiser for them for free!

[sockmonkey]

First of all, I wish you luck in getting to do a fundraiser with them. If it was meant to be it will happen. If not, thank your lucky stars things turned out the way they did anyway, it could be fate's way of keeping a mistake from happening to you.

I say this, you might be the next candle maker he's going around badmouthing all over town. Do you only know one side of the story he's telling, or have you heard from the candle maker herself? There's always two sides to every story. It is entirely possible that this lady was a little con-artist, however, it is also possible that when you're dealing with hundreds of kids selling candles, as well as their parents getting involved, that mistakes can be made on the part of others, and it's always a lot easier to point fingers than to accept responsibility for failure.

The numbers he gave you regarding student sales sounds really stupendous. Seven hundred kids sold over 8000 candles--that averages over 11 candles per student. I know it's do-able, that just seems hard to believe. It's great if that's what they did, but I'm thinking what things were like when I was in school and had to sell things. Probably 20% of the kids did all the work. The rest were rather apathetic and couldn't care less if they sold an item or not.

This man you were talking to didn't happen to get any free samples from you did he?

[The_Dallas_Texas_Dean]

Hi Sherri!

Congratulations for the potential opportunity. You sound very excited about the possibility.

I would have to say that if the PTO held every Chandler now, and in the future, responsible for what one did to the extreme of not doing business with you, it would seem extremely shallow and in poor judgement on their part. I just can't even imagine that.It doesn't even make sense to me!

[sharyl55]

If the customers these kids sold all those candles to had a bad experience the next candle FR might not be as successful. It's a bummer to think one person could have ruined it for all future candle FRs. A solid contract that protects the PTO and you is a great start.

[shebrock]

Thanks Dallas_Texas_Dean for the congrats! I forgot to mention that I was invited by the same person to come and set up at their PTO Christmas Bazaar, no booth fee and contributions are encouraged but not mandatory, (you can bet I'm gonna give a percentage of sales to the pto) So maybe this along with what Im doing with the fundraiser will convince them. Keep your fingers crossed for me!

Sockmonkey, I appreciate your post, I should have mentioned that the person that approached me was the president of the PTO, the situation was so bad that they actually contacted the county attorney's office for advice, but decided it best not to persue legal action and write it off as a really bad experience so understandably, the same members of the pto that voted this person in for that fundraiser are now the ones who are concerned about doing another with a candle maker. Not just one of the parents whose kids sold for the fundraiser.

The reason the sales were so high, all the schools in the school system have 2 school wide fundraisers each per year and major competitions for prizes, a huge party for only those who sell the minimum. These schools have had some HUGE fundraisers in the past and 8000 is not at all unusual.

Got my work cut out for me, I'll be sure to keep ya posted!

[shebrock]

Sharyl55,

You're right, I have thought of that too. Can you imagine a kid trying to sell a candle only to be told no because of that other person? Its terrible.

I think it would be a good idea for the officials of the PTO to maybe send out a letter at least to the parents of the kids that participated last time and let them know too, that a contract is in place and hopefully that would be passed along to the customers as well.

Thanks

[gloworm]

Sockmonkey makes many very valid points. In addition to a contract to "protect" the school I would say you need to protect yourself. When delivering I would not leave the school until you did a hands on inventory with someone in charge and had a signed invoice that all was delivered. The numbers of candles sold seems phenomonal. She's also right that most kids do not sell. My son did a girl scout fundraiser and each child did average 10-12 candles but only a handful actually sold. It would be interesting to hear the candlemakers side of the story. When dealing with children or teens as the salesmen I would think that "mistakes" could very well happen. Hope all goes well for you.

[prairieannie]

I am inclined to see things from a skeptical view point as well. Be very very careful, and if you do end up doing this FR, take the above mentioned advice and be sure that there are several methods of keeping everyone accountable. There are just too many things here that seem like red flags to me, and I, too, would want to hear ALL sides of the story to include the candlemaker's side. If fundraisers this large are common place for this school, I would think that they would have the organization part down pat...and would have never left anything to chance (like the candle maker being able to deliver and leave without the candles being counted and receipted) but I guess maybe someone got complacent, or just didn't think that anyone would rip off a school. At any rate, be careful, and good luck if you get the deal.

[sockmonkey]

Well, if the Prosecutor's office didn't want to do anything about it, I would guess the PTO didn't have enough evidence to warrant them taking action.

Frankly, I question the integrity of the president himself, and I think you should too. This person is going around bashing the other candlemaker, and implying criminal conduct ocurred. Then he says she ruined any chances of them doing a candle fundraiser again, yet he's asking you if you do fundraisers and what your procedures are.

His entire story reeks. How could you not make money after selling 8000 candles? Did the school pay for them up front, or did the customer? If they lost money after selling that many candles, then they must have gotten a really lousy wholesale deal from her, and I would attribute that to the PTO president for making the decision to go with her. I don't know how long ago this incident happened, but I'm wondering why, if they just had a fundraiser selling candles, is he out buying more candles (not to insult your candles or anything)? Shouldn't he have supported the cause himself and purchased the other candles? Maybe he did. Maybe he was one who got stiffed by the 1000 shortage. (See, I always try to look at both sides of a story.)

[shebrock]

. Prairrieannie quote: If fundraisers this large are common place for this school, I would think that they would have the organization part down pat...and would have never left anything to chance (like the candle maker being able to deliver and leave without the candles being counted and receipted) but I guess maybe someone got complacent, or just didn't think that anyone would rip off a school. At any rate, be careful, and good luck if you get the deal.

I thought the same thing like I said before, these schools do HUGE FRs, its a monstrous job giving everything out once its time to deliver, but when you stop and think about other fundraiser companies, you know, cookie dough, those catalogs with the candy etc., when those things are shipped, they don't have a rep to come by and count out eveything out to make sure all is accounted for its pretty much done, if a disagreement, over the phone or email. I agree that some of this is the pto's fault for thinking that just because they knew this person, (and the pto as a group did vote her in just because it felt safe cause they knew her) that they didn't have to use common sense. You would think when dealing with this much money, all percautions would have been taken and nothing left to chance. You gave me some things to think about and I appreciate it. I will be careful if this works out.

I'd like to clarify something else from other posts, 1. I had a sign on my table "Fundraiser Inq. welcome", this guy had already bought my candles (no free samples), he asked me how I did things he only mentioned that they had had a bad experience before, I am the one who kept asking the questions, he didnt stop by my table and begin ranting. No one here would have done differently if a potentially large FR possibility hinged on whether you could do things differently, and the only way to know what needed to be done is to ask questions. He did not ask me to do the fundraiser, he said he would love to see me get it cause he liked my candles, but, said he didn't know if the pto would vote for it or not. He doesn't have the power to decide by himself.

2. About the County Attorney's office, I only said that the pto consulted that office, the pto did not persue, not that there wasn't enough evidence to press charges. The principal of the school did not want to go thru with it because, since the schools here have to have school board approval to do a fr, something like this could cause them to do away with them completely.